15-12-2003 18:39									#31
	Got spare money?

Germany's population is constant due to large immigration. But the part of native Germans is in the decline, however.

	15-12-2003 18:50									#32
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Spiffor I'm a strong believer of the "one man one vote" doctrine. .

I prefer the one rich man 2 beuatiful women doctrine.




I used to favor a higher ration, but that got excessive as I got older.

	15-12-2003 18:55									#33
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola I used to favor a higher ration, but that got excessive as I got older.

At least, you can now improve quality over quantity

	15-12-2003 22:16									#34
	Remove this text

Brief summary of Polish history:

1772 - partitioned by Prussia, Austria and Russia
1793 - partitioned by Prussia and Russia
1795 - partitioned by Prussia, Austria and Russia
1939 - partitioned by Germany and the Soviet Union
2003 - May - attacked Iraq - December - destroyed Europe

Brief summary of Spanish history:

16th+17th century - killed many Germanic Europeans
2003 - May - attacked Iraq - December - destroyed Europe

Let's face it, we have Panzers, the Poles have kasza, so who's gonna have more say

Where is Horse when you need him for a good Pole troll. But then would I need him for that?

	15-12-2003 22:26									#35
	Got spare money?

quote: I don't see what's wrong with the current system. It requires 50% of the countries (thus making sure that the small guys like luxemburg don't get shafted) and 60% of the population (meaning that most of the big countries have to agree).

That's not what is holding up the Constitution.

	15-12-2003 22:27									#36
	Remove this text

The more France and Germany complain, the more smug I feel.

	15-12-2003 22:34									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Y'all need a split legislature, like ours.

	15-12-2003 22:45									#38
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Poland still pretty much bans abortion I think, so they wouldn't want to join the US.

And Germany & France have Birth rates below replacement levels, immigration is what is making up for that.

	15-12-2003 22:48									#39
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Y'all need a split legislature, like ours.

There is a split legistature. We have
an unelected executive (the Commission),
an unelected high Chamber (the Council of Ministers, the relatives weight of each member-state was the topic of the quibble)
an elected lower chamber (the European Parliament), whose only real power is to block some of the decisions taken by the high chamber.

As long as our "Senate" will have so much more say than our "House", we'll be stuck with the current system, where any decision requires ages of haggling and is always dumbed down.

	15-12-2003 22:48									#40
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

France doesnt have birth levels below replacement. Actually it is the most "fertile" country of the EU. Italy on the other hand has the most severe problem in this regard and berlu has enancted legislation. Germany also has that problem but not so severe as italy.

	15-12-2003 23:04									#41
	Full PM-box? Change here!

The replacement level about 2.11, France is around 1.85 for 2003, thats still the "most fertile" but its below replacement.

http://www.bartleby.com/151/fr.html#People

	15-12-2003 23:04									#42
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

The US is at about 2.07 by the way.

	15-12-2003 23:05									#43
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

2,11 is above replacement

	15-12-2003 23:07									#44
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

thats at replacement for developed nations, 2 for mother and father, about .1 to offset infant mortality rates.

In developing countries it must be higher.

	15-12-2003 23:09									#45
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

well whats the infant mortality of france?

	15-12-2003 23:10									#46
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 France doesnt have birth levels below replacement. Actually it is the most "fertile" country of the EU. Italy on the other hand has the most severe problem in this regard and berlu has enancted legislation. Germany also has that problem but not so severe as italy.

what type of legislation would that be? Make it law that each man must father children with multiple women?

	15-12-2003 23:10									#47
	Inflate your Upload Space

total: 4.37 deaths/1,000 live births

still, even if it were zero, 1.85 does not cover even the Mother or Father.

	15-12-2003 23:11									#48
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

financial support to families with many babies.

but only italian families, which accuse him of racism

	15-12-2003 23:12									#49
	Increase the size of your Attachments

so with a 2,11 it IS above replacement. sicne the death is 4/1000?

	15-12-2003 23:12									#50
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

thats pretty cool

	15-12-2003 23:12									#51
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Kramerman:Anti-abortion stuff,incentives for children,punishment for staying single,that sort of thing.

Italy so far is(in one town) giving 12k dollars for each child born.

	15-12-2003 23:12									#52
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

... an ambition man could make millions...

	15-12-2003 23:19									#53
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Paiktis22: That is probable, but I do not know.

of those 1000 births, if 4 die, then to be at replacement level 1000 births(4 of those die) have to happen to 473 parent groups(mother and father) to be at the replacement rate. France is at 1.85, so theres no way. The site doesn't list statistics like that So there is no way to tell whether 2.11 would be above the replacement rate or not for France, But I think 2.11 was calculated as a general base line for developed countries.

	15-12-2003 23:19									#54
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

bicamerial legistaltion!

if the majority of people in Europe want something, but the majority of countries in Europe DON'T, well you have quite an issue to address there, no?

off the top of my head I can't think of anything that wouldn't end up a stagnant beuracracy.

	15-12-2003 23:20									#55
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Also, the above situation assumes that 100% of the population is Heterosexual, and has the requisit number of children, which are obviously invalid assumptions.

	15-12-2003 23:25									#56
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Spain and Poland my ass! At least in this issue, it's simply not fair towards the rest of Europe, especially Germany. I favor the one-man-one-vote thinking, although for that it might be too early. But such an injust key as Spain and Poland try to defend is simply unacceptable.

	15-12-2003 23:27									#57
	Support Apolyton

Whoha, if the birth level of france is 2,11 that means 0,11 growing population. gays have nothing to do with that.
its how many babies are indeed born

	15-12-2003 23:32									#58
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

BTW, the US' new debts are 4.4% of the GDP, so chance to join the euro (theoretically). Just for those about to whine how Germany and France want to trule Europe despite our economic "weakness" or something like that.

Core union now.

	15-12-2003 23:34									#59
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

The birth level is 1.85 though, 2.11 would only be above replacement if infant mortality were zero or very close. I'll look at that fact sheet and try to figure it out for you.

	15-12-2003 23:35									#60
	Got spare money?

dont look at CIA factbook, its full of mistakes.

The EU commission report placed fertility at above 2 but i dont remember howmuch.