14-08-2003 01:46									#1
	Where do we launch the Suicide Galley from? Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I've made a few maps to help others provide info/examples of where to cross along with their reasonings behind it.

I'm posting the small one and providing a link to the larger one. The white line denotes the edge of the Mini Map.







Large Full Map

Last edited by BigFree on 14-08-2003 at 01:54

	14-08-2003 01:53									#2
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Couldn't you have made the edge of the map the edge of the image?

My guess (and others') is that the other continent is a triangle whose hypotenuse faces us diagonally.

The best two spots to launch from are the small island in the south and near the chokepoint. Since we have a Galley near the island now, I would suggest using the PoA there first, and if we don't find anything to send subsequent Galleys to the Chokepoint crossing, since it's much closer.

	14-08-2003 01:58									#3
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I concur with Trip on this, though I think the probability of a successful find at the chokepoint is much higher than the one at the island. Since we have one at the island already, though....

	14-08-2003 02:18									#4
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As we already have a galley close to the small island i agree that we should try from there.
Another good place might be from the coast east of Tripoli.

	14-08-2003 04:01									#5
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I support E_T's idea of going north to do it, with one exception - I want to go W instead of NW.

	14-08-2003 07:33									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Panzer32 I support E_T's idea of going north to do it, with one exception - I want to go W instead of NW.

Hmm, while going W will cover more ground, so to speak, I think it would be better to go NW, as it moves us towards the middle of that amazing black fog, which is more likely where the mysterious continent would be.

	14-08-2003 07:39									#7
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I disagree. With suicide Galleys we should always head in cardinal directions to maximize the stuff we can see. In these two cases, I would suggest going 4-4-4 from both the island with PoA and 4-4-4 from the coast at the tip of the CFC side of the continent.

Going 7-7-7 from the northern tip will only uncover 12 new tiles (2 deep into the fog), while the final move of moving 4-4-4 would get about twice as many (uncovering 2 tiles in, but in 3 directions instead of 1, which is much more valuable).

	14-08-2003 08:12									#8
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quote: Originally posted by WhiteBandit Hmm, while going W will cover more ground, so to speak, I think it would be better to go NW, as it moves us towards the middle of that amazing black fog, which is more likely where the mysterious continent would be.

I'm talking about E_T's suggestion right here: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...094#post2260094

If we launch off from where that '7 tiles' part is, I thinkwe should go west.

On the other hand, if we go from our current position we should go NW.

[edit]Anyways, if we do decide to go NW, we should go W-N-NW to uncover more tiles. [/edit]

	14-08-2003 09:05									#9
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Take a look at this map I made up which shows the possible paths from the different launch sites.
Green is moving 7-7-7 and red is moving 4-4-4. Note that moving 7-7-7 in both cases only reveals
five more tiles than if we simply move 4-4-4, while moving 4-4-4 reveals 12 more in the north,
and 11 more in the south.

In terms of sheer tiles uncovered going 7-7-7 reveals 10 tiles, while moving 4-4-4 reveals 17.

So however you look at it, moving via a cardinal direction (west, in this case) is vastly superior to moving diagonally.

	14-08-2003 09:28									#10
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Trip, it only uncovers more to move in the Cardinal directions because of where we previously stopped the Galley's and pulled the 'fort all' trick. Look at the coastal squares in both areas and tell me there's not a few spots that we could pull that move on and uncover some of the red area.

Besides, do we want to uncover more tiles or find another Civ? In the case of the island launch I would prefer a NW direction (7-7-7) In the case of launching from where ET suggests I would use W (4-4-4) because in both cases I believe the chances for finding land are higher in those directions.

	14-08-2003 09:37									#11
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quote: Originally posted by BigFree Trip, it only uncovers more to move in the Cardinal directions because of where we previously stopped the Galley's and pulled the 'fort all' trick. Look at the coastal squares in both areas and tell me there's not a few spots that we could pull that move on and uncover some of the red area. Besides, do we want to uncover more tiles or find another Civ? In the case of the island launch I would prefer a NW direction (7-7-7) In the case of launching from where ET suggests I would use W (4-4-4) because in both cases I believe the chances for finding land are higher in those directions.

Do you really think those 5 extra tiles will hold more than the 12 other ones we'd be missing by not moving straight? If the coastline was exactly a straight diagonal line at all points then moving straight NW would make the most sense because we'd be bee-lining for an object we know the dimensions and distance of.

However, we have no idea what shape the coastline is, or how far away it might be, so the more tiles we see the greater chance we have of finding the something for which we aren't sure of the exact position.

Besides, moving 4-4-4 puts us on the same diagonal axis as moving 7-7-7 would, only the tiles we see are further to the SW.

	14-08-2003 10:22									#12
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Trip, it really depends on where you think the other land mass is an not neccesarily where we can uncover the most tiles. As the is no 100% way to know for sure where the land mass is, my best guess, from previous experiences, puts it on line with my earlier routes.

So, yes, those 5 tiles in the South can hold more than those 12 tiles in my opinion as far as finding a Civ/land. The tiles to the SW do not interest me now; it's the ones to the NW of the island that have my attention.

	14-08-2003 10:31									#13
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Well, having a "hunch" that tiles in one direction over another will yield more results just because isn't very convincing, at least not for me. Especially when one route has many more tiles than the other. There's nothing wrong with heading straight west... Catchopolis and Shen Ling are on the same latitude as the initial southern crossing point. That's good enough evidence for 4-4-4 for me.

(Hey, that was five "four" sounds in a row... )

	14-08-2003 10:35									#14
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It was not a "hunch" it is "my best guess, from previous experiences." Which is basically what you are saying as well.

I happen to think that the land mass will be in a NW direction from the island, and you think it is W.

	14-08-2003 10:37									#15
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Well, the direction I propose unveils more tiles. If moving 7-7-7 cleared more fog then I would prefer that direction. But it doesn't so I prefer moving in a straight line.

Simple fact is that we have no idea where the other continent is. The more tiles we uncover the better.

	14-08-2003 12:30									#16
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The more tiles we uncover in the direction in which we feel the other continent lies, the better.

	14-08-2003 12:39									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Trip Simple fact is that we have no idea where the other continent is. The more tiles we uncover the better.

In fact, some people seem to have at least some idea (hunch, best guess, estimate, etc.) where the other continent is.
That's why some prefer the southern green route. They simply think the odds are better that we find something, despite the fact that the green area is actually smaller than the red one.

But look at the northern crossing point. I think you'll agree that the red one is better than the green one in terms of number of tiles uncovered. I also think the direction of the red area is better than the direction of the green area. So I think red is superior here!

This is different in the south, since my expectations of finding a continent near the equator of the planet are higher than at a southern latitude.

Only trouble is: we do have ships in the south, but not in the north yet...

Since we're only going to trade diplomatic info and techs if we find a lost civ (no resources, no units going across), I think it's worth it to sail north first, and then use the red crossing point.

-- BFM

	14-08-2003 19:52									#18
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As I've said before, the southern starting point is the same latitude as Shen Ling and Catchopolis. Unless the continent is really distorted moving 4-4-4 will bring the same effect of moving 7-7-7, except we'll see more.

There could be a 20 tile ocean there, or up north, or anywhere along the coast. We don't yet know where the ideal crossing points are yet. If searching up further north is so important why are we sending the PoA back south again to check the last corner which is the same latitude as that tundra nugget we found?

	14-08-2003 22:45									#19
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Because it risks nothing.

	15-08-2003 03:28									#20
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Well i agree with Trip on this. Revealing the most tiles in what is important. But you are probably both better civ players than me, so your opinions should be valued the most.

	15-08-2003 04:02									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Hagbart Well i agree with Trip on this. Revealing the most tiles in what is important. But you are probably both better civ players than me, so your opinions should be valued the most.

Nonsense. You're part of this team and your opinion matters as much as mine or theirs or anyone else's. That goes for when you disagree with me also.

	15-08-2003 06:42									#22
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Under the circumstances, where we don't have any idea where the lost continent is, revealing more tiles would increases our odds of spotting borders/land. I agree with Trip.

But bear in mind that if the land is reverse triangle, moving 4-4-4 could mean we move further away from the Land, and we may not be able to safely move onto coastal tile in turn 2.

But I still agree with Trip.