16-05-2004 03:43									#31
	Support Apolyton

and high heavens

quote: Population: 2856 Political Freedoms: Outlawed Economy: Frightening Compulsory Military Service: Yes Space Program: Yes Defence: Priority Fundamentalist Religion: Yes Defensive Military Strength: 127 Offensive Military Strength: 127

	16-05-2004 03:46									#32
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Azan

quote: Population: 74 Political Freedoms: Unheard Of Economy: Good Compulsory Military Service: Yes Space Program: No Defence: Not Mentioned Fundamentalist Religion: No Defensive Military Strength: 2 Offensive Military Strength: 5

	16-05-2004 03:48									#33
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

jonchastan

quote: Population: 213 Political Freedoms: Good Economy: Developing Compulsory Military Service: Yes Space Program: Yes Defence: Not Mentioned Fundamentalist Religion: No Defensive Military Strength: 7 Offensive Military Strength: 4

	16-05-2004 03:48									#34
	Increase the size of your Attachments

How are those numbers determined? I couldn't find any of their rationale or methodology on the site.

	16-05-2004 03:49									#35
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Guardinia

quote: Population: 2809 Political Freedoms: Some Economy: Strong Compulsory Military Service: Yes Space Program: Yes Defence: Not Mentioned Fundamentalist Religion: No Defensive Military Strength: 34 Offensive Military Strength: 28

	16-05-2004 03:51									#36
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Ceroo

quote: Population: 2924 Political Freedoms: Average Economy: Powerhouse Compulsory Military Service: Yes Space Program: Yes Defence: Not Mentioned Fundamentalist Religion: No Defensive Military Strength: 68 Offensive Military Strength: 34

	16-05-2004 03:52									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Azazel I cannot, sadly, since my nation was deleted. What can I do? It had a big population.... Maybe I should start a new one, and multiply some factors?

your nation was restarted for this role playing as Former Azan.

	16-05-2004 03:54									#38
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger nm. looks crappy.

id say that based on the numbers it gives for noosland

	16-05-2004 03:54									#39
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

So Hive and High Heavens using these numbers can attack and effectively take on every nation mentioned and probably everybody elses second nation aswell ... i doubt it.

As UR says, its naff.

	16-05-2004 03:56									#40
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

no it uses the economy and what nationstates says is your priorities....

if you bene slecting issues that put dfence lower then you numbers will be lower..

Yes the hive nad high heavens are huge, but rightyl so...

but i thought this war was only agaisnt the hive, havent seen high heaven enter the role play yet !!

	16-05-2004 04:01									#41
	Got spare money?

Again, how does it use the economy and national priorities?

What are the multipliers? What is their methodology? How do they justify their results? Have they tried modelling real-world nations to see how their system works?

Without any of that, it's just another set of arbitrary numbers.

	16-05-2004 04:05									#42
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

It's very basic doubles and halves on a few selected factors by the looks of it

	16-05-2004 04:30									#43
	Get a bigger avatar today!

i agree. but it is a start.. i fdotn have the rea lworld info to work out a spreadsheet, so til lsome one hee does, thes enumbers are probalb ythe closest we gonig to get...

	16-05-2004 06:23									#44
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

No, it's not a start. It's a pile of crap. When it ranks Auldoninna as being just behind the Hive (which is the biggest military power in the region and is over two and a half times bigger than Auldoninna in both population and economic strength), and twice as big as Centralis, which has similar size advantages and was quite high on the military spending list last time, then you know somebody's made a mistake.

	16-05-2004 08:40									#45
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Exactly, when it told me that Auldoninna is at least twice as big as my other nation, which got 1/3 more population than them and has a 'Frightening' economy.

	16-05-2004 09:27									#46
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by GeneralTacticus No, it's not a start. It's a pile of crap. When it ranks Auldoninna as being just behind the Hive (which is the biggest military power in the region and is over two and a half times bigger than Auldoninna in both population and economic strength), and twice as big as Centralis, which has similar size advantages and was quite high on the military spending list last time, then you know somebody's made a mistake.

aghh i see when we get a system that says you are the biggest it will beaccepted

as for size of natio n, why is that relevant, if it was india would have a military 3-4 times that the size of USA...

and woh said the hive are the biggest military power in the region ??? where did that come from ?? and econmic strength it certianly not twice my size... agai nwhere do you get those numbers from....

	16-05-2004 09:29									#47
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

A few days ago on Nation States the ranking was "largest defence industry" or something. The Hive and the High Heavens were 1-2, IIRC.

	16-05-2004 09:31									#48
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Also... I know I should be at the bottom of any system's list, and I have a problem with this one, not necessarily because of the results it gives, but because there is absolutely no indication of how or why it gives the results it does.

	16-05-2004 09:33									#49
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Exactly, when it told me that Auldoninna is at least twice as big as my other nation, which got 1/3 more population than them and has a 'Frightening' economy.

thats because it builds into its calculation the fact you have a defnece as a priority , if you hav ebeen asnwering issues differntly in nationstates then your military will be smaller...

to me it seems it jsut bases the numbers on pop size, econmy rating and your defence policys and a relgios state gets extra defendrs...


that al lseems to be ok to me... numbers may not be exact science but it gives sometihng to compare too..

	16-05-2004 09:33									#50
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: aghh i see when we get a system that says you are the biggest it will beaccepted

It will be accepted when it conforms to some basic notion of reality. The fact that I will be ranked quite highly is a side-effect.

quote: as for size of natio n, why is that relevant, if it was india would have a military 3-4 times that the size of USA...

I see my point regarding the economy sailed right over your head. India does have a stronge rmiltiary than the US because it can't afford one. If India's GDP per capita wa son the same elvel as the US, you can bet they'd have a much stronger military.

quote: and woh said the hive are the biggest military power in the region ??? where did that come from ?? and econmic strength it certianly not twice my size... agai nwhere do you get those numbers from....

Oh, I don't know... perhaps from the NS site we're all RPing from? The Hive is one of the biggest nations in Apolyton in population, has consistently been the biggest when it comes to per capita military spending, and comes out at the top for practically every economic sector.

	16-05-2004 09:34									#51
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by joncha A few days ago on Nation States the ranking was "largest defence industry" or something. The Hive and the High Heavens were 1-2, IIRC.

didnt see tha tone, i olnt seen the largest industrial one lately ...

	16-05-2004 09:36									#52
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

if you check the number sthe hive is larger than my nations military so why the problem ...

	16-05-2004 09:38									#53
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by GeneralTacticus Oh, I don't know... perhaps from the NS site we're all RPing from? The Hive is one of the biggest nations in Apolyton in population, has consistently been the biggest when it comes to per capita military spending, and comes out at the top for practically every economic sector.

i dont see any posts herre where i claim the hive is small or tha ti larger than hive. Even the numbers from this spreadsheet thingy support those details, so why ar epeople gettig upset....

	16-05-2004 09:41									#54
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: if you check the number sthe hive is larger than my nations military so why the problem ...

The problem is that's it's only just bigger than you, when you're less than half it's size in population and below it in every economic ranking and in per capita military spending.

quote: i dont see any posts herre where i claim the hive is small or tha ti larger than hive. Even the numbers from this spreadsheet thingy support those details, so why ar epeople gettig upset....

quote: and woh said the hive are the biggest military power in the region ??? where did that come from ?? and econmic strength it certianly not twice my size... agai nwhere do you get those numbers from....

Try again.

	16-05-2004 09:57									#55
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Rasputin thats because it builds into its calculation the fact you have a defnece as a priority , if you hav ebeen asnwering issues differntly in nationstates then your military will be smaller...

Try again. First of all, strength does not directly correlate to size, as you so eagerly pointed out earlier. Secondly, if your military strength were to be 2 times mine (other country), with it being 1/3 bigger than you, your military spending would be through the roof. Even if I grant you tech parity, which seems unlikely. Suppose my military spending is 3% GDP (just to make things easier) per capita, yours would be at least 8%. Again, that's ignoring tech differences.

quote: Originally posted by Rasputin that al lseems to be ok to me... numbers may not be exact science but it gives sometihng to compare too..

Given that there are several severe bugs (e.g. some countries are getting double population growth than the rest) in the program, inconsistent time scales, and other issues, there are no validity to these numbers.

	16-05-2004 10:05									#56
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

well based on all that i would say vlaidit yin anything any of these spreadsheets produce such as GDP or Ecomic worth, al lwe have t ogo by then is Size and Ecocomic Strenght as posted at nationstates, if that is all we got then why are be bothering to role paly a war , the hive and high heavens can just wipe out everybody...

seems a complete waste of space ...

	16-05-2004 10:09									#57
	Put an end to popups!

I think a spreadsheet program could be good. The ones posted so far seem a little wonky to me. If they could be modeled such that inputing a RL nation's info produced a RL result, then I'd say go for it. Otherwise it just seems like a justification for god-modding.

	16-05-2004 10:12									#58
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Just to keep the military hardware theme going, here's the JPS Revolution.

Attachment: ffk-951_fffk-2.jpg
This has been downloaded 30 time(s).

	16-05-2004 10:16									#59
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by joncha I think a spreadsheet program could be good. The ones posted so far seem a little wonky to me. If they could be modeled such that inputing a RL nation's info produced a RL result, then I'd say go for it. Otherwise it just seems like a justification for god-modding.

Well said.

	16-05-2004 10:37									#60
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

whixh real nation thoguh ??