30-07-2003 17:28									#1
	Pre-thread for polls about options Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Hi all,

as we might want to run a DG for MoO2, I though let's start a threat for just verifying the options before starting a poll (I just can't remember in the moment and I also can't recall where my copy is.......)

AFAIR we have:

Size:
Small
Average
Large
Huge


Diversety: (?)
Organic Rich
Mineral Rich


Dfficulty: (?)
hard
impossible (1 suggestion)


Starting position:
Pre-warp
????
????

Number of Oponents:
1 till 8(?)


Version:
1.2
1.31


Race picks:
Population Growth:-50%/+50%/+100%
Costing: -4/3/6

Food: -1/2/+1/+2 per farmer.
Costing: -3/4/7

Production: -1/+1/+2 per worker.
Costing: -3/3/6

Science: -1/+1/+2 per scientist.
Costing: -3/3/6

Taxation per Population: -1/2 BC/+1/2 BC/+1 BC
Costing: -4/5/8

Ship Defense: -20/+25/+50
Costing: -2/3/7

Ship Offense: -20/+20/+50
Costing:-2/2/4

Ground Combat: -10/+10/+20
Costing:-2/2/4

Spying: -10/+10/+20
Costing:-3/3/6

Government:
Feudal/Dictatorship/Democracy/Unification
Costing: -4/0/7/6

then the others:
Low G HW: -5
HG HW: +6
Aquatic: +5
Subterranean: +6
LHW:+1
RHW:+2
PHW:-1
AHW:+3
Cybernetic:+4
Lithovore:+10
Repulsive:-6
Charasmatic:+3
Uncreative:-4
Creative:6/8(depending on version and whether or not this is modded)
Tolerant:+10
Fantastic Traders:+4
Telepathic:+6
Lucky:+3
Omniscient:+3
StealthyShips:+4
TransDimensional:+5
Warlord:+4

Anything else I missed?

Please let me know if you remember, what I missed

You might want to express your wishes maybe already hear.......

Last edited by Gilgamensch on 30-07-2003 at 20:25

	30-07-2003 18:32									#2
	Increase Your PM Length

The other two sizes are Average and Large iirc; for difficulty, I think that we're looking at hard or impossible -- the others are too easy for most of the posters. I think that we can have 7 or 8 max ai oponnents -- recommend we just list it as min, middle#, max.

	30-07-2003 18:46									#3
	Support Apolyton

diff: I agree
min / med/ max: I think in the poll we could go just with majority or a run-off poll.................. their might be people who would like to play with 8 on a small map and impossible (no not me........)

	30-07-2003 19:21									#4
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

version number will have to be 1.31 though, otherwise just poll all the options, except for race picks for now. Then do the negative picks poll, then Government, then finally any other picks we want.

the race picks are:

Population Growth:-50%/+50%/+100%
Costing: -4/3/6

Food: -1/2/+1/+2 per farmer.
Costing: -3/4/7

Production: -1/+1/+2 per worker.
Costing: -3/3/6

Science: -1/+1/+2 per scientist.
Costing: -3/3/6

Taxation per Population: -1/2 BC/+1/2 BC/+1 BC
Costing: -4/5/8

Ship Defense: -20/+25/+50
Costing: -2/3/7

Ship Offense: -20/+20/+50
Costing:-2/2/4

Ground Combat: -10/+10/+20
Costing:-2/2/4

Spying: -10/+10/+20
Costing:-3/3/6

Government:
Feudal/Dictatorship/Democracy/Unification
Costing: -4/0/7/6

then the others:
Low G HW: -5
HG HW: +6
Aquatic: +5
Subterranean: +6
LHW:+1
RHW:+2
PHW:-1
AHW:+3
Cybernetic:+4
Lithovore:+10
Repulsive:-6
Charasmatic:+3
Uncreative:-4
Creative:6/8(depending on version and whether or not this is modded)
Tolerant:+10
Fantastic Traders:+4
Telepathic:+6
Lucky:+3
Omniscient:+3
StealthyShips:+4
TransDimensional:+5
Warlord:+4

	30-07-2003 19:37									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

For the picks I am thinking of making a point-poll, meaning everyone has i.e. 50 points to spare between the picks and the winners are the ones we use..........

Another possibility would be to make a negative selection, meaning select the ones you don't want and the run-off for the rest.

Come on people give us some ideas

The only thing I know, it might change my playing style

thanks Whoha for the list

	30-07-2003 19:51									#6
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Ok, due to feudal for pick selections...

Pick government first, then negatives, then your idea of picks that we don't want. then the real fist fights start over the remaining picks.

	30-07-2003 20:00									#7
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I can already see us struggling about creativ against non-creative , this will be I think the biggest struggle..........

We also still need to decide upon a constitution..............( I am about to start a new threat for collecting ideas............

One thing where I wasn't sure about to include:

What about final goal? Diplomatic victory allowed, meaning wining by council? Final war?

	30-07-2003 20:14									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Go ahead and mark me for Creative. I think the final goal should be victory by any means. Should we try to create a custom race before we get the mechanics down? Alot of us haven't played a DG before so maybe we should try to get some game play in before we spend weeks arguing the benefits of the Lucky pick.

	30-07-2003 20:30									#9
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I marked you for it....... (just internal)

As I know that some of those settings can take quite a while, that's why I started already with it.

And I already started a threat for the connie , at least some starting disucssion..............

	30-07-2003 20:41									#10
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Lucky is a fairly bad pick since it stops antaran attacks(it should direct them to attack planets that have lots of ships with assault shuttles :P)

	30-07-2003 21:22									#11
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Let's try this again... Hopefully it will post this time.

Lucky was tongue in cheek . I usually play Psilons so I'd want Creative and Science+8. Feudal government for the bonus picks; any other picks are gravy. If we go creative I want a prewarp society but if we choose uncreative then I want the technically advanced start date.

	30-07-2003 21:43									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

hmm so picks will influence the settings...

	30-07-2003 22:33									#13
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I have no axe to grind and any traits are fine. Just be aware that Prewarp with non creative will lead to more hard choices. Of course that is my preferred game, but it does not matter.
Uni for gov is my pick. I would suggest replusive as a neg to avoid having to deal with any trades/extortions.
IOW we will not have to worry about should be demand this or that and now or later.

	31-07-2003 00:23									#14
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Ok, so how about this order of polls(and im assuming that this will all be done with 1.31 by the way)?

Government
Negatives
Screened out positives
Creative at 6 or 8 points.
Positives we want.
Settings.

	31-07-2003 08:58									#15
	Tired of ads?

I think you should insert the starting age between creative and positives we want. Being creative or not would heavily influence settings and difficulty.

quote: Just be aware that Prewarp with non creative will lead to more hard choices.

I agree and think we need to accept this as a whole before moving on to other picks.

	31-07-2003 09:39									#16
	Got spare money?

i meant which version of it should we use, its up in the air whether or not we will pick creative.

we will choose the picks we want, including creative if thats the case, and the pick the settings.

	31-07-2003 11:36									#17
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I suggest that everybody posts a race, then we choose the most common picks from these posts. Finally we will only have to adjust the picks to zero with one or two polls.

	31-07-2003 14:53									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Instead of using different polls we could go another way as being used sometimes in OT for example:

Every citizen is granted 100 points, which he can distribute freely between the picks, another 100 for the settings. Out of the outcome we have then some run-off possibilities. The points mentioned here are just an example.

But let's say:

Harry decides
30 pre-warp
30 8 players
20 organic rich
20 huge

Whoha decides:
20 quick-start(?)
60 4 players
20 small

bakalov decides
90 huge
10 8 players

this would leed to 110 points for huge against 20 for small, so we would have already decided upon the size and if we find information conflicting we could run run-off polls.........

how you think about this way?

	31-07-2003 16:09									#19
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I would say:

Definately huge:
One of the advantages of a demo game is there are more people to manage things and more time without it just being tedious. Go with the largest universe possible then is my take.

Difficulty: At least normal.

Other settings: Don't care.


Race picks: Hmmm, I'd prefer non-creative. I'm not trying to maximize our chances to win the game, but our chances to have
to make choices which is part of what a single player demo game is about. In a multiplayer one, then it becomes more about which team is going to win in which case I'd be pro-creative since it obviously makes us more likely to win in a huge galaxy.

Other than that, I don't care for race picks either really.

Last edited by wervdon on 31-07-2003 at 18:14

	31-07-2003 19:00									#20
	Inflate your Upload Space

Here's my vote:

Prewarp 30
Creative 30
Five players 20
Large galaxy 10
Feudal gov 10

	31-07-2003 19:27									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Harry you are a bit quick........ I would like to start also yesterday......

That was just an idea (till now), I think we still have to think a bit about the amount of points (might be to unbalanced or whatever), but looks like at least one person likes it

	31-07-2003 20:43									#22
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I just wanna play.

	31-07-2003 21:14									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Same for me........ even if it just means in the moment shouting at our officials (still can't find my copy(s) : )

	31-07-2003 22:55									#24
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Underdogs may have it. Tried there?

	01-08-2003 04:16									#25
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

It is too big to be stored for downloads. 350mb or so, no site will like to see that getting hit.

	01-08-2003 04:52									#26
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

ok, its gone, and I don't really use email.

Last edited by Whoha on 01-08-2003 at 19:42

	01-08-2003 04:54									#27
	Inflate your Upload Space

Also are we about ready to start a poll? I think we should just go with government first myself.

	01-08-2003 14:00									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Thanks Whoha,

you can remove it.

By the way you could have used e-mail

	01-08-2003 14:05									#29
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I will start another threat (if nobody minds) tomorrow, where I'll be using the point system to 'pre'-select the picks.

Everyone agrees?

	01-08-2003 14:37									#30
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

That will be ok, but I will vote on Monday ;-)