22-08-2003 19:36									#1
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Okay, in the post about egyptians demanding reparations for the Jewish Exodus, I mentioned a few other strong beliefs that are firmly maintained by some despite a complete incompatibility with reality. Namely, the KKK's insistence that it was founded as an act of self-defense against the dangerous freed slaves who felt free to rape white women now that Master no longer had permission from the government to whip them, and Jack Chick's conspiracy theory that states that the Catholic Church is responsible for Communism, Fascism, and both World Wars. What have I missed? Any other real doozies out there?
Please don't post strictly religious beliefs here, for several reasons:
1. I want this thread to go more than one page without getting locked.
2. As Dave Barry observed, all religions naturally sound stupid to all other religions.
3. As religion is closely based on faith, the rationality of religious beliefs isn't as much of an issue.
4. This is my thread, and if you atheists wanna troll you can get your own, dammit.
Other than that, feel free. For a bonus point, post your opinion: this thread is either going to get two posts and then get locked, quickly get threadjacked and turn into a flamewar grounded in obscurity, get a few posts and fade into nothingness, or actually get a large number of meaningful responses. Place your bets!

	22-08-2003 19:43									#2
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I predict a flamewar.

The biggest major delusion I can think of off the top of my head is the belief that owning more things will make you happier. Practically every religion and philosopher in the history of mankind says the opposite, and they can support their side. But rigorous logic melts like a snowflake in a blowtorch when confronted by a barrage of advertising.

	22-08-2003 19:45									#3
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The delusion that this thread will NOT descend into a flamewar, despite all of your requests that it not

	22-08-2003 19:56									#4
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You ask for a list of biggest delusions, and then tell me to leave religion out of it?!

Bah! No fun.

-Arrian

	22-08-2003 19:56									#5
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If he wants us to keep it from being a flamewar, he should have asked us to keep politics out of it too

	22-08-2003 19:58									#6
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I predict that anybody that turns this into a flame war will be restricted... And that's a prediction you can take to the bank.

So stay on topic... be nice... or be restricted.

	22-08-2003 20:17									#7
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well, there are the more recent oddball kooky ones, like flat earth or moon landing in a hollywood studio thing.

	22-08-2003 20:27									#8
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Yeah, the Flat Earth Society are pretty delusional.

	23-08-2003 05:39									#9
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Oh, I forgot the one about the moon landing being faked. But are you telling me that the Flat Earth Society isn't a satirical device or a metaphor for their general philosophy? I always assumed that was the case...but you're telling me there are still proponents of the flat earth? What's the ostensible justification for the conspiracy keeping it quiet?
And I left *strictly* religious questions out of the mix to keep things fairly civil, as in, no sideways comments by those wacky folk who like to say, "how about the idea that some guy rose from the dead two thousand years ago?" and then look around like they expect somebody to congratulate them for their wittiness. You know who I'm talking about.

	23-08-2003 05:49									#10
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The KKK is outdated and in need of purging.
Initially, it was a "good" idea.
Newly freed Blacks, being prodded by Yankee Carpetbaggers to cause trouble.

Pretty much how "Gone With The Wind" depicts it.
The group of men, that rode to avenge the attack on Scarlett O'Hara? KKK.

	23-08-2003 05:50									#11
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How about the theory of my neighbor that jews are behind everything that happens in the American government.

He was born in Germany in the late 30's.



ACK!

	23-08-2003 05:52									#12
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Get a rope.

	23-08-2003 07:39									#13
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How about ZOG? That's a bit more recent than the KKK.

There's also "The Protocols of the Elders of Zion". Even though written more thasn a century ago there are still those who believe that they are the real thing.

How about crop circles?

	23-08-2003 08:22									#14
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"The biggest major delusion I can think of off the top of my head is the belief that owning more things will make you happier."

Owning more things would make me happier, so long as I got to choose. I refer, of course, to objects that liberate, rather than intrap.

	23-08-2003 08:42									#15
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Owning more things does make people happier, up to a point. Eventually,you run into diminishing returns.

	23-08-2003 08:42									#16
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Major Delusion: Arafat and the Pa actually don't support terrorism and want a two state solution.

	23-08-2003 08:46									#17
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Major Delusion: Israel is the just, all-embracive peace-wanting state in the middle east

	23-08-2003 08:47									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer Major Delusion: Israel is the just, all-embracive peace-wanting state in the middle east

This is true. That doesn't change the fact that Arafat is a swine though.

	23-08-2003 08:53									#19
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Oerdin:

I think people expect too much of the PA... people like you seem to think Palestine is an actual country and the PA has an organized military that is doing these terrorist attacks... that stone-throwing teenagers are a third-wing of the PA military... and the PA can control its citizens (do palestinians by the way pay israeli taxes?)... the fact is, the PA is as much of a nation-state as... god i dont know what... but the fact is, it's not an actual country but a mass of individuals. of course you'll still have random palestinians fighting a jihad... of course you'll have the PA having immense difficulty securing a diplomatic solution and enforcing peace...

Sharon's gov't on the other hand is centralized, etc.

	23-08-2003 09:02									#20
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Yes, they are a nation. What we have though is the closest thing this nation has to a national government gives money to terrorists and orders terrorists attacks. What's worse is it gives known terrorist masterminds positions with in the government just so they will have diplomatic immunity and be shielded from retailation for there actions.

In my mind these people (the PA) are terrorist supporting scum just like the Taliban and we should destroy the PA just like we have (mostly) destroyed the Taliban.

P.S. I agree that the PA cannot control all of its citizens, but, they aren't even trying. Two years into the road map and not one terrorist has been arrested. The only thing the road map requires the PA to do is dismantle the terrorist networks. They won't do it and so they should be treated like any other terrorist supporting nation.

	23-08-2003 14:14									#21
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Well that didn't take long.

	23-08-2003 14:28									#22
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The atheist claim that science disproves religion.

	23-08-2003 15:54									#23
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Straight in at number one, North Korea.

The Church of Scientology is also right up there.

Arafat is an impotent doddering punchbag. When he kicks the bucket, Israel will just find a new 'mastermind' to vilify.

As for the Flat Earthers, I'd almost be willing to see taxpayers money fund trips into space for them, just to see the look on their faces.

	23-08-2003 16:40									#24
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Ok, Im a Flat Earther ... where is my ticket?

	23-08-2003 17:02									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin P.S. I agree that the PA cannot control all of its citizens, but, they aren't even trying. Two years into the road map and not one terrorist has been arrested. The only thing the road map requires the PA to do is dismantle the terrorist networks. They won't do it and so they should be treated like any other terrorist supporting nation.

After all I think it seems to be difficult to do.
I remember in the time before the second Intifada where you could always read, that every time there was a major Terrorist Attack in Israel the Israel Military destroyed Palestinian Policestations for Revenge.

It always seemed to be very counterproductive to me, to avenge terrorist Attacks by destroying the Infrastructure which could be used by the PA to counter those Terrorists (except of course you had no real Interest in giving the PA a Chance to get rid of the Terrorists).

So I think the major Delusions go like this:

The current Israeli and Palestine Government will be successful in finding a way to peacefully live together.

and

Hamas, Islamic Djihad or the Israeli Settler Organizations (and their political Parties) are really interested in a two State Solution and in Palestinians and Israelis living peacefully side by side.

	23-08-2003 17:50									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Rogan Josh The atheist claim that science disproves religion.

It does...

but this is in clear violation of the first post...

	23-08-2003 20:27									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Rogan Josh The atheist claim that science disproves religion.

That "the atheist" makes this claim.

	23-08-2003 20:35									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Proteus_MST After all I think it seems to be difficult to do. I remember in the time before the second Intifada where you could always read, that every time there was a major Terrorist Attack in Israel the Israel Military destroyed Palestinian Policestations for Revenge. It always seemed to be very counterproductive to me, to avenge terrorist Attacks by destroying the Infrastructure which could be used by the PA to counter those Terrorists (except of course you had no real Interest in giving the PA a Chance to get rid of the Terrorists). So I think the major Delusions go like this: The current Israeli and Palestine Government will be successful in finding a way to peacefully live together. and Hamas, Islamic Djihad or the Israeli Settler Organizations (and their political Parties) are really interested in a two State Solution and in Palestinians and Israelis living peacefully side by side.

If the PA's police functioned like the police in other nations then I would agree with you that destroying police stations would be counter productive. As it is though the PA would give jobs to members of Al Aqsa and then make them police officers! :eeek: It was the police who were proven to be running some of the worst terrorist attacks. What else is Israel supposed to do but destroy them?

Arafat is smart. The terrorists are his biggest competetion so he hires them thus making them partially dependent (and certainly more favorable to him) plus this gives the terrorists legal cover. I.E. the news papers then say "Israel killed a PA police officer" and not "Israel killed a hamas opporative" which is what really happened.

	23-08-2003 20:43									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Rogan Josh The atheist claim that science disproves religion.

Here we go...

Hey, guess what, science does disprove (a lot of) religion. It doesn't disprove god, however, and I doubt many atheists at all would claim that it does.

God != religion.

I think up in the delusional top ten has to be Creationists. Denial ain't just a river in Egypt (a nation which seems to have not noticed the Great Flood wiped it out).

	23-08-2003 20:48									#30
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Oh, the creationists have to be a top form of delutional denial. As a geologist I can't help but snicker whenever I hear those funimentalist Christian radio stations talking about "geologic proof of the great flood" or "geologic proof the world is only 3,000 years old".

These idiots often don't know the first thing about palentology yet they think they know enough to disprove sound science based upon what they've read in a three chapter fundie book.