11-07-2004 14:08									#91
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Raging Dragon original, @ Civfanatics

http://www.civfanatics.com/civ2scenmod.shtml

Scroll down about 3/4

	11-07-2004 18:30									#92
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Thanks typhoon!

	11-07-2004 21:31									#93
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Okay, here is Steph's brilliant map of North America. Now as I said before it is unfinished but it has all of the major rivers and waterways included.

It extends as far north as Hudsons Bay and as far south as Panama. It includes most of Newfoundland in the east and Vancouver Island in the west. It also includes the Carribean islands of Hispanola, Jamaica, Cuba and the Bahamas.

Attachment: north america.zip
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	11-07-2004 22:02									#94
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Thanks a lot, Sarsstock! I'll take a look, see how maybe things should be laid out, and get back to you.

	12-07-2004 23:26									#95
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As an avid enviromentalist and lover of fuel efficiency, there is not a single vehicle I hate more than the H2, the urbanized Humvee.

However if a conflict were to break out in the western United States over California, I imagine several wealthy Californian's could form militias patrols which make use of their H2's. The end result would be highly mobile yet poorly defended units.

Attachment: h2 unit set.gif
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	13-07-2004 03:29									#96
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P.S. I hope you survived that hail storm you guys had out in Edmonton man, I couldn't believe the damage it did to the West Edmonton Mall out there.

	13-07-2004 03:58									#97
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Here's a more detailed H2 that Steph was kind enough to advise me on. I angled the rear, raised the suspension and shortened the hood. I also gave the roof a sunroof as opposed to the turret I had the gunner standing out of before.

Attachment: h2 unit set #2.gif
This has been downloaded 114 time(s).

	13-07-2004 15:47									#98
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Sorry I took so long getting back to you, but that storm you commented on downed Internet service for several hours. Anyway, those are great H2's; any other good units. BTW, those Western Rangers and CF-18's from your screenshot, can you post them up. And, if you don't mind, that Canadian city style.

I took a look at the map, and it will need work (most of it's hills), and maybe, for this scenario's purposes, Central America, Southern Mexico, and Hispaniola with Mercator's MapEdit Utility, as I don't think they'll be needed, really. Do you know if Steph or someone else could otherwise finish the map, as it would likely take me a month, and even then it would be patchy and inaccurate.

	13-07-2004 16:23									#99
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Another thought. The Californian and Hispanic revolts could be timed to happen when many American troops are called back to Afghanistan and Iraq when the pro-American regimes there start to collapse and even, further stretching U.S. internal order, a hypothetical war in Korea (Bush wouldn't really expect revolt on the home front). Canada would be similarly penalized by peacekeeping missions abroad. However, at a certain turn, they could get 'reinforcements' (recalled units), which would create a number of units in the East (or Ontario, in Canada's case). The seccessionists would have several turns to get entrenched before then, though. Let me know what you think.

	13-07-2004 22:18									#100
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The way I was seeing it was that this takes place after a decade long recession has drained the US reserves and left America drowning in foreign debt.

California on the other hand has prospered under the Govenator, and has grown to believe like many Quebecois believe that they are a country, not a mere state and province. Further more, they don't want to be saddled with the rest of America's debt and problems.

	14-07-2004 02:25									#101
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That's certainly a good idea too. Perhaps military cutbacks by the U.S. Federal Gov't also make the time oppotune for Californian revolt. As for the Hispanics, well they could be funded and organized by Fidel Castro's brother Raul after the elder's death, and maybe (for this scenario), Raul proves more militant and activist in his anti-Americanism than his brother. Quebec, the West, and the First Nations in Canada, meanwhile, seek their own sovereignty against a weak coalition in Ottawa. A possibility for a Western leader is Harper, frustrated with dealing with Parliament, is nominated by a "Western Sovereignty Council" as President. Quebec would either be under Duceppe or that Parti Quebecois leader (I can't remember his name) and the First Nations would have reelected the militant Grand Chief Matthew Coon ***. Canada and the U.S.'s Federal leaders would be hard to say in ten years. What do you think?

	14-07-2004 08:33									#102
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Well I think when your dealing with predictions of the future anything is possible. I've always felt that what fosters the need for independance more than anything is that your being held back by a backwards power, that you and you alone are more entitled to rule over your territory than what you perceive as a foreign government.

Now having said that, I think your idea is a plausible one. The Govenator could easily be in power in nine to ten years, as could Harper and the other Canadian politicians you mentioned. I even believe that Raul Castro could make the transition to become Cuba's leader.

Now unfortunatly the White House is far more difficult to predict. Liberal or Conservative, Republican or Democrat, your guess is as good as mine. Lets try to make it interesting with someone like President Hillary Clinton as a Democrat or John Mccain for a Republican.

	14-07-2004 16:46									#103
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I agree with your selection of White House candidates, though your Confederation PM, I think, if it's a more left-wing coalition, Martin might still be in power, or maybe one of his opponents like Shiela Copps or Mike (I can't remember his last name, I think it had 'Iron' in it, but he ran against Martin in the leadership race), or if it's more right-wing (Conservatives supported by a fan of right-wing fringe parties), a more Eastern Conservative like Belinda Stronach or Peter McKay. I think those are some good options. What do you think?

	14-07-2004 22:09									#104
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Prime Minister Shiela Copps? Only us Canadians would see the humour in that. I agree its easily possible that Ms. Belinda Stronach or Peter McKay would be the likely choices for a Conservative PM.

Now it just occured to me that I'll have to design a new flag to represent the First Nations, as the current flag I provided would be for a first nations community loyal to Ottawa, hence the two red bars. No worries though, almost all of the major Canadian tribes have their own individual flags. I could easily throw one together the way I put the Grand Alberta flag together.

	14-07-2004 22:47									#105
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I agree that Shiela Copps or even Alan Rock (the one I was thinking of; I don't know where Mike Ironblank came from; a brain twitch, I suppose) would be unlikely at best, though admittedly Martin's shakeup of the Liberal power structure make determining his successor quite difficult. Anyway, maybe Martin remaining in power (he'd, what, only be in his late 60's, early 70's at that point) or a Tory would be easiest to manage prediction-wise. I'd like to see your First Nations flag, and then maybe we can get down to proposing what units and Wonders will need graphics.

	16-07-2004 02:57									#106
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I could use some good flags in a scen I'm finishing now. If anyone is interested . . .

A Turkish/Mongol skull-on-a-stick type thing. With feathers or hair or something like that.

A Byzantine c. 1000 AD flag

A Frankish/French banner, same period.

A HRE flag, same etc.

A Castilian/Leon banner, etc.

Either a Norman or Venetian flag, etc., whichever looks better.

Shields to go with these flags would be nice too, but not essential. It would just mean more work for me.

thnx.

	16-07-2004 04:25									#107
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Some of these are from much later Phenix, but I don't think you'll find equivalents for 1000 AD.

Attachment: flags gb.gif
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	16-07-2004 04:52									#108
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@fairline: as usual... ( I'll PM you ASAP - it's a menace )

	16-07-2004 07:35									#109
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Anything you can provide Gareth, is cool with me. These flags will work perfectly.

Email me and I'll tell you about this latest scen. I'm fighting the last few things to get it just right.

Might take a week or two though.

You wanna see the units file?

	16-07-2004 20:10									#110
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Gareth I just love the Castille flag and shield.... BRILLIANT!!

	16-07-2004 22:24									#111
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@Sarsstock, I think that many of the U.S. units could be borrowed from Panda's Crises scenario, and Cuban units from a scenario called Cubafree (I can't remember the author, but I'll find out and both authors would be given credit in the Readme), though most other units would need to be custom-made. The Canadian Infantry, Californian H2 rig-up, CF-18, and Western Rangers are all good as I see (though I'll need copies of the latter two, please), but if you have any other unit (or even Wonder) ideas, I'd like to hear (or see) them. I thought maybe either WEM or Disneyland could replace the Colossus; other Wonders are up in the air.

	16-07-2004 23:00									#112
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Just to make sure everyone notices it. I merged Exile's latest post into this thread just now.

Last edited by Mercator on 16-07-2004 at 23:13

	17-07-2004 01:55									#113
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Well I had one wonder idea kicking around.... The Las Vegas Strip. Because what happens in Vegas, stays in Vegas, and with that slogan in hand it should raise the moral of the entire country.

I'll provide you with those units shortly, if you have any wonder idea's feel free to let me know.

	17-07-2004 04:08									#114
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I thought as another wonder the Motown Industrial Complex (replacing King Richard's Crusade). There's a great graphic for it in academia's Iron_Curtain (which I also borrowed for my 'Late Cold War' scenario I made earlier this year).

	17-07-2004 09:16									#115
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Good idea. There should be wonders for all the civ's. Maybe Banff could be a wonder for Alberta, another "happy" wonder for it gives the entire country a world famous ski and summer resort.

Maybe we could stick the CN tower in Toronto too, let me know what you think.

	17-07-2004 11:50									#116
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quote: Originally posted by Exile Anything you can provide Gareth, is cool with me. These flags will work perfectly. Email me and I'll tell you about this latest scen. I'm fighting the last few things to get it just right. Might take a week or two though. You wanna see the units file?

Yes Did you get my e-mail?

Patine: Sorry for the threadjack

	17-07-2004 21:55									#117
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@Sarsstock, I agree with those two Wonders two. Maybe the Cubans could have either a revolution-based Wonder (possibly replacing J.S. Bach's Cathedral) or a 'militia training' one that could replace Sun Tzu's. I look forward to seeing the above mentioned graphics and any others you've cooked up.

@Fairline, don't worry about it. I believe the threads are for everyone (if they weren't, they'd have a password option).

	17-07-2004 23:47									#118
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On an off-topic note, I looked over the scenarios I was 'flagging up' and found I'd forgotten the African Union flag (I instead used the old OAU one). Do you think you could please slip me a good AU flag (it should be easy enough to find)? Thanks!

	18-07-2004 04:12									#119
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Actually, on that topic, could you please throw in Commonwealth and Nordic Conference flags (I've been using the Union Jack and Norweigan flags up till now, but I just today noticed on a flag source site they do indeed have their own flags)? If you could, I'd really appreciate it. Thanks!

Back to the current scen, I thought maybe the Americans' hailed Coast Guard (replacing the Lighthouse) and the 'balanced budget and fiscal responsibility' of Paul Martin (replacing Adam Smith's) could each provide a new Wonder for the each of the two Federal players. Let me know what you think!

	18-07-2004 19:28									#120
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Well if they do have their own flags that you've seen could you possible post them? It would make my job allot easier if you would show them to me so I have a reference right off the bat, that way I don't have to search for them myself.

I've already found the African and Commonwealth one, so if you could just show the nordic one I'd appreciate it.