18-04-2004 05:38									#91
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by MRT144 move israel to new mexico.

	18-04-2004 05:45									#92
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Really though you can't pin everything on Israel. A couple of things need to happen from the Arab side:

1) They need to condemn suicide bombings
2) They need to stop repressing their own populations

#2 is the main contributing factor to the extremist lunaticism

If I was in Israel's shoes I would be doing the same thing they are, except the only exception is that I'd remove ALL of the settlements. I believe there are 4 that are going to be left in occupied territory.

	18-04-2004 08:30									#93
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Spiffor OK, so it does deserve the bit.

So you judge their decision by the competence and/or luck of their troops?

	18-04-2004 08:34									#94
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Mercatore Uno 27 (http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c...1437EDT0561.DTL) I condemn all violence, including this. So Israel's making damned sure they leave Gaza in complete anarchy.

When a policeman uses force to arrest a violent criminal, do you condemn his actions too?

Face it - the only possible way to ensure compliance is violence. A rule, not backed up by force, is only a suggestion.

	18-04-2004 08:35									#95
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Tripledoc "We will all die one day. Nothing will change. If by Apache or by cardiac arrest, I prefer Apache." Abdel Aziz Rantisi. I have to respect that. A courageous man.

No, he isn't. He simply finds a death in bed more frightful. Lack of fear is not courage, it's a mental disorder.

	18-04-2004 08:37									#96
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Kucinich When a policeman uses force to arrest a violent criminal, do you condemn his actions too? Face it - the only possible way to ensure compliance is violence. A rule, not backed up by force, is only a suggestion.

Wow, we agree on something. That's right. Anybody see the movie "Walking Tall".. The Rock just didn't stand there and let things fall apart, he went out and pulverized several bad guys.

	18-04-2004 08:39									#97
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Tripledoc It will, because I intend to write it.

you're goal in life is to be a revisionist historian?

	18-04-2004 08:43									#98
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: In my view two people are largely responsible for the violence: Ariel Sharon and Bush.

gotta love ya, Aggie

Of course, the actual terrorists aren't particularly responsible for their actions, and let's just ignore the fact that this conflict preceded Bush by decades.

	18-04-2004 08:44									#99
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Apparently, the next leader of Hamas will stay a secret

I wonder how effective a leader whom no one knows of will be.

Or maybe he'll go around disguised like a masked villian?



or maybe:

	18-04-2004 08:50									#100
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Edan Apparently, the next leader of Hamas will stay a secret

The IDF should simply begin popping senior people, one by one, as long as the bombings continue.

Stop the bombings, stop the missile attacks on senior leaders.

	18-04-2004 10:03									#101
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

He lived by the sword, he died by the sword. I hate the double-standard here. He avocated and planned the deaths of many Israelis. Of course the Israelis will return the favor.

	18-04-2004 10:05									#102
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Kucinich you're goal in life is to be a revisionist historian?

It's a churchill quote, idiot.

	18-04-2004 10:08									#103
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Kucinich quote: In my view two people are largely responsible for the violence: Ariel Sharon and Bush. gotta love ya, Aggie Of course, the actual terrorists aren't particularly responsible for their actions, and let's just ignore the fact that this conflict preceded Bush by decades.

OMFFG he PWND you.

	18-04-2004 10:53									#104
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Jaguar It's a churchill quote, idiot.

Yes, but it doesn't work coming from a random poster on a civ gaming site off-topic forum.

	18-04-2004 12:11									#105
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by notyoueither The IDF should simply begin popping senior people, one by one, as long as the bombings continue. Stop the bombings, stop the missile attacks on senior leaders.

	18-04-2004 12:36									#106
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

fuel the flames and you'll both end up dead

	18-04-2004 13:55									#107
	Tired of ads?

I haven't been following the news very well, but were there any bombings since Rantisi rose to power?

	18-04-2004 13:56									#108
	Support Apolyton

Israelis go kill this guy please.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...id=540&ncid=716

GAZA CITY, Gaza Strip - Hamas secretly appointed a new Gaza Strip (news - web sites) chief early Sunday, but refused to reveal his identity after Israel assassinated two of the militant group's top leaders in less than a month, Hamas sources said.

----------------------

Whoever he is..

	18-04-2004 14:27									#109
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Interesting the Australian Foreign Minister stopped short of outright condemming the assasination.

quote: Foreign Minister Alexander Downer says Israel's assassination of Hamas leader Abdel-Aziz al-Rantissi is regrettable and will inflame tensions in the Middle East. But Mr Downer stopped short of condemning the killing, saying Hamas was a terrorist organisation which had targeted Israeli civilians. The Israeli army confirmed it had killed Rantissi, the leader of the hardline Palestinian movement, in an air strike on his car in Gaza City. Rantissi, a co-founder of Hamas, had become one of its two main leaders since Israel's killing of Hamas spiritual head Sheikh Ahmed Yassin in Gaza on March 22. Mr Downer said Australia did not condone the assassinations. "Assassinating, yet again, the leader of Hamas is regrettable because I think inevitably this is going to lead to a rise in tension amongst the Palestinians and the Arab world more generally," he told reporters. "Though, of course, from the Israeli perspective, Hamas is an organisation which has deliberately targeted and killed innocent Israelis."

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2...2226630910.html

	18-04-2004 14:46									#110
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: "Though, of course, from the Israeli perspective, Hamas is an organisation which has deliberately targeted and killed innocent Israelis."

Outrageous lies! Bush is to blame!

	18-04-2004 16:28									#111
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Israelis, I think the words you are all looking for are "Giancarlo, stay off our side!"

	18-04-2004 16:30									#112
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Regarding the comment from the Australian foreign minister there is a very important qualification, and that is that he says "from the Israeli perspective" Hamas is a terrorist organisation. Does that mean that from the Australian perspective Hamas is not a terrorist organisation?

	18-04-2004 16:58									#113
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Yes I think its on the lines of: They dont attack us , they are not our enemys

	18-04-2004 19:05									#114
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Colon I haven't been following the news very well, but were there any bombings since Rantisi rose to power?

Despite the warnings of an unprecedented earthquake like attack as revenge by Hamas (and by the press and the international community...) after Yassin was killed a month ago, the first "successful" bombing was yesterday - and last I heard, there were four injuries and no deaths.

	18-04-2004 19:10									#115
	Suffering from ads?

Actually, one of them died.

	18-04-2004 19:47									#116
	Suffering from ads?

Agathon - Excellent post (pg 3). After the discussion yesterday I found myself wondering what your approach would look like. I intended to ask today but you had already posted in the meantime. I must say I disagree with your position but do find it thoughtful and valid in many respects.

	18-04-2004 20:48									#117
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Seeker Israelis, I think the words you are all looking for are "Giancarlo, stay off our side!"

You remind me of a hilarious quote. I don't mind Giancarlo's support. If only he were more thoughtful.

	18-04-2004 21:29									#118
	Support Apolyton

This should help Sharon buy off a mayority of Likud for his little Gaza plan.

Unfortunitelly, while the whole "leave all the settlement's part" is great, the whole "retain all control of access to Gaza from the outside world" is crap-Israel is 'leaving Gaza', except at the ports, the airport,oh, and the border with Egypt.......

As for Hamas, yes, they are weaker in terms of putting somehting together. Lets give them 3 years for the leadership to build up, morph and become secretive, and then we will return to the good old days, cause NO, I don't see Dahlan having the political power to do anything.

	18-04-2004 21:32									#119
	Got spare money?

quote: Unfortunitelly, while the whole "leave all the settlement's part" is great, the whole "retain all control of access to Gaza from the outside world" is crap-Israel is 'leaving Gaza', except at the ports, the airport,oh, and the border with Egypt.......

Do you have any alternative control over those? The PA? Hamas?

quote: As for Hamas, yes, they are weaker in terms of putting somehting together.

I am glad you concur.

quote: Lets give them 3 years for the leadership to build up, morph and become secretive,

uhhh, what gave you the idea that Israel will?

quote: and then we will return to the good old days, cause NO, I don't see Dahlan having the political power to do anything.

Sadly, currently, I agree. But I think this can change.

	18-04-2004 21:36									#120
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Azazel Do you have any alternative control over those? The PA? Hamas?

NO, I don;t. BUt of course, I am not the one trying to implement a half plan on the ground. Israel can't claim to have left Gaza and still control access. Of course, whomever was going to gain political control of Gaza should take those over-too bad Sharon didn;t say anything about that part....

quote: uhhh, what gave you the idea that Israel will?

If the leaders begin to hide their identity, and it becomes harder for Israel to keep spies and informants in Gaza, what makes you think Israel will have the ability to do anything about it?