23-11-2003 05:26									#1
	Turn 350 AD Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Well, people, we are getting somewhere (I think).

I don;t want to play the turn until after we've made some further progress with GoW, hopefully a signed contract.

In the interim, what are our thoughts?

OVERALL STRATEGY
THE NORTH
THE SOUTH
OTHER AREAS
ALLIES
DIPLOMACY
ECONOMY AND SCIENCE

	23-11-2003 08:21									#2
	Diplomacy Suffering from ads?

Following discussions with GoW, they want

1) more land - looking more at a line at the mountains than the jungle - specifically Alamo and Pamplona. I reckon there's SP there. Some of their team are presumably demanding the whole continent - which must be three-to-four times the size of Stormia. We may need to remind them of this, but probably not. Pamplona will probably be a bargaining chip for us to move some zones back towards and into the jungle, of which we might want to take the East.

2) Lego's involvement. They are now more worried about Lego intervening on behalf of ND than Lego getting a foothold on Bob. They are right. We have to get Lego in, possibly by persuading them to back a 3-way power split over a four-way power split. They may actually prefer a 4-way split with Lego and ND being the 2 larger powers and GS and GoW the smaller. We have to get them to fear ND in the long run.

Aggie also has to bring his team with him. Meeting the above will help. The land clause was always the likely 'calibration lever' of the contract - and so we were expecting their response.

The great news is that they seemingly want to buy into the 'Cash-for-Upgrades' scheme which gets the 'foothold on Stormia' off the table, and also gets us Gunpowder.

Perhaps our approach has spurred their marketing department to fish for other clients now to increase their options.
At the least, we've bought some diplomatic capital with them, that may come in handy sometime whatever happens now.

	23-11-2003 08:46									#3
	Allies Inflate your Upload Space

I'm a bit worried for Roleplay at the moment. If we can't get Lego in on the deal we lose the whole framework for their security and eventual return to Spain. I wonder if Roleplay have any leverage left on Lego from their dodgy 'pre-game deal' - getting preferential treatment in return for not being Carthage (allegedly).

On the brighter side, Aggie & MZ expressed no objections to our proposed status for Roleplay including a possible return. Maybe they figure that Spanish land at our expense is fine.

(What's odd is that for all the SP talk of vasselising conquered states, it's the 'rescuers' or interveners in this game that get to do the vasselising. Now there's a thought for RL.)

We haven't had an actual team response from Roleplay - but we said jump and they have. These three cities can be returned (I'm hoping there were no non-transferable improvements that got smashed) - it's the Palace jump that's the biggie. I feel that they ought make the decision - it's their capital - but it'll hurt them if we handed it over to GoW. So what if we tell GoW that Roleplay will abandon Pamplona, rather than having to see the GoW flag over it? GoW's reaction may tell us something.

	23-11-2003 08:58									#4
	The North Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Miller Town would be the Roleplay capital, I presume, so would want to get pumped up to 5 or maybe 6 if The Voice were to grow. All only if the deal is on though - unless we want to do it anyway. Damn town's just built a worker, too.

Should Wittlich be empty?

Forces near YK: Stay put I suppose.

	23-11-2003 09:14									#5
	The South Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Knights near Barca can drive through town to the western defences. The ill-fated 'Fort Liberation' tile has proven hotly contested - and even got a poem from UnO, so we probably want to steer clear of there or any other position which GoW might be obliged to attack.

The Alamo knights will have to take another round of pinging I guess - I see nowhere else for them to go. Hopefully they won't get too softened up.

	23-11-2003 09:17									#6
	Lego Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Lego are still growing dramatically on the power graph.

	23-11-2003 09:25									#7
	Economy and Science Get a bigger avatar today!

Is it worth researching Invention if we can now get it in the deal instead? Everything depends on that, and that all depends on Lego.

If we intend a Palace jump, then we'd be shrinking down EotS and disbanding it - leaving Arashi the Capital I presume. So, no improvements in EotS if we get the deal.

Was there a second Uni planned for Tempest after its knight?

	23-11-2003 09:27									#8
	Overall Strategy Support Apolyton

Get Lego onboard.

	23-11-2003 09:28									#9
	Other Areas Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Vox - I've had no reply to my last PM to Beta, and an acknowledgement but no actual response to the one before that.

Could they be up to something? Would they come and get revenge on us?

	23-11-2003 21:28									#10
	Completed builds this turn Increase the size of your Attachments

Eos : Knight (15spt)

Miller Town : Worker

Bolderburg : Harbor (10spt - but can switch to growth with 6-8 6pt)

Sandstorm : Knight (7 spt)

Whirlwind : Galley (7spt)

Blizzard : Galley (6 spt)

Santa Anna : War Chariot (4 spt)

	23-11-2003 21:29									#11
	Military Totals Remove this text

3 Settlers
27 Workers
3 Warriors
7 Spears
1 Horse
28 Pikes
42 Knight
3 Cats
18 Galleys
7 War Chariots
16 Med Inf

	23-11-2003 21:33									#12
	Re: Other Areas Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Cort Haus Vox - I've had no reply to my last PM to Beta, and an acknowledgement but no actual response to the one before that. Could they be up to something? Would they come and get revenge on us?

Vox won't do anything without Lego's approval, Velociryx pushed hard for them to work with us in some capacity to no avail.

	23-11-2003 21:36									#13
	Production Notes Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

EotS has a scientist

Bolderburg has a harbor - can now get +2 fpt (coming off the mountain) - and could donate EotS-11 back to EotS for growth in 10 - Unless we plan to disband this city for the Palace Jump?

Sandstorm - can grow to seven in 13 turns - aqua in approx the same time - if we wanted to boost it economically. Grows to six in 3t for 8spt. Alternatively do Knight, Worker to boost Bolderberg.

Blizzard grows to five next turn. It might make 7spt.

Workers are chopping at Typhoon-33 (3 turns) and Cyclone-4 (4 turns).

The settlers are presumably for Spain.

Tempest - Uni after the Knight?

	23-11-2003 21:42									#14
	Allies Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Gift World Map to Roleplay with Miller Town. They always send us this, I don't know if we do likewise.

We need the NW cities Wittlich and Beta for now - but it would be good if they could eventually be productive for us as Spanish cities. Would they ever be productive for us if we had a Palace on Bob?

	23-11-2003 21:44									#15
	Re: Re: Other Areas Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by asleepathewheel Vox won't do anything without Lego's approval, Velociryx pushed hard for them to work with us in some capacity to no avail.

Fine. That saves time working on them.

	23-11-2003 22:08									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

CH, do you want to go ahead and play/send the turn? I am sort of tied up, and you seem on top of things.

	23-11-2003 22:26									#17
	Lego Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

From the chat with Lego on 11th Nov

quote: Theseus> So what were your objectives for this chat? Sharpe> We would like to avoid war with GS if possible - so to figure out if there is a way for our defensive pact with GoW NOT to be activated ... Theseus> But with ND too? Sharpe> hard to say , we do have a NAP with them Sharpe> not sure how much longer it has to go

and later in the same chat ...

quote: Cort_Haus> GoW and GS have been forcing each others hand to make not striking a deal with each other unpalatable Sharpe> hmm, well if you don't invade, Lego won't be forced to join the war... which will please us Nimitz> true Cort_Haus> So you'd rather we did a deal with GoW? Sharpe> if possible Cort_Haus> cool Nimitz> I think everyone would

and a little further on ..

quote: Sharpe> what we hope is that Lego and GS could perhaps come to an agreement to avoid any defense treaty being triggered if possible

followed by ...

quote: Theseus> Cutting to the chase again: IF we can negotiate a deal with GoW, are you OK with a NEW balance: Lego, GS, and GoW, with Vox and RP as supporting players? Nimitz> as I said that is not up to us its up to the team Nimitz> we can't make desisions like that Theseus> Fair enough... is it something to be considered, and what are yout thoughts on the team's likley thinking? Nimitz> I'd say 1/3, 1/3, 1/3 Nimitz> neutral for and against Sharpe> yeah, Nimitz is right Theseus> That's all? Theseus> Also, would you want to fight, and would you want a piece of Bob? Sharpe> the key would be the neutral people on Lego Sharpe> that would depend on whether GoW was fully on board with this Nimitz> if we agreed most likely Theseus> Assume that we can get GoW on board. Theseus> (Not that we REMOTELY have) Sharpe> it would be a fair agreement re balance

yet further clarification :

quote: Cort_Haus> so am I right that you called this chat to see if there was a way for us to avoid war? Sharpe> yes

	23-11-2003 22:33									#18
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Theseus CH, do you want to go ahead and play/send the turn? I am sort of tied up, and you seem on top of things.

OK, I take it any available Knights are for shipping to Spain, and that surplus cash is for upgrading.

	23-11-2003 22:42									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Who do I send the save to at ND?

	23-11-2003 22:47									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

darekill@gmx.de
neudemogyptica@cylusion.com

Thanks, I have family stuff going on that I must address.

	24-11-2003 03:49									#21
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I'm playing & recording the moves now.

I don't think there'll be anything contraversial. Builds canm be changed. Do we definitely want the mkt in Arashi next turn?

	24-11-2003 03:51									#22
	Increase Your PM Length

I can post the proposed moves and wait a while, if that's better.

	24-11-2003 03:56									#23
	Remove this text

You should go ahead and play it... I just posted in the public forum about the delay being due to crashes. Somewhat true btw, as I just crashed looking in F1. DON'T GO IN THERE!!

	24-11-2003 03:58									#24
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I'll open the save, and if I have any further comments I'll post them shortly... I only have about one hour.

	24-11-2003 04:00									#25
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

It doesn't crash on mine.

	24-11-2003 04:04									#26
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Good. I'm cycling thorugh the build phase... you can change Miller Town before the Worker gets built.

	24-11-2003 04:10									#27
	Tired of ads?

After the Harbor build, change Bolderberg workforce to produce 2 excess food.

I'd send the new Galley from WW north to support troop transit... we don;t have enough Galleys there.

Move the 3 wounded Galleys to Barc.

Move the two sets of coastal Knights to the two chokepoints.

	24-11-2003 04:17									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Upgrade the Horse in OG.

I'd send the east coast Galley to Inchoff66 for now.

New builds in the lesser cities should be Pikes and Galleys.

Not sure what to do about Arashi... I'd say go ahead with the Market, it'll pay itself off in the time it takes to get a new FP completed.

	24-11-2003 04:26									#29
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Consolidate the spare Galley up north with the others.

Move a Pike and Cat into Toledo.

Move the Settler and the spare Workers to WW.

Bulk MillerTown up to 6 pop.

Move the Warrior in Beta to Elipolis.

Gift the three northern towns to RP.

Uh, I'm done.

CH, you want me to do the screenshots and send it out?

	24-11-2003 04:39									#30
	Put an end to popups!

Notes for next turn:

* We need to decide what to build in our new Bobian cities.

* We really need to cut a deal with GoW... the forward Knights do not have a good retreat, so Pamplona would be perfect.