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Sankis is offline Sankis
Warlord

Dec 2003
time: 00:34
  Old Post 18-05-2005 07:21
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angels up

update next turn

Barinthus is offline Barinthus
King
A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:34
  Old Post 21-05-2005 09:25
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Sent

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
The most erratic Overlord!
Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 21-05-2005 17:01
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Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

The turn is played, and only needs the 'press end' to forward, but I might have a bug to report.

At the start of my turn, I started a new tech, and the already done labpoints for this research were as usual close to zip. But at the end of the turn after all my moves and such, suddenly the research was way further.

Now my question is, is this a bug and need I replay the turn, or is this a known feature that happens when doing certain things?

Edit: PM'd Mart7x5 for this.

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
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Jan 2004
time: 06:34
Post  Old Post 21-05-2005 18:02
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Anyway, I forwarded the turn. Attached my turn here as well in case the CMN is interested...

Attachment: navalclash-bugreport.zip
This has been downloaded 1 time(s).

Rubin is offline Rubin
King
Datalinks
Mar 2003
time: 06:34
  Old Post 22-05-2005 18:35
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2225 to the Pirates.

The increase in research progress is an intended part of the game. It can happen via different events and I know salvaging Unity Pods and conquering bases do add to the current research.

---

This year, the University lets the holovids report on current event. (image attached)

Attachment: uraniumzero.jpg
This has been downloaded 38 time(s).

mart7x5 is offline mart7x5
King

Sep 2002
time: 22:34
  Old Post 22-05-2005 21:12
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I do not know how many points conquering a base can add.
In the early game each unity pod gives 1 point. Large bases can probably give quite a bunch of them.

Sankis is offline Sankis
Warlord

Dec 2003
time: 00:34
  Old Post 25-05-2005 23:45
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Sorry, had some finals this week.

Angels up

RP event post poned due to change of plans

Barinthus is offline Barinthus
King
A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:34
  Old Post 26-05-2005 09:44
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Played and sent

Rubin is offline Rubin
King
Datalinks
Mar 2003
time: 06:34
  Old Post 27-05-2005 16:51
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I received the turn, however, this is the final year of Atlantean existence on Chiron. The Nautilus Pirates has survived the Atlantean onslaught and the vast seas lie open for for Nautilus naval domination. To this, I believe the Naval Clash has finally come to an end.

My reason for posting now is that I consider this epic story concluded and I'd like to know how to proceed.

Geo, Barinthus and Sankis, please let me know what you think.

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
The most erratic Overlord!
Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 27-05-2005 17:29
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Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Most Atlanteans genetically engineered themself to live in the sea itself, not restricted by the limitations of their underwater hideouts. Unfortunately the Queen didn't live to see this day, as she was one of the casualties in the second nuclear blast upon Planet.

The affairs of their landwalking brethern is of no interest anymore to them, one could even argue if they're still human...

There they live now, floating, hunting, even dying, in the open waters of Chiron. They've become native...

mart7x5 is offline mart7x5
King

Sep 2002
time: 22:34
  Old Post 28-05-2005 02:55
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How is it possible for you, Rubin, to eliminate whole Atlantean faction that fast? Multiple planet busters? SinBusters?

Rubin is offline Rubin
King
Datalinks
Mar 2003
time: 06:34
  Old Post 28-05-2005 07:13
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quote:
Originally posted by mart7x5
How is it possible for you, Rubin, to eliminate whole Atlantean faction that fast? Multiple planet busters? SinBusters?


Well, as Geo stated "Most Atlanteans genetically engineered themself to live in the sea itself"...

My current turn confirms this, as only 3 Atlantean bases remain. I assume these bases are subject to 'genetical engineering' too--sometime during mission year 2226.

I should be able to take out at least one of these bases during mission year 2225; however, I have no such plans.

The Atlantean disappearance on Chiron is a matter only Geo can explain. Though, keep in mind that I have never been able to accept the Atlanteans to surrender while the Nautilus Pirates were still at risk of genocide. This risk is seemingly not present anymore; hence any plea to surrender shall be accepted--provided that the Nautilus Pirates are free to colonize the Chironian sea.

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
The most erratic Overlord!
Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 28-05-2005 14:31
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I 'eliminated' them myself, Mart. I simply don't feel like a 'long way down' anymore, although I could make Rubins' attempts at emptying Atlantean bases a bit harder in a few turns, and harass him in other ways.

But the main initial objective, removing the pirates, was pointless anyway for the faction I 'protected' was in war with me as well.

With this last statement of Rubin, again it comes forward that for core issues we weren't understanding eachother.

mart7x5 is offline mart7x5
King

Sep 2002
time: 22:34
  Old Post 28-05-2005 15:12
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I see, genetically engineered Atlanteans leave their bases. It looks like story have a conclusion. Unless the players wish to continue with 3 human factions.

Geo, that faction in war with you, you mean Gaians? Shouldn't Deirdre be submissive towards you?

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
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Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 28-05-2005 17:13
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Not anymore after I dropped a PB, that is.

mart7x5 is offline mart7x5
King

Sep 2002
time: 22:34
  Old Post 28-05-2005 17:34
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Geo, you first used PB in the game? .... I mean some crazy computer did it right?

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
The most erratic Overlord!
Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 28-05-2005 17:39
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No, it was an automated response on a sneak attack by the University.
No 'humans' came in the decision loop.

I probably could have forced the Gaians in a truce again, but they needed two bases for that.

Rubin is offline Rubin
King
Datalinks
Mar 2003
time: 06:34
  Old Post 30-05-2005 06:32
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Barinthus? Sankis? Are you reading?

Sankis is offline Sankis
Warlord

Dec 2003
time: 00:34
  Old Post 30-05-2005 07:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Rubin
Barinthus? Sankis? Are you reading?


I'm here.

We should just end it here, personally. The RP is pretty much concluded, and the actual game is an easy win for Rubin

Barinthus is offline Barinthus
King
A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:34
  Old Post 01-06-2005 06:27
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Alright, consider it finis.

I'm curious why did University feel the need to secure the seas for the Pirates?

Rubin is offline Rubin
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Datalinks
Mar 2003
time: 06:34
  Old Post 01-06-2005 08:35
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There were, as the story progressed, several pointers suggesting a University support to the Nautilus Pirates.

My memory may fail me, but I recall having the first diplomatic contact with the Pirates. We were close neighbors and came--without any problems--to a peaceful settlement of factional borders.

The Atlanteans were kind and cooperative is many ways. However, their aggressive exploration efforts (compared to the other human led factions)--and sometimes questionable investigations of Unity Pods--made the Atlantean intentions less obvious. When I see troops disembarking from a naval transport onto my main landmass, I do not rely on words and explanations--I rely on actions. The Atlanteans did--in what seems to me a greedy opportunity--land troops onto my main landmass and very close to my western border. While there were no signs of trespassing such actions were viewed as deliberate and legaly agressive.

The threat of a growing Atlantean Kingdom made it easy for the University to side with the pirates. While I cannot speak for the captain, it seemed to me that the Nautilus fleet was determined to contain the Atlantean naval domination--and potentially global domination.

Other foreign affairs further strengthened the pact between the University and the Nautilus Pirates: The war against the Peacekeepers and the Gaians and the peaceful relations with Chairman Yang (whom the Data Angels and the Atlanteans decided to terminate!).

There is more to this issue, including the University vision of territorial division and sense of unity between the factions; but I believe I've stated the outlines of the University grounds for Nautilus support. However, I'll gladly elaborate if requested.

Finally, I'd like to send an unreserved apology to GeoModder for expressing my frustration on the diplomatic foundations of Atlantean actions.

mart7x5 is offline mart7x5
King

Sep 2002
time: 22:34
  Old Post 01-06-2005 10:30
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I thought about including the map from this game in the Single Player Map Collection under the name Naval_clash.
Is it acceptable for you? The game is now over

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
The most erratic Overlord!
Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 01-06-2005 16:59
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No apology needed, Rubin. That last chat cleared that issue up. Altho I continue to feel frustrated about some things. There was simply no need for an allied attack on the Kingdom in my opinion. Sankis could have expanded on his portion of the map as much as he desired, without interference from my part. The only thing I ever asked was to leave the Gaians alone, which for still unclear reasons wasn't an option for both Uni and Pirates.

And the threat of a growing Kingdom? Uni was at most times the largest and generally most powerfull faction in the game. What I did was merely trying to hold the pace. Futile in the end for I'm not the sort of player who likes ballooning out (why do you think I pressed a normal sized map in the beginning?). 'Domination' was always the Uni outcome for the last 50 turns or so.

The 'agressive' exploration was of course done. As a naval faction I of course roam the map in search of pods. Land factions may not be aware of that, but it was a continuous race between mine and Sankis' ship(s) to pop them. I happened to be a bit more lucky in popping no hostile IoD's. Further more quite some of these pods helped me to keep pace with the Uni again. And IIRC I was not the only one popping land pods near your western borders, Rubin. I've seen at least one pirate scout heading straight into your territory to a pod.

What I feel most bad upon, is players' general attitude towards AI factions. They are there to be discarded for most of them, nothing less. That was the main reason for my 'defense' of the Gaian faction, and that was the main reason as well to take a sweep into Nautilus bases, appearantly just in time to halt an impending pirate sneak attack.

I guess, for gaming purposes, I'm to concerned about the 'feelings' of those AI's to be a 'good' player.

(and damn why didn't I empty Neptune Bottom that turn? I would have loved to see the look on your face with that PB next to it, unable to reach another important target. )

Last edited by GeoModder on 01-06-2005 at 17:12

Barinthus is offline Barinthus
King
A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:34
  Old Post 02-06-2005 19:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Rubin

Other foreign affairs further strengthened the pact between the University and the Nautilus Pirates: The war against the Peacekeepers and the Gaians and the peaceful relations with Chairman Yang (whom the Data Angels and the Atlanteans decided to terminate!).


Actually that was his own fault. He started the war with the Angels and damn nearly decimated my faction if it was not for the Kingdom's assistance in war materials and advisors along with some from the Uni.

My war aim was to defend the faction, retake lost bases, and capture three of his bases as a form of reparations and to create a buffer zone between the Hive and Angels' core bases.

However after those war aims were achieved, the Kingdom pretty much backed out of the war, seeing that it's no longer neccessary for them to be involved anymore. From that point it was all Angels. Everytime I attempted to contact Yang (right before each base my troops were about to take) he would insist on me to surrender. I was trying to press him into surrendering unconditionally to me but he decided to fight to the bitter end.

Barinthus is offline Barinthus
King
A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:34
  Old Post 02-06-2005 19:30
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quote:
Originally posted by GeoModder
Land factions may not be aware of that, but it was a continuous race between mine and Sankis' ship(s) to pop them.


You're right I was unaware of this.

mart7x5 is offline mart7x5
King

Sep 2002
time: 22:34
  Old Post 07-06-2005 16:39
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I have a question to Sankis and Geo. Have you ever thought about combining your strngths and force land factions to consider you as superior factions on the planet?

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
The most erratic Overlord!
Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 07-06-2005 18:44
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Combining with Sankis? The guy barely responded to diplomatic messages, and was way too assertive for easy allying. I had good contacts with Rubin and Barinthus in turn, but Sankis preferred to stay on his own.

Barinthus is offline Barinthus
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A Magical Moment...
Jan 2004
time: 21:34
  Old Post 13-06-2005 02:10
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I wanted to add that I enjoyed this PBEM very much especially that we took time to roleplay a bit. Also I've picked up few tips and have learned from my experience here. U guys have been terrific and hope to do it again sometime in future after some more experience lol.

mart7x5 is offline mart7x5
King

Sep 2002
time: 22:34
  Old Post 13-06-2005 02:28
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quote:
Originally posted by GeoModder
...I had good contacts with Rubin and Barinthus in turn, but Sankis preferred to stay on his own.

This was a good roleplay from Sankis' side. While Atlanteans were more into peaceful conquest of the seas, Pirates stayed as pirates - more aggresive. I mentioned that, because when designing the scenario someone specifically asked for low erosion world. Majority agreed and due to this land areas were quite extensive. This maybe gave more advantages to land-based factions, but after all 5 of them were like that and only 2 were sea based. I thought, that you both Sankis and Geo might come to a conclusion, that ensuring victory to either of you might require cooperation in eliminating land factions first. You might have then 2 naval clashes:

- sea vs. land, when Rubin and Barinthus potentially would have to come to you in their naval vessels to stop you when you would had started your offensive against land.

- sea vs. sea, final duel between Pirates and Atlanteans

Rubin used excellently what was given to University. Even without entering the marshes to north-west, just using some rainy terrain, high altitude mountains built very strong faction. Also "Rubin reservoir" has been closed to any intruders from the sea who might thretean Rubin University Base.

I still think Atlanteans did have a chance to defeat University if Geo did not self destruct his bases. Rubin, what is your oppinion on that? If Atlanteans did not go to the sea, do you think Geo might win? Would the confrontation be like between two militarily the same powers?

GeoModder is offline GeoModder
Emperor
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Jan 2004
time: 06:34
  Old Post 13-06-2005 02:46
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There was quite a bit of contact between me and Rubin in the first half of the game.

Issues came up for the Ascetic Virtues project. I had the first chance of taking it, and if I didn't let me talk out of it, my popcount would have stayed way closer to Rubins'. But OTOH he said to me he simply couldn't allow me to have that project, so perhaps that would have started an early war between our two factions.

Also, if I wasn't so stupid to put my second PB in that Pirate base, I could have knocked out Rubin's capital or two other bases with important military projects in it if I had chosen to use them.

But in the end, Rubin's advanced tech would take the better. only in that last turn could I start to drop probes near enough his frontier bases to get some extra tech. And in that last turn I managed to mindprobe Rubin's neutron armor drop infantry near Socialism Tunnels. So a few turns later I could have produced 1/8/1 AAA base defenders, but would not have AC's to have full benefit.

Oh, and about Rubin Reservoir... I managed to smuggle in a sealurk.

And a question in return: do you think I could have placed my bases better or used availabe space better? I realize that it would have benefitted me more if I colonized some land instead of sticking to the sea, but that was a roleplay -and defense choice.

Military, I think Sankis was as much a match to me as I was one to Rubin.

Last edited by GeoModder on 13-06-2005 at 02:52

 
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