22-11-2004 10:07									#91
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo I guess it was pointed out more than a week ago.

Nice, that means its been removed from the latest calculations.

Its still on!

	22-11-2004 10:14									#92
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I think Kerry getting 90% of the provisionals is still wildly optimistic (especially given the results so far). 75% or so is a more reasonable estimate, IMO.

	22-11-2004 10:19									#93
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quote: Because Kerry won that state, so obviously that vote was completely fair and above board. Yes, Michigan too. Duh.

I haven't heard of any voting irregularities that gave Kerry 4,000 extra votes in PA or MI

Duh.

Incidentally, I do think those states (and every other) ought to be recounted. In fact, Nader has started a recount in NH (does that mean he's actually a Republican operative?).

	22-11-2004 10:38									#94
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I won't call this recount anything other than sour grapes unless IA, MI, PA or WI are recounted.

	22-11-2004 10:40									#95
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quote: I haven't heard of any voting irregularities that gave Kerry 4,000 extra votes in PA or MI

Reporting bias?

	22-11-2004 10:43									#96
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quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi I won't call this recount anything other than sour grapes unless IA, MI, PA or WI are recounted.

Since the recounts are by the Libertarian and Green candidates, you can call it whatever you want, but like most of the things you say, it will have no basis in reality. If the Democrats were behind this, then maybe you'd have a point.

	22-11-2004 10:45									#97
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Why no recount in WI?

That's why I don't understand the strategy of these other parties.

	22-11-2004 10:49									#98
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I haven't yet heard of voting irregularities in WI. Perhaps you'd like to enlighten us? As for the Green candidate, I don't believe he was on the ballot there. As for Badnarik, you'd have to ask him why he doesn't ask for a recount there.

	22-11-2004 10:50									#99
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I don't know why either.

It's a mystery to me.

	22-11-2004 10:54									#100
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Well, don't you think it's kinda silly to be complaining about things you have no idea about?

	22-11-2004 10:56									#101
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quote: I won't call this recount anything other than sour grapes unless IA, MI, PA or WI are recounted.

Ben wants Kerry to win IA.

quote: I don't know why either.

Badnarik isn't a partisan hack unlike some other people whom I won't mention. He actually cares about the accuracy of the electoral process, instead of just insuring that his favored candidate wins.

quote: Reporting bias?

We have now entered the Nediverse.

	22-11-2004 10:58									#102
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quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi I won't call this recount anything other than sour grapes unless IA, MI, PA or WI are recounted.

Good thing what we think doesn't matter ****, isn't it?

It would be very interesting if Yanks paid as much attention to our elections as we do to theirs. I think the same could be said for a lot of places.

	22-11-2004 11:01									#103
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither It would be very interesting if Yanks paid as much attention to our elections as we do to theirs. I think the same could be said for a lot of places.

I think you're right, but I still can't read Canadian politics threads, and I try, oh how I try. It's like, as soon as I wade in, I have no idea what's going on.

Maybe you should do thread called What American's Ought to Know About Canada, But Don't. I do have a book called Canada for Americans, btw, and a couple of Canadian history books. It's just, you all are so goshed darned nice and polite and boring. The only thing interesting in your history I can remember are the Manitoban and Sakatchewan revolts.

Heck, I'll start the thread.

	22-11-2004 11:03									#104
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quote: We have now entered the Nediverse.

Given your election predictions, maybe you ought to be a little more cautious implying other people live in different realities?

	22-11-2004 11:06									#105
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It's not my fault if pollsters' common wisdom was wrong.

	22-11-2004 11:09									#106
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That's a good idea.

	22-11-2004 11:28									#107
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It's all quite interesting. Would be a bit strange if it actually did happen. I thought it was interesting as well that Sen. Kerry's ballot that he cast was ballot number 667. Wonder if he really got number 666 and asked for the next one up.

	22-11-2004 16:58									#108
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Fellas, trust me. You're going to want those tinfoil hats.

	22-11-2004 19:50									#110
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quote: Originally posted by Sikander Fellas, trust me. You're going to want those tinfoil hats.

Why? The recount is going forward.

	22-11-2004 20:51									#111
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quote: Originally posted by Ben Kenobi Why no recount in WI? That's why I don't understand the strategy of these other parties.

They have a limited amount of money, so they are focusing on it in the States that if switched will actually change the result of the election.

How is it sour grapes to spend money wisely in this way?

-Drachasor

	24-11-2004 01:27									#112
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Kerry/Edwards announce their support of the recount (which will happen):

quote: NEW YORK - You don’t have to wait for the Ohio Presidential Recount to get confused. Just pay attention to the recasting of news releases from the Ohio Democratic Party. Early Monday afternoon, Ohio Chairman Dennis White released a comparative bombshell inside the still tiny world of the Recount-Conscious. It bore the headline “Kerry/Edwards Campaign Joins Ohio Recount” and advised that “assuring Ohioans receive an accurate count of all votes cast for president has prompted the Democratic Party to join the initiative to recount the results of the November 2 presidential election.”

quote: Howard Fineman, chief political correspondent of Newsweek and since the days of our old The Big Show an MSNBC analyst, summed up the exact inexactitude of Kerry and the Democrats about Ohio, on the Monday Countdown. “They keep saying these little things designed to make clear, at least to their supporters and the whole blogosphere out there, that they take the possibility (of a Kerry victory) and the need for a recount seriously.”

http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6533008/#041122b

	24-11-2004 01:36									#113
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You're fooling yourself if you think we're going to have a different president for the next four years.

	24-11-2004 01:43									#114
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I also think I'm going to win the lottery tomorrow.

Which is more likely to happen?

	24-11-2004 01:46									#115
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You winning the lotto (well, winning $2 or whatever the base prize is ).

-Arrian, who is also interested in the recount, but has no illusions about it changing the result.

	24-11-2004 02:23									#116
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Some of you guys don't seem to get that this affecting the outcome of the election is just as real as it was in Florida 2000. Its just that the media is burying the story this time around... you should realize that Sava.

It might not happen, but then again it might. Its not an infintesimal possibility anymore. Its very real.

Who thought the Sox would win the world series 3 games down? What were the odds? What was the outcome?

Miracles can happen. Its called optimism guys.

	24-11-2004 06:25									#117
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quote: udge denies third-party candidates' vote recount request Email to a Friend Printer Friendly Version TOLEDO, Ohio -- A federal judge on Tuesday denied a request by third-party presidential candidates who wanted to force a recount of Ohio ballots even before the official count was finished. U.S. District Judge James G. Carr in Toledo ruled that the candidates have a right under Ohio law to a recount, but they have not shown "that they will be harmed irreparably if the recount is not completed by the time Ohio's electors to the Electoral College must be certified." The judge said Green Party presidential candidate David Cobb and Libertarian presidential candidate Michael Badnarik could not credibly claim that they did or could garner enough votes to have Ohio's presidential electors cast their votes for them. The two third-party candidates received a combined 0.26 percent of the vote in unofficial results. They contend a re-count is necessary to ensure accuracy. Carr wrote that he saw no reason to interfere with the final stages of Ohio's 2004 electoral process. The lawsuit had asked Carr to issue a temporary restraining order and a preliminary injunction requiring Ohio Secretary of State Kenneth Blackwell to immediately begin statewide recount of Nov. 2 voting results. It also asked that Blackwell ensure that the re-count be completed by Dec. 7, the date that Ohio's electors will be certified for the electoral college.

So much for the third party tactic.

As for the provisionals:

Bush +27,198
Kerry +22,393

and Cuyahoga County, the big democratic one with Cleveland, is reported a lower then state average rate of provisional accpetance. Kerry would have need near unanamity to prevail on provisional ballots, and Bush already has over 27,000 votes from them. Give it up libs, you lose.

	24-11-2004 06:30									#118
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quote: Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn Some of you guys don't seem to get that this affecting the outcome of the election is just as real as it was in Florida 2000. Its just that the media is burying the story this time around... you should realize that Sava.

yeah, and what happened in 2000?

quote: It might not happen, but then again it might. Its not an infintesimal possibility anymore. Its very real.

about as real as my swiss and cayman accounts are

quote: Who thought the Sox would win the world series 3 games down? What were the odds? What was the outcome?

the odds were pretty good... Vegas had the Sox at 20:1... I think odds of this would be in the billions.

quote: Miracles can happen. Its called optimism guys.

bah, don't talk about optimism with someone with depression

	24-11-2004 08:07									#119
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quote: Originally posted by Shi Huangdi So much for the third party tactic. As for the provisionals: Bush +27,198 Kerry +22,393 and Cuyahoga County, the big democratic one with Cleveland, is reported a lower then state average rate of provisional accpetance. Kerry would have need near unanamity to prevail on provisional ballots, and Bush already has over 27,000 votes from them. Give it up libs, you lose.

You don't understand. Ohio is still doing its initial vote count... it hasn't even declared official results yet. This is whats so ****ed about this.

The real number will come in with the recount when under/over votes are counted, as well as the rest of the prov. ballots.

	24-11-2004 08:18									#120
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quote: Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn He lost by more votes than any other President (excluding Bush 2004) has ever won by. Thats no small thing.

Total vote counts are meaningless since population changes over time. The real figure is percentage of votes since that allows you to compare apples to apples.

But you know that.