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Illuminatus is offline Illuminatus
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quote:


quote:

I am sorry to inform you that Gaian Union has refused exchange of tactical information.


The feeling is mutual.

quote:
Although it is a logical step to pool resources against a common enemy, Gaian Union declines because of actions of Spartan Federation.

For years and years, Spartan Federation is deliberately violating our teritory rights, mapping Gaian coast with their foil. Spartan Federation has clearly and intentionally violated our teritorial sea hoping to obtain tactical data without being noticed.
This act has been identified as hostile and as such, Gaian Union will not share any tactical data with you. Additionally, Gaian Union requests navigation logs from the foil as a possible compensation for your transgression. They must not be attempted to be falsificated.


The Federation staunchly refuses to acknowledge any retroactive claims to sea territory. By default factional sea borders are limited to the coastline unless a coastal or sea base is in question. The green little lines on everyone's maps are considered to be this borderline.

Therefore any sea territory outside your coast has been considered, most likely by all factions so far, to be neutral territory. The Federation refuses to acknowledge transport through neutral waters as a hostile violation of territory.

We are happy to considering the acknowledgement of a territorial claim you are willing to make, the same way we have claimed sovereignity over our coastal waters (the Modo Doctrine) - however these claims can not, by common sense and logic, be in power retroactively.

Your action has been perceived as intelligence run to secretly obtain tactical data on our coast and it cannot be explained any other way. However, if Sparta gives navigational logs of the foil it will show that Sparta has been acting foolishly in attempt to prepare for the inevitable showdown when factions will be forced to conflict eachother, and not because of immediate plans to attack Gaia. This may silence voices in High Council which have been insulted since Sparta asked for tactical pact while secretly obtaining data on Gaian coast, not mentioning threat in your message.
quote:

quote:
Our investigation has shown that so called Morgan had nothing to do with assasination, in fact, Morgan never commited a hostile act against us, unlike Sparta.


As I stated, we have made no hostile act against you and will do our best to avoid doing so in the future, as well, since we harbour no hostile intent against you. Again, we'll be happy to oblige to reasonable sea territory claims you are willing to make.

Mapping Gaian coast in secret is a hostile act. High Council have requested unfalsified navigational logs from your navy regarding our coast to disuade fears about Sparta. Does avoiding to answer it mean refusal?
quote:

quote:
Current suspects are Human Hive and Spartan Federation,


By the power of deduction, then, our mutual enemy, the Hiverian horde, is the culprit.

quote:
and since Human Hive foils do not cruise our coast, prime suspicion for the murder is Sparta.


Spartan exploratory vessels haven't had, haven't, nor will they ever have intelligence operatives onboard. The only possibility would be a shot shell going astray and hitting your venerable Lady, but our exploratory vessels have yet to fire a shot to this date (which may change with the Morganites commandeering one of them, though).

Your previous and current actions, with added oportunity, have been reason to target you as prime suspect. Be lucky that motive and opportunity does not mean you are guilty.
quote:

Please, do not make the Junta suspect the possibility that this is a trumped-up charge spinned out of nowhere to facilitate a souring of relations that is a part of some greater scheme against us.

Relations are not soured by words but by actions. Please understand that asking for tactical pact while secretly mapping Gaian coast deeply insulted High Coucil. Your threat did not help much either. If you show you changed your attitude High Council will be happy to cooperate with you as it does easily with Angels. However High Council is now seriously convinced that Junta is preparing for invasion of Gaian Union. Be warned that you are still viewed with suspicion due to your past actions and as such, you'll need to prove yourself to be trusted.

quote:

Now, unless this new turn in attitudes in the Gaian Union has affected our earlier tech agreement, I would like to relay to you a few questions and statements from our experts wrt. the tech arrangement agreed upon earlier.

What new turn in attitudes do you speak of? Gaian attitude towards Sparta has not changed a single bit for past 15 years. Of course Gaians will be disturbed because of already mentioned reasons.
However keep in mind, Gaian Union does operate with profit in mind. Gaians will always accept a deal if it is good for them, regardless of relations with target faction. This is why your past offer has been accepted. Gaian Union does not break agreed deals unless the other side breaks it, so you have nothing to worry about.
quote:

First off, since we are at war with the Hiverian horde, we desire IntInt ASAP because we need it to establish a safe defensive perimeter. This perimeter is required because we see our position as that of a 'lightning rod', which is attracting the wrath of the tempest that is engulfing Chiron this present moment.

When, then, will you have Intellectual Integrity at the current rate of research you are using? When are you going to research EcolEng yourselves (we need this information for our own logistical setup of the deal).

Your comment about Sparta being lightning rod for Hive inadvetently laughed most of Gaians. Gaia is lightning rod, and sadly Gaians would be quite happy to change that position as production of an army forced redirection of resources from population expansion. If Hive does really move away his stacks of units towards your front Gaians will be happy to see them smashing against Spartan perimeters.
Lab/energy output is changing every turn (each turn makes either emphasis on credits or labs), however it will be within 1-4 years. On the other hand, Gaian Union needs EE next turn, for the possibility that breakthough occurs next turn. You will receive II preaccepted as soon as research is finished.
quote:
Also, can we agree to a clause that allows a party to use a friendly probe action to extract an agreed-upon tech in case sun spots obstruct normal diplomatic channels?

Sadly, I need to inform you that no faction is allowed to probe Gaian Union in any case under any circumstances. This includes Spartan Federation. Additionaly, do not move probe foils/cruisers near our coast as High Council has passed a law that would give a directive to destroy any trespassing probe team, regardless of its motives and faction of origin. It is shoot first, ask questions later policy when it comes to probe teams and security, and diplomatic relations do not affect this.
quote:
Which brings in mind my final question - would you like to re-establish more formal diplomatic communications in the form of an embassy, or do you wish to stick to our current system?

Seems you have a short memory. There already was an embassy and Junta destroyed it.

Last edited by Illuminatus on 04-02-2005 at 22:35

binTravkin is offline binTravkin
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Was this sent to Spartans?

And what is the status of our Ecological Engineering deal?

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Sigh. I waited for comments. I guess I'll send this then.

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Go ahead! Sounds fine to me...

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Actually no. The Gaian who assumes diplomatic contact with Spartans should send it - I promised that I won't get involved anymore.

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Well someone needs too! *Backs up* Just because they raised the filters...

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Sent to Kassi.

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Thank you! We will pull you back in....

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No you won't. Do alone from now one, I do not wish to get involved any longer.

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quote:
No you won't. Do alone from now one, I do not wish to get involved any longer.


Seems you've got really pissed off..

Just one more thing - please ask all persons with whom you conducted Gaian diplomacy through pm forward further messages to me.

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Whole message from Kassiopeia:

I have been instructed to contact you in diplomatic affairs, Lord Chaos Theory, so here goes.

The tech trade we've been arranging. Am I correct in assuming that we need to formally send Ecol Eng, pre-accepted, to you, the Gaians, this turn. Then, do we also send it to the Angels, or do the Angels get it from you in exchange for delivering Cyberethics to you and us? I have asked for the Angels to clarify this as well.

quote:

Your action has been perceived as intelligence run to secretly obtain tactical data on our coast and it cannot be explained any other way. However, if Sparta gives navigational logs of the foil it will show that Sparta has been acting foolishly in attempt to prepare for the inevitable showdown when factions will be forced to conflict eachother, and not because of immediate plans to attack Gaia. This may silence voices in High Council which have been insulted since Sparta asked for tactical pact while secretly obtaining data on Gaian coast, not mentioning threat in your message.


Had we planned to attack you, we would have done so already. Currently we are involved in a vendetta with the Hive and the Morganites - how willing to go into a war with three fronts do you think we are? While we our researchers may not be the brightest on Planet, our strategists are. Our forces will be busy with these current conflicts that have been thrust upon us for a long time, rest assured.

quote:

Mapping Gaian coast in secret is a hostile act. High Council have requested unfalsified navigational logs from your navy regarding our coast to disuade fears about Sparta. Does avoiding to answer it mean refusal?


Had we actually planned to map your coast in secrecy, you would have never found out. As we considered that area of the Planet neutral waters, we made no effort to conceal our presence there. Why else would we have ended the turn with our ship right next to your coast every turn, where everyone could see it? And why do you bring this up only now at a later date? Hence our suspicions of your motives for bringing this up.

We contest any claims of territorial transgression, hostility or secrecy, and the Federation never discloses navigational logs with other factions without a very good reason. You have provided none.

quote:

What new turn in attitudes do you speak of? Gaian attitude towards Sparta has not changed a single bit for past 15 years. Of course Gaians will be disturbed because of already mentioned reasons.


The first moment we are engaged in promising talks about a tech trade, and the next we are accused of intruding on your territory for no good reason at all. I do not know about the Gaian way, but the Spartan way says that this is a rather radical change in attitude.

quote:

Your comment about Sparta being lightning rod for Hive inadvetently laughed most of Gaians. Gaia is lightning rod, and sadly Gaians would be quite happy to change that position as production of an army forced redirection of resources from population expansion. If Hive does really move away his stacks of units towards your front Gaians will be happy to see them smashing against Spartan perimeters.


Actually that large stack the Pegasus noticed changed directions right after Yang declared war on us. If it wasn’t for us, your entire force of three worm boils would be husks and planet pearls by now. We will have to take care of that stack and many others from now on. Why, you're welcome.

quote:

Lab/energy output is changing every turn (each turn makes either emphasis on credits or labs), however it will be within 1-4 years. On the other hand, Gaian Union needs EE next turn, for the possibility that breakthough occurs next turn. You will receive II preaccepted as soon as research is finished.


"For the possibility that breakthough occurs next turn"? Surely you should know whether or not you're going to switch to high labs production or not?

quote:

Additionaly, do not move probe foils/cruisers near our coast as High Council has passed a law that would give a directive to destroy any trespassing probe team, regardless of its motives and faction of origin.


And I wish the best of luck to your enormous fleet in carrying out that tall order.

I feel that I must clarify something I've noted to the Gaian Union before, something I may have misworded to create a meaning that was not there. When I said The only possibility would be a shot shell going astray and hitting your venerable Lady, but our exploratory vessels have yet to fire a shot to this date (which may change with the Morganites commandeering one of them, though)., I meant that the Hunter under Morganite command may become the first exploratory vessel of Spartan origin to fire a shot. It was not intended as a threat of any sort, more as a side remark vis-a-vis Morganite crimes.

Your sincerely,

Lt. Colonel Kassiopeia

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Without comment, and the Spartan turn deadline approaching, I was compelled to answer the Spartans:

quote:

I posted your message soon after receiving it and have not gotten a response from my faction-mates. Thus, I will accurately answer you, to the best of my ability.

Any trade involving trading us Ecological Engineering requires that you send it to us pre-accepted, as we will finish it on our turn. If we cannot come to an agreement regarding its trade by the end of our turn, we will decline the offer, as if it had not been made. I have not carefully followed our trade agreements and have no time to research them now.

As far as attacking us, we have no illusions that you wish to make more enemies than you must, but we are naturally, and understandably, suspicious of such a heavily armed neighbor. Though you would not reasonably attack us now, we fear you may turn on us when it is convenient. Mapping our coast is an obvious prelude to such a turn of events. Accurately analyzing our coast may preclude secrecy, and if you can convince us it was innocuous, your mapping was as good as secret. As far as the timing, we have had much internal upheaval, as you have seen. Mapping our coastline, while threatening, is not our most important concern.

We did notice a stack of Hive units change direction, and were happy about it, but more were behind it. Go ahead and believe what you want about our capabilities for self-defense, but we know that any help from you was accidental. Your bluster, while noted, is not important.

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You were very nice with them!

I hope they at least understand that they can't just ask and everyone will obey.

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They understand, now they're working on why not? Sounds good, stiff without unrelenting.

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  Old Post 14-02-2005 23:44
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Ouro, could you contact DA considering all that tech trade linked to our accepting of Spartan deal?

About Cyberethics and such..

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Done. I believe it was EcoEng for CyberEthics, in a few turns. Something in that manner.

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OK, finally got a copy of the turn. Will try and remember to take a look-see at home. Regarding the trade, apparently they're still waiting for IntelInteg. Then, they can switch to CyberEthics, and will owe us two technologies.

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Or not. Apparently, Sparta was supposed to give us EcoEng. I should have realized thatfrom the previous post. That's what I get for reading in the morning. Anyways, now Angels are offering IntelInteg for our donation of EcoEng.

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Real mess..

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Upon reviewing the latest turn (2160), I noticed that the Spartans have surpassed the Morganites in population (44 to 40). I do not think it is wise to collaborate with them much, at this point.

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Yeah. That might be a good idea. For those who haven't devised my messages yet, Sparta was supposed to trade us EE, we would research II, trade both to DA, II to Sparta, and DA would research CyberEthics. DA would then owe two techs to us.

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Yes, but better dont do this deal, as it's overdue now and Sparta is too powerful right now anyway..

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Well, Sparta never gave us EE. Therefore we never got II. We did, however, follow through, as in already done, with giving DA EE. Now, I believe DA are getting II through research. They are willing to trade that to us. Chaos probably knows better than myself. But I don't think we have any deals on the table to proceed on with Sparta...

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Regardless of our future attitudes towards Sparta, we should at least remain cordial until we cut the land bridge with the Hive. This action will probably hurt them and help us, so we shouldn't give them any extra incentive to foil it.

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Sorry for asking, but I am reading what happened and Sparta broke the deal by not trading EE? That is weird. Okay, I am off to clean up the mess now.

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quote:
Sorry for asking, but I am reading what happened and Sparta broke the deal by not trading EE? That is weird. Okay, I am off to clean up the mess now.


Read their message above - we (at least I) simply became disgusted..

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I got an inquiry from Sparta regarding some trade involving Ecological Engineering. I didn't know the details, so I just posted the inquiry in this forum, expecting someone who knew something to take care of it. No one did, and I tried to buy us some more time, but to no avail.

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Oh. Yeah. Shoot me for it

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quote:

Originally posted by Kassiopeia

Re: the raid on Morgan Industries

The contents of this message are confidential, but the bulk of the information will be on the wires soon enough.

Message from the Junta begins:

No doubt you have heard word of our pro-active defense operation against the Corporation. As we hold the Spartan-Angel relations in the highest regard, we would like to offer you some more insight in the reasons driving our action.

While our recent operation"“Armageddon" may seem a sign of our formidable strength, and will given enough bravado hopefully lure the Corporation into thinking a massive invasion is imminent, it is in fact a sign of our weakness. After all, if we had the choice, we would rather capture and hold the Planetary Transit System, than destroy it. But we couldn't.

Terrapeso is chock full of synthmetal armoured probe defences. If we'd dare set permanent foot on Terrapeso by capturing a base, which by itself would be a relatively easy task for us, in their turn we’d be swarmed by Morganite probes from all directions, and the base with all our units in it would be mindcontrolled back to Corporate control.

That's why we have instead chosen for a limited operation, a swift blow with as goal to maximize the economic damage to the Corporation, to reduce their economic superiority over us, and then retreat as soon as possible. If possible at least - for the chances are very high that this endeavour will end as a kamikaze operation, and that many of our brave soldiers will never see back their husbands, wives and children.

We hope you now understand why we had to do what we did, and that we can count on your support to seek revenge for the injustices the Corporation has committed against us.

Greetings from the Junta.

Message ends.

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quote:
I got an inquiry from Sparta regarding some trade involving Ecological Engineering. I didn't know the details, so I just posted the inquiry in this forum, expecting someone who knew something to take care of it. No one did, and I tried to buy us some more time, but to no avail.


Frankly, I think noone should feel sorry about it.
We should not give anything to Sparta - they're getting too powerful. The reason why they wanted Cybereth is very clear to me - they would then go straight for HSA and be immune to Morganic probes (which is their main strenght). Then we all together would stand little chance against Sparta..

 
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