19-08-2003 01:41									#31
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Except in the UK we taxed the hell out of petrol and wasted it so we have a totally crap transport infrastructure still.

	19-08-2003 01:41									#32
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2 bucks per gallon? THAT'S CHEAP! EVERYBODY, GRAB CONTAINERS ETC, PRICES HAVE CRASHED DOWN IT'S SOME KIND OF MISTAKE LET'S TAKE ADVANTAGE NOW!

	19-08-2003 01:46									#33
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quote: Originally posted by MikeH Except in the UK we taxed the hell out of petrol and wasted it so we have a totally crap transport infrastructure still.

Yeah, I almost said that myself, but figured some Briton would do it for me, with more authority.

	19-08-2003 02:02									#34
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*****in at 1.73 for UL here

Munch munchin my wallet. Where did the 1.30 gas UL go from a couple of months ago????




grrrr

	19-08-2003 02:07									#35
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The question is, who spends the bigger chunk of their income on gasoline. It might cost a lot more in Europe, but one assumes far less is used, and Europeans (well, outside of Britons) have viable alternatives. If you live in LA, you either drive or get a home office.

Conversely, I am sure the situation is worse in the third world, were prices might vary, but incoems are dirt low.

	19-08-2003 02:09									#36
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Well I fail to see how europe has that much more alternatives than us. We have trains, Buses, everything they have there. It every city over 20,000 people we have those. Its just a matter of, ok, social status and the feeling of freedom, not having to rely on a bus schedule.

	19-08-2003 02:14									#37
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It isn;t the same by a long shot. First of all, most cities have poor public transti. Buses are slow and coverage not good. Few large cities have good light rail. Then there is distances. no where in Europe is as open as the great plains. The notion of having to drive 20 miles to find anything is relatively unheard off.

So no, the alternatives are NOT the same in both places, not by a long shot.

	19-08-2003 02:20									#38
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GePap beat me to it. The US is a large country, where some states are as large as European nations. Putting in a mass transit system is a little more difficult, and for more than just this reason.

	19-08-2003 02:53									#39
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quote: Originally posted by faded glory Well I fail to see how europe has that much more alternatives than us. We have trains, Buses, everything they have there. It every city over 20,000 people we have those. Its just a matter of, ok, social status and the feeling of freedom, not having to rely on a bus schedule.

You've never seen how good the mass transite is on the continent have you? Travel more and then you will see what a **** system we have.

	19-08-2003 03:01									#40
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quote: Originally posted by Guardian At the moment, gas is NOK 8.49 per liter where I am. That's almost exactly € 1 and about US$ 1.15. So, that's over $ 4 per gallon. -But then again, I make at least three times more than the average American factory worker, so I guess I can afford to pay somewhat higher prices... All things told, I think the cost of living pretty much evens out in the long run. The thing is, I can go to America and have a field day buying stuff because to me everything's so cheap over there, but an American coming to Norway is going to get ripped off and skinned alive! -Economically speaking, that is...

so you area factory worker?

Jon Miller

	19-08-2003 03:01									#41
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European mass transit is awesome. Only in NY and Boston in the U.S. will you find comparable systems.

Re AZ gas "shortage": It's not that there is a shortage of gas, per se, but that gas is slow in getting to the stations. The pipeline to Phoenix from Tulsa, the only fuel pipeline to the city, is down after a major break last week and will likely be down for a little while yet. So they have to ship in the gas by truck, which means it's slower going.

	19-08-2003 03:10									#42
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Yes, it just isn't feasible to have a European mass transit system in most US cities. It would probably bankrupt Atlanta trying to connect all the suburbs to MARTA . Therefore cars are essential.

Just filled up today in Jersey. $1.37 / gal.

	19-08-2003 03:27									#43
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I like the metro in DC

it needs something connecting the suburbs without ahving to run downtown thpigh )the fabled purple line)

Jon Miller

	19-08-2003 04:19									#44
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Jersey gas rules. I live five miles from the nation's biggest refinery and gas sometimes goes for less than a buck a gallon. Now it's about $1.30. One of

	19-08-2003 04:25									#45
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Heh... I'm at least an hour away from any refinery (on the shore) and I still get decent price for gas .

	19-08-2003 04:27									#46
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east coast has great gas prices.

Out here in the west we pay the big bucks. I blame California of course.

	19-08-2003 04:42									#47
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Petrol prices and the quality of mass transit have no direct effect on me; I walk everywhere.

quote: Except in the UK we taxed the hell out of petrol and wasted it so we have a totally crap transport infrastructure still.

Well, that's not entirely true, our roads are okay. And at least they make sure everyone is driving efficient cars.

	19-08-2003 04:46									#48
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Yeah, gas shot up here (indiana), to $1.69 a gallon. Now its dipped back down to 1.49

	19-08-2003 04:57									#49
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JERSEY GAS!!


My girlfriend lived on Long Island and now she lives in Maryland, and she's such a cheapskate that she'll only get gas when she's going through New Jersey, which during the summer is like once a month...


It's cheaper and you're guaranteed to have somebody pump it for you with no extra charge! State Law!


That's what I did for a year.. and have been doing sporadically over this summer... gas pumping, however, sucks on humid days, but the up side is no boss and being paid under the table.

	19-08-2003 04:59									#50
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Funny thing though is that despite the cheapest gas in the USA I have darn good mass transit where I live, even though it's a suburb. There's a bus straight into Midtown Manhattan every hour that leaves at the end of my block, and there's a train station with service to NYC in the middle of town.

Fact is that suburbs and good mass transit can coexist. So long as population per acre exceeds 14 people, mass transit can pay for itself. Where I live, it's about 8 houses to an acre, avg. 3 people per house. Got backyards and frontyards, and even a white picket fence. What doesn't work, though, is the new steroid suburbs they're putting up, with 1 or 2 houses per acre and 4-car garages.

	19-08-2003 05:02									#51
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quote: It's cheaper and you're guaranteed to have somebody pump it for you with no extra charge!

That's my ONLY problem. After living in Jersey for 22 years and then going to a place when you pump your own gas, pumping your own is VASTLY SUPERIOR! I hate waiting for the idiot attendants

	19-08-2003 05:06									#52
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quote: I hate waiting for the idiot attendants

	19-08-2003 05:07									#53
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As long as you ask me 'Cash or Charge' before assuming I'm paying cash, then you aren't one of them .

	19-08-2003 05:12									#54
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you should raise your taxes; there wouldn't be so much spoiling; and best of all car companies would invest more in finding out how to make cars waste less oil


that's what happened in Europe; we pay a lot more for our gas, but our cars doesn't need that much gas anyway... A BMW break here gets down to say 8 litres/100km, and that's a pretty big car, small cars could do with 6

I think that's the main reason to tax gas so much; normal consumers like us will keep driving anyway because a lot of people need to use the car anyhow so that won't make much of a difference; it's just the car companies that need a little push.. after all people are going to look for cars that don't waste too much gas...

	19-08-2003 05:15									#55
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Actually, where I work it doesn't matter... still the same process regardless.



The thing is though that you have to test it out and find what gas station works for you. At my gas station, if somebody wants to pump their own gas, we let them. Hey, it makes our lives easier. There are a lot of blue collar workers and newcomers to the state who do it themselves because they've just been used to doing it for one reason or another.

But there are some stations where if you get out the pumper will tell you to get back in because they're worried about losing their job... so try it... you're bound to find one place that's more lax about policy.

And btw, its the gas station owners, and their organization, that have made sure this legislation stays in place... they are very interested in not having people pump their own gas. The difference in the insurance makes the pumpers worthwhile.

	19-08-2003 05:20									#56
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quote: But there are some stations where if you get out the pumper will tell you to get back in because they're worried about losing their job

"Sir, get back in your car. Now."

I'm glad I've got self-serve in Texas!

	19-08-2003 05:24									#57
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What have people managed to do so horribly wrong while pumping their own gas in other states?

	19-08-2003 05:26									#58
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Well, now all the stupid people are starting to manifest. The gas problem is on all news stations now as 'the' story. There are 1-2 hour long lines at the stations that still have gas because of people panicking, not because they need it. Price gauging is happening in a few places. I heard in Casa Grande it was over $3 a gallon .

I am about out but I'm gonna go get some gas at 2 in the morning tonight so I don't have to wait in some stupid ass line.

	19-08-2003 05:31									#59
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Hmm... wow... being in the Smog Capital of the World, I've been blissfully unaware.

Smiley: It has to do with crime... muggings and such like that.

Yeah, not to many reports of gas stations blown to kingdom come by some *sshole smoking a cigarette out by the pumps.

Not that its ever been an issue for us. One of my co-workers, Sean, used to smoke by the pumps all the time...

And that cell phone thing is crap too... its EXTREMELY unlikely to cause an explosion.

	19-08-2003 05:34									#60
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Women who get in and out of their car while pumping gas have caused explosions, through the static electricity or some idiotic nonsense like that. Or, so said CNN.