Apolyton Archive  |  Preserved copy of the Apolyton Civilization Site and its forums as they stood in September 2005. Read-only; nothing here can be posted to or replied to.  |  Forum index |  About this archive |  The 1998–2001 UBB forums
Today on Apolyton WARDELL INTERVIEW PROMO A.C.S. HISTORY CHAPTER 4 GET CIV4 /w FREE PLUS! A.C.S. PHOTO GALLERY GET A.O.M. V1.1
Apolyton Civilization Forums
main| civ2| civ3| civ4| smac| ctp2| ron| moo3| galciv| galciv2| alt| about|
ApolytonPLUS | register | search | faq | new posts | pm (-/-) | upload | members
hall of fame new! | civgroups | civgroups news | interviews | the column | radio | chat | directory | news | store | PLUS
Apolyton Civilization Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.0.3 Apolyton Civilization Forums > Miscellaneous > Archive > Off-Topic-Archive > 380 TONS of Explosives (HMX, RDX) in Iraq Left Unsecured, Now Looted!
Show a Printable Version | Email This Page to Someone! | Receive updates to this thread | Report this to Apolyton news!

bottom of page
  
Author
Thread   
Pages (11): [ 1   2   3   4     >> ]
< Last Thread     Next Thread > Post New Thread     Post A Reply
Ramo is offline Ramo
King
Austin, Texas, USA
Oct 1999
time: 23:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:30 Visit Ramo's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#1 Report this post to a moderator
380 TONS of Explosives (HMX, RDX) in Iraq Left Unsecured, Now Looted! Get a bigger avatar today!

quote:
BAGHDAD, Iraq, Oct. 24 - The Iraqi interim government has warned the United States and international nuclear inspectors that nearly 380 tons of powerful conventional explosives - used to demolish buildings, produce missile warheads and detonate nuclear weapons - are missing from one of Iraq's most sensitive former military installations.

The huge facility, called Al Qaqaa, was supposed to be under American military control but is now a no-man's land, still picked over by looters as recently as Sunday. United Nations weapons inspectors had monitored the explosives for many years, but White House and Pentagon officials acknowledge that the explosives vanished after the American invasion last year.

The White House said President Bush's national security adviser, Condoleezza Rice, was informed within the past month that the explosives were missing. It is unclear whether President Bush was informed. American officials have never publicly announced the disappearance, but beginning last week they answered questions about it posed by The New York Times and the CBS News program "60 Minutes."

Administration officials said yesterday that the Iraq Survey Group, the C.I.A. task force that searched for unconventional weapons, has been ordered to investigate the disappearance of the explosives.

American weapons experts say their immediate concern is that the explosives could be used in major bombing attacks against American or Iraqi forces: the explosives, mainly HMX and RDX, could be used to produce bombs strong enough to shatter airplanes or tear apart buildings. The bomb that brought down Pan Am Flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland, in 1988 used less than a pound of the material of the type stolen from Al Qaqaa, and somewhat larger amounts were apparently used in the bombing of a housing complex in November 2003 in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, and the blasts in a Moscow apartment complex in September 1999 that killed nearly 300 people.

[...]

A European diplomat reported that Jacques Baute, head of the I.A.E.A.'s Iraq nuclear inspection team, warned officials at the United States mission in Vienna about the danger of the nuclear sites and materials once under I.A.E.A. supervision, including Al Qaqaa.

But apparently, little was done. A senior Bush administration official said that during the initial race to Baghdad, American forces "went through the bunkers, but saw no materials bearing the I.A.E.A. seal." It is unclear whether they ever returned.

By late 2003, diplomats said, I.A.E.A. experts had obtained commercial satellite photos of Al Qaqaa showing that two of roughly 10 bunkers that contained HMX appeared to have been leveled by titanic blasts, apparently during the war. They presumed some of the HMX had exploded, but that is unclear.

Other HMX bunkers were untouched. Some were damaged but not devastated. I.A.E.A. experts say they assume that just before the invasion the Iraqis followed their standard practice of moving crucial explosives out of buildings, so they would not be tempting targets. If so, the experts say, the Iraqi must have broken I.A.E.A. seals on bunker doors and moved most of the HMX to nearby fields, where it would have been lightly camouflaged - and ripe for looting.

But the Bush administration would not allow the agency back into the country to verify the status of the stockpile. In May 2004, Iraqi officials say in interviews, they warned L. Paul Bremer III, the American head of the occupation authority, that Al Qaqaa had probably been looted. It is unclear if that warning was passed anywhere. Efforts to reach Mr. Bremer by telephone were unsuccessful. But by that time, the Americans were preoccupied with the transfer of authority to Iraq, and the insurgency was gaining strength. "It's not an excuse," said one senior administration official. "But a lot of things went by the boards."


http://www.nytimes.com/2004/10/25/i...artner=homepage

Holy crap, that's a lot of explosives. Less than a pound of this stuff brought down the Lockerbie flight, and there are ~760,000 pounds running around...

GePap is offline GePap
King
of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:32
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#2 Report this post to a moderator
Enter the AD-FREE zone

Yeah. just read that...

You would have thought that AT LEAST the admin. would have been able to secure all the sites Powell pointed out to the Un in Feb 2003 as places we "knew" WMD programs or parts to exist.

Agathon is offline Agathon
Prince
Leafs 4TW!! - CPA
Dec 2002
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:32
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#3 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Phhhhhhttttt.....

At least the terrorists are competent.

Agathon is offline Agathon
Prince
Leafs 4TW!! - CPA
Dec 2002
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:34
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#4 Report this post to a moderator
Put an end to popups!

Iraq is now looking like an episode of Hogan's Heroes except that the Americans are the Germans this time.

WTF is wrong with these people.

Oncle Boris is offline Oncle Boris
Prince
Once in a brown moon
Aug 2001
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:34
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#5 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by GePap
Yeah. just read that...

You would have thought that AT LEAST the admin. would have been able to secure all the sites Powell pointed out to the Un in Feb 2003 as places we "knew" WMD programs or parts to exist.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:36 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#6 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Can this Administration ever not **** up?!?!?!

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
of Schmooism
Feb 2001
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:37
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#7 Report this post to a moderator
Increase the size of your Attachments

Do-not-call registry.

Ted Striker is offline Ted Striker
Emperor
United States of America
Jan 1970
time: 21:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:39 Visit Ted Striker's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#8 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon



It's almost as if they are TRYING to **** up.

How ****ing incompetent can they be?!?! This is ABSURD.

Drachasor is offline Drachasor
Warlord

Jun 2004
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:39
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#9 Report this post to a moderator
Put an end to popups!

quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Can this Administration ever not **** up?!?!?!


According to them, they never do.



Yeah, there is really no way a different president could of handled this better.

-Drachasor

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:41 Visit MrFun's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#10 Report this post to a moderator
Put an end to popups!

quote:
Originally posted by GePap
Yeah. just read that...

You would have thought that AT LEAST the admin. would have been able to secure all the sites Powell pointed out to the Un in Feb 2003 as places we "knew" WMD programs or parts to exist.




No, FIRST the administration has to secure all the oil supplies for the Bush family . . . . I mean, Haliburton . . . . . no, that's not right either . . . . . oh, we need to secure the oil supplies for the Iraqi economy first, before we take care of such frivuluous matters as deadly explosives.


vote for Bush

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:43 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#11 Report this post to a moderator
Inflate your Upload Space

quote:
Originally posted by Kuciwalker
Do-not-call registry.


Okay, you got me there.

I don't get anoyed by phone salesmen, but terrorists now have 380 tons of high explosives to blow up my phone with.

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
of Schmooism
Feb 2001
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:45
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#12 Report this post to a moderator
Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Dylan Baker is offline Dylan Baker
Warlord
Washington, DC
Feb 2001
time: 05:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:50
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#13 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I wouldn't want to be the one to break this news to our troops.

asleepathewheel is offline asleepathewheel
Emperor
listening too long to one song
Mar 2002
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 08:58
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#14 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote:
Originally posted by Kuciwalker
Do-not-call registry.


Which was originally an idea of the states attorneys general, then stolen by the feds, IIRC.

OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 09:06 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#15 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Already another thread on this: http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...threadid=124254

Sucka

Ramo is offline Ramo
King
Austin, Texas, USA
Oct 1999
time: 23:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 09:09 Visit Ramo's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#16 Report this post to a moderator
Increase Your PM Length

The spin's that your thread is the copycat. You lose.

OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 09:26 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#17 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I just came from Fox News. No Spin Zone

The facts are that mine was 6 minutes earlier! Can't spin the facts dabnabit.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 09:27 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#18 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

This thread has better commentary. Your thread is all spam.

OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 09:28 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#19 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Just you wait. This'll be full of spam soon too.

OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 09:29 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#20 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

And mine posted the whole article.

Its Waaaar!!

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
of Schmooism
Feb 2001
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 10:04
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#21 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Ramo is offline Ramo
King
Austin, Texas, USA
Oct 1999
time: 23:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 10:07 Visit Ramo's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#22 Report this post to a moderator
Remove this text

quote:
And mine posted the whole article.

Its Waaaar!!


See, I edited the article to include the most relevant portions, and added some commentary.

Only reason why you posted earlier is that you made an inferior post.

OzzyKP is offline OzzyKP
King
Rockville, MD
Oct 1999
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 18:23 Visit OzzyKP's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#23 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Mine was actually getting some commentary. This is all spam now you all suck.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 18:31
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#24 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

If you'd have read my blog you'd have known this the better part of a year ago.

BTW this has been widely reported since the end of the war.

Bosh is offline Bosh
Emperor
Taehan Mingook
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 18:58
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#25 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote:
Originally posted by Oerdin
If you'd have read my blog you'd have known this the better part of a year ago.

BTW this has been widely reported since the end of the war.

Right, what makes this news is that the US hadn't reported this to the I.A.E.A. and has put pressure on the Iraqis to not report it.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 19:00
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#26 Report this post to a moderator
Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

The theft of high explosives is nothing new. Less then 10% of the former military storage facilities are occupied and there are far to few UXO experts to destroy the explosives in a timely manner. The estimates I saw was that at current rates it would take 50 years to blow them all up. Sad but true.

Bosh is offline Bosh
Emperor
Taehan Mingook
Jan 1970
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 19:03
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#27 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

But surely the Bush administration made up detailed plans about how to prevent all those massive caches of arms and explosives from falling into the wrong hands! How could something like this have happened!

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 19:16
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#28 Report this post to a moderator
Remove this text

Simple. They didn't care and they figured no body else would care either.

Of course to impoverished Iraqis explosives are just another thing to loot and sell.

germanos is offline germanos
Prince
behind a firm ****, Rotterdam, NL
Apr 2002
time: 06:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 19:19
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#29 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote:
The huge facility, called Al Qaqaa...


How appropriate

GePap is offline GePap
King
of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:20
  Old Post 25-10-2004 19:34
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#30 Report this post to a moderator
Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote:
Originally posted by Oerdin
The theft of high explosives is nothing new. Less then 10% of the former military storage facilities are occupied and there are far to few UXO experts to destroy the explosives in a timely manner. The estimates I saw was that at current rates it would take 50 years to blow them all up. Sad but true.


I think the difference is that this was an IAEA monitored site for a decade or so-in fact, the MINIMUM the admin. could have bee ready to do was secure all sites being motiroed by the IAEA-I mean, those guys did it for far less money and smaller teams- we invade, and all of a sudden high grade explosives and radioactive materials go missing?

 
Pages (11): [ 1   2   3   4     >> ]
< Last Thread     Next Thread > Post New Thread     Post A Reply
All times are GMT. The time now is 05:20.
Apolyton Time is 00:20.
    top of page
Rate This Thread:
archivepost
Forum Jump:
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
 




Contact Us - Apolyton Civilization Site - Support Us!

Building a better Apolyton through better information. Click here and take our poll!
Non-US visitors, click here!

Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.0.3
Copyright ©2000, 2001, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.

Page generated in 0.0635 seconds (91.43% PHP - 8.57% MySQL) with 31 queries
Page Loading Time:

Support Apolyton: Amazon USA | Amazon UK | Amazon DE | Amazon FR |
Support Apolyton and get FREE PLUS, Buy from Chips&Bits: Galactic Civilizations | Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition | Call to Power 2 | Civilization: The Boardgame | GURPS/ Alpha Centauri | Alpha Centauri | Civilization IV | Civilization III: Complete |


Front Page | Civilization IV | Civilization III | Civilization II | Call to Power II | Alpha Centauri | Master of Orion III
Rise of Nations | Galactic Civilizations | Galactic Civilizations II | Misc
Alt.Civs | Civ I | C:CtP I | About | News | Directory | Apolyton Store | Forums | Chat | Columns | Interviews | Newsletter
Scenario League | CSC | Clash of Civs | Spanish Site | CtP Maps | Cradle of Civ | WesW's Ctp1/2 Site | Civ3 Haven

apolyton.net | apolyton.com | civilization2.net | civilization3.net | civilization4.net | civilizationiv.info | calltopower.net | galciv.net | galciv2.net | moo3.net