28-05-2004 10:56									#31
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Great work, guys

Can't imagine how much work has gone into all this.

All the best.

	29-05-2004 20:49									#32
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BTW, any ETA on when the first patch may be completed?

	29-05-2004 23:46									#33
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The 2004.05.19 CTP2 Apolyton Edition can be downloaded from the first post in this thread. It is very stable. Give it a try.

	30-05-2004 02:26									#34
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No estimations Leonidas but updates on the code are released frequently with fixes and minor additions.

	30-05-2004 03:15									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Leonidas BTW, any ETA on when the first patch may be completed?

Well it is finished when it is finished. To specify it a little bit more, it is released when we have reimplemented all features that Activision's patch addresses, at least the important ones and unfortunatly these improtant onces are multiplayer related issures. And we don't have a programmer here you love it to play MP.

-Martin

	30-05-2004 10:45									#36
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Regarding 2004[1].0403.CTP2Playtest

My 7 year old played a complete game today while I was at work. When I got home, he showed me some features that you guys added. He prefers the "lime green" flag. He said that he didn't notice any play problems, and that he won! It was on "easy", but still, this is the next generation cutting their teeth on the greatest strategy game ever! He started playing CTP2 about 2 years ago.

Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it. Proverbs 22:6

Thanks so much! Now I have got to install 10554_2004.05.19.CTP2Playtest

Gordon

	30-05-2004 19:14									#37
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I note that on our to-do list we still have:

* Increased animation queue to 12, making unit-in-wrong-place bug less likely.

Has anyone actually seen this bug in their playtests?

In CTP it happens a lot more in MP games than SP games, so I guess it might be hard to tell if it's still a problem.

	30-05-2004 20:43									#38
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quote: Originally posted by J Bytheway I note that on our to-do list we still have: * Increased animation queue to 12, making unit-in-wrong-place bug less likely. Has anyone actually seen this bug in their playtests?

Did some multiplayer games in the last days and will go on with that, but I had no such problems. What happens exactly when the error happens?
(So I can take more care to check if he still occures).

Are there any known conditions that cause the error or make him more likely?

But I did encounter another problem. Sometimes the population grow for player 1 will not take place. I observed this 2 or 3 times when starting the game and I have only 1 city with a population between 10000 and 20000. Is this a known bug?

Anyway is there a list of known bugs, beside the list in the "To do list"- thread?

Ludwig

	30-05-2004 20:48									#39
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First of all, excellent job so far on the 2004.05.19 build. It played very well and I have only a few comments. The only real 'issue' I had, and perhaps it's already known, but the only crash I experience is when I try to build the Solaris Project. The game crashes to the desktop. I'm on a WinXP machine with 256Mb memory and plenty of HD space. A few other comments, albeit fairly minor:
1) I don't like a real civ and the barbarians essentially using the same (or very nearly the same) red color.
2) Love to CTC working with the new build. I love the CTC functionality, and with a stable base game, I bet it would be great!
3) A few of the civilopedia links bring up the wrong entry.
4) It would be nice if the Solaris Project civilopedia entry actually told you how to use this victory condition. I never remember how many of what needs to be built and stuff like that. Of course, I haven't had a stable version of the game for so long either... haven't gotten to this stage for a long time.

Anyway, Great job and I with I had the skills and patience some of you do to do this type of work.
John in Dallas
Johnc214@aol.com

	30-05-2004 22:46									#40
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quote: Originally posted by johnc214 1) I don't like a real civ and the barbarians essentially using the same (or very nearly the same) red color.

So which color do you suggest for the Barbarians then. That does not interfer with one of the other 31 colors and can be read against a nearly black background. And looks good. And of course the player must be allowed to use one of the major colors in a 5 player game like red, orage, green, yellow and blue.

quote: Originally posted by johnc214 3) A few of the civilopedia links bring up the wrong entry.

Did you play a standart game or a CTC game, if it is a CTC game then it is up to the modder to fix this.

quote: Originally posted by johnc214 4) It would be nice if the Solaris Project civilopedia entry actually told you how to use this victory condition. I never remember how many of what needs to be built and stuff like that. Of course, I haven't had a stable version of the game for so long either... haven't gotten to this stage for a long time.

You need to cover 60% of the world with your obelisks, so if you have less coverage you have to build more then the minimum and of course you also need to cover the oceans.

One thing for the Solaris Project, I can swear I read today, a report about a crash when it is build, for that I can confirm that this crash occurs in the Activision's patched version as well.

-Martin

	30-05-2004 23:30									#41
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: So which color do you suggest for the Barbarians then. That does not interfer with one of the other 31 colors and can be read against a nearly black background. And looks good. And of course the player must be allowed to use one of the major colors in a 5 player game like red, orage, green, yellow and blue.

I would disagree, red was fine for the barbarians. How many of us are going to use all the colours upto player 31? But how many of us are going to see barbarians? Red just doesnt feel right as a player colour to me...

	31-05-2004 03:06									#42
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I must admit I like the blue color for the human player (that means me) and the red for the barbarians. Red is the color of anger and blood... doesn't it suit them perfectly?

	31-05-2004 04:05									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Tamerlin Red is the color of anger and blood...

Well then you can understand perfectly, why someone want to take this color. Well isn't then blue the color of peace and sweet temper.

-Martin

	31-05-2004 04:21									#44
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blue is NATO
red is Warsaw Pact

	31-05-2004 04:37									#45
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It was red in civ1

	31-05-2004 04:56									#46
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This issues comes up time and again. Thing is, everyone has their own preferences. Martin has his colour set, I have mine, everyone has different ideas. But the vast majority does seem to prefer using blue for player 1 and red for barbarians (this is also the most practical: using different shades of the same colour for the two most prominent players is confusing, and probably even unworkable for people with a visual handicap). So it would seem only logical to have the default colour set meet these demands. People who don't like that can always switch to a different set, like Martin and me.

	31-05-2004 05:02									#47
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Then there would be a way to satisfy everyone, to allow the player to chose the color of the barbarians.

	31-05-2004 05:12									#48
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I thought someone had posted in Altered Source Files an added option to switch between Colors00.txt and Colors01.txt, Color02.txt etc. from the new game setup menu, but I cannot find it so maybe I was dreaming.

	31-05-2004 05:14									#49
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It was an options in userprofile.txt, not in any in-game menu.

But even with such an option present, you still need to provide a good default set.

	31-05-2004 15:41									#50
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

just had an interesting observation:
was playing the russians as boris gruchenko and got the message that ivan of the russians began to work on a wonder
so there are two russian nations allowed if you change leader names?

#civs 12, max# 30, myself being player number 4.
impossible, large donutworld

	31-05-2004 18:01									#51
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Zaphod Beeblebrox just had an interesting observation: was playing the russians as boris gruchenko and got the message that ivan of the russians began to work on a wonder so there are two russian nations allowed if you change leader names? #civs 12, max# 30, myself being player number 4. impossible, large donutworld

And how many civs were and had been in the game at that point, I had double civs in a game with a lot of revolting and assimilation. However at sometime there is a point reached, when the game as to include a civ twice. So when all of the civs have been on the game field.

-Martin

	31-05-2004 18:08									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Martin Gühmann ... However at sometime there is a point reached, when the game as to include a civ twice. So when all of the civs have been on the game field... -Martin

i doubt thats the fact, turn 44 and after a short look without the fog of war the other russians seem to be one of the biggest guys around.

if you like the savegame?

EDIT: PS:
and i don't mind an old civ to come back somewhere, but an existing double civ doesn't look that fine. unless its a feature like gdr/frg, n/s korea, n/s yemen, e/w rome and so on

	31-05-2004 19:49									#53
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quote: Originally posted by EPW Scenarios seem to work though player 1 is red instead of blue. I'm not sure if I had to select the color before starting the scenario but I would think that the default color should be blue.

With the 2004.05.19 playtest build, you can change the colors by editing userprofile.txt and changing the value at the 'ColorSet' line at the bottom. If you set the value to 3, you will get blue.

The value at this 'ColorSet' line will determine which of the ctp2_data\default\gamedata\colors##.txt files is selected when playing. You may even add a new one yourself, if you don't like any of the supplied color schemes.

I agree with Locutus that we should reinstate the original color set as colors00.txt.

	31-05-2004 20:07									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Fromafar I agree with Locutus that we should reinstate the original color set as colors00.txt.

I disagree and by the way we don't have an original color set, the original color set just contains 16 player colors.

quote: Originally posted by Zaphod Beeblebrox i doubt thats the fact, turn 44 and after a short look without the fog of war the other russians seem to be one of the biggest guys around.

Well this shouldn't happen of course, however this with the new civs also happens if you continue a game that was started in another language before, so you play with the Germans and a new civs appears called Deutsche. Obviously it doesn't check the civ index.

-Martin

	31-05-2004 20:40									#55
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quote: Originally posted by Lui2 But I did encounter another problem. Sometimes the population grow for player 1 will not take place. I observed this 2 or 3 times when starting the game and I have only 1 city with a population between 10000 and 20000. Is this a known bug?

Do you mean there is no growth at all, or that the "partial" population drops 10000, but you do not get the extra citizen? See e.g. the bug report for PBEM.

I suspect there is a problem in the begin turn handling, where the 10000 is subtracted from the "partial" population immediately, but the population growth is deferred to an event - to be handled later. For SP, this doesn't seem to cause any problems. But there may be a problem if the generation of a save file occurs before the pop event has taken place.

	01-06-2004 02:54									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Fromafar Do you mean there is no growth at all, or that the "partial" population drops 10000, but you do not get the extra citizen? I suspect there is a problem in the begin turn handling, where the 10000 is subtracted from the "partial" population immediately, but the population growth is deferred to an event - to be handled later. For SP, this doesn't seem to cause any problems. But there may be a problem if the generation of a save file occurs before the pop event has taken place.

No this is another problem. After testing now for an hour with the version from 2004-05-19, i got the condition that causes the error.
Conditions:
1) Be the first player in a multiplayer game.
2) End your turn.
3) Push F3 before you're again the active player.
4) Let the city manager window open, until it will be closed automaticly, when you become the active player.

What happens:
1) You did not get the city grow for the city shown before in the city manager.
2) Your build project time in the city will not be reduce by one.
3) If the build project had only one round to finish, the project (e.g. a unit) will be build and be in the city.
4) The build project remains again with one round to go in the city, if the project was a unit.

With this behavoir, you can now build each turn one of the chosen unit.

Supposed reason:
I guess the problem is caused by the still open city
manager window, when the turn comes again to player one. The city data was probably already computed and by closing the open window, the data that's shown on the window will be copied back to the current data.

Hope someone can fix this bad bug!

	01-06-2004 03:07									#57
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I got another problem in multiplayer with version '2004-05-19':

After loading a saved game (about turn 150) the second player got an error shown in a window on the desktop that says:

'GC000.SPR' not found in asset tree.

After pushing than the OK button, the ctp2 ends and goes back to desktop.

As a workaround I copied the GC028.SPR file to a file named GC000.SPR and could with this avoid the error.
But i guess that's not the way it should be.

I attached the save game that causes the error, if someone wants to test/debug the problem.

Edit:
Here's the crash.txt for the error.
0x0040f16c [?GetNextPosition@Anim@@QAEJJ@Z + 0xc]
0x0040eb5f [?Process@Action@@UAEXXZ + 0xf]
0x0043de43 [?ProcessLayerSprites@TiledMap@@QAEXPAUtagRECT@@J@Z + 0x1a3]
0x0042b4a7 [?Process@Director@@QAEXXZ + 0x87]
0x0040c8e2 [?Process@CivApp@@QAEJXZ + 0x112]
0x00407608 [?CivWinMain@@YGHPAUHINSTANCE__@@0PADH@Z + 0x3a8]
0x004070c5 [WinMain@16 + 0x65]
0x00795b8c [WinMainCRTStartup + 0x134]
0x77e614c7 [__onexitbegin + 0x773693ef]

Attachment: alexan-grie-1125v.rar
This has been downloaded 2 time(s).

Last edited by Lui2 on 02-06-2004 at 01:12

	01-06-2004 06:15									#58
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arghhhhh!
mayors plow my important airfields into farms
can't remember such things happen in the vanilla game, though i'm not really sure.

	02-06-2004 00:21									#59
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I've started a playtest 'mini-FAQ' in the second post, which I had previously reserved for such purposes. Any other suggestions for inclusion there are welcome.

	02-06-2004 01:55									#60
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

@ Zaphod Beeblebrox

Mayors always used to do that - maybe you didn't experience this behaviour due to poor PW reserve
However: I am using this little piece of SLIC to keep them off building their farms and shopping centers over my valuable military facilities:

code:

///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// Preserve facilities
// Code snippet from City Expansion by BlueO, Pedrunn and IW
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

// Prevents the building of tile improvements over forts 
// and air bases - except for the replacement of 
// one of these 'military' ti's by another one and except 
// for roads, railroads, maglevs.

HandleEvent(CreateImprovement) 'DontLetPlaceImpsOverForts' pre {	
	if(TileHasFacility(location[0])) {
		if(value[0] == TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_ROAD)
		|| value[0] == TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_RAILROAD)
		|| value[0] == TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_MAGLEV)
		|| value[0] == TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_UNDERSEA_TUNNEL)
		|| value[0] == TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_FORTIFICATIONS)
		|| value[0] == TerrainImprovementDB(TILEIMP_AIR_BASES)) {
			// really odd: != does not work in the above statements			
		}
		else {
			return STOP;
		}
	}
}