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Jac de Molay
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Detroit
Sep 2001
time: 05:17
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quote:
Originally posted by lord of the mark
Im NOT buying this system for games to come out in the future, ive got a backlog of games to play, going back to 2000 or so. Presumably games that required a 2000 or 2001 hotshot video card may be handled by the onboard, NOW???? |
I'm in the same situation. Got out of gaming for a while, but I just got a laptop from work with some decent specs, and I wanted to play some of my old games again.
This processor is Mobile AMD Athlon™ XP-M 2200+ w/ PowerNow!™ Technology (whatever this is  ) 512 MB Ram, DVD/CD combo drive, and integrated graphics.
The only thing I've got on it is The Sims w/various expansion packs, and it runs fine, and DVDs look great on it. But I've got BG2 which I haven't even taken out of box since I bought it, SC 3000, Kiss Psycho Circus ( ), and some other older stuff I was looking to play this weekend, and was curious if the onboard graphics would be a hindrance for this. ...Jac.
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child of Thor
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god-darn-mutherofsatan-onboard-junk!
I really hate the stuff. I've eventualy managed to find a PCI card.
The radeon i got from PC world did mention PCI(and AGP to be fair) on the box, but i missed the small stuff in the brackets that said ' version' - it turned out to be the AGP version, which it didnt specify on the box!
grrrr - serves me right for not looking inside the box in the shop. anyway i got my money back so its cool.
Next up is a second-hand PCI card, a Geforce2 MX(not as powerfull as the Radeon, but it will do). It did come with a 12month warrenty.
So i put it in my 'new' pc and switch it on. Nothing! It doesn't even boot up properly. So i'm checking my warrenty paper, then i think i'll give it a go in old-faithfull(my trusty p166).
And its fine - request the drivers etc, all good.
So back to pain-in-theass PIII onboard monster. Same thing - black screen, no boot-up.
Fast forward a few hours and i sort of get some results after playing in the bios and device manager screens. But its not perfect as it still wants to run with the onboard i810 rubbish. It sets-up my new 'real' card as a second monitor 
So i'm having fun. I have taken a visit to the HP website, those responsible for my particular pc-horror, and i do have somethings to try out, so we'll see.
BUT i would strongly suggest against getting such a machine if you want to try gameing, better to get a second hand old-but-upgradeable real pc with real replaceable components. This way you'll never be caught out.
I suppose at least it did have a PCI slot(no AGP though), so i should be thankfull for that. Gamer beware - they should put that on a sticker on these things..... 
And the worst part is i got this pc for free! And its still made me hate on-board
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child of Thor
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I'm getting very tempted myself..............all i wanted to be able to do was play Medieval Total War - all the other PC games i like to play run ok on my P166(well i also use the PB for PatricianIII and Hardwar, but the i810 can handle those games).
I tend to use my xbox+gamecube for the more 3D intensive games.
I will find away to fix this - i think i'm halfway, probably just some silly tick box somewhere. Anyway if i get a result i'll post what i needed to do. just in case anyone else is having these kind of issues.
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DrSpike
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Enthusiastic member of Apolyton
Sep 2001
time: 05:17
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quote:
Originally posted by DrSpike
I think the moral is buy a decent system and dodge the lame-o-hassle (TM). It needn't be composed of top of the range (and expensive) parts.
Even if you don't want to upgrade your graphics card the conclusion still holds........you save a bit in the short term by buying lame-o-hassle technology, but then when the **** hits the fan (or you want to change something) you have hassle.
Go the route I advocated before of buying for the future by getting a cheap but decent system. You can replace parts more easily, and if you see a motherboard/CPU combo for a ridiculous price you can grab it, or get more RAM, or bung in a better graphics card when you want it and can afford it.
Sooooo the way forward.  |
Crass to quote your own posts but I just reread the thread.
LotM I see you are in fact worried about building for the future, but have concluded you can get this machine now and buy a decent one later. I don't think you appreciate how much easier (and cheaper!) it is to upgrade. I have built 3 systems in my life for personal use, a P2-400 with Voodoo3 graphics (this kicked severe ass when I built it), a 1.2 Ghz Athlon with Hercules with great budget card graphics (this kicked less ass in relative terms, but was a cheap upgrade) and my current 2Ghz with 9800 Pro (kicked most ass when built, but cost a nasty amount of cash all in as I upgraded most at once this time).
Each system has fed into the next. I have 2 systems from the 3 I built (ie one with old components entirely). I still use my monitor, keyboard and floppy drive from my first machine! The old mobo, cpu, hard drive, and graphics card are in my spare machine.
Other stuff I sold to get money for upgrade.
Consider it.
P.S I agree with the post I quoted. That guy makes a lot of sense.
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child of Thor
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quote:
Originally posted by lord of the mark
wait im confused COT - youre saying the Packard Bell is your NEW machine? But didnt PB go out of business some years ago? |
Yes my new PC(I've had it for a couple of months Dr.Spike), is a PB9533 with the on-board i810e graphics chip and 3xPCI expansion slots(no AGP).
Its old, but not as old as my main gaming PC - a rather cool and versitle P166 that runs all my fav games(from Civ2 and CTP2 to Xcom and EU2) - this one has a rubbish 2MB Cirrus logic graphics card, but can atleast accept this new Geforce2 MX i've bought recently.
I was hopeing with this new PC(the PB), that i could atlast play Medieval Total War and Thief 2 at home(i've played them on the work computers before). Sadly neither games will work on my 'new' PIII 533(PB) as they dont like the on-board i810e chip.
Thus i got hold of the Geforce2 MX - its the only PCI compatible card i've seen in the shops localy(i dont buy over the net yet), and it works fine in the P166. Sadly even in that pc the p166 cant run Medieval or Thief2.
So i spent the last few days trawling the web for info/advice on disableing the on-board chip so i can run the Geforce2 MX one instead, as this would mean i can run those two games at home.
Nothings worked so far, but this weekend i'll have a go at flashing the Bios, as the main problem is that with the current Bios options i've got, i dont seem to have enough options to fix my problem. If this isn't the answer then possibly it could be due to the power supply not having enough juice(its got a 150W one).
I might of course just kill the PB, but at the momment the only games that i'll lose out on are PatricianIII and Hardwar.........so i've decided the risk is worth it.
I got the PB PC for free, so its been more agrivating than anything else, so dont feel too sorry for me - i didn't have to starve to get the PC
You have an on-board pc dont you? Have you tried yet to put in a better graphics card? anyway if not then maybe when you do, and if you get problems then this part of the thread may help out a little - especially if i can get mine sorted 
Last edited by child of Thor on 05-02-2005 at 15:40
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Locutus
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ACS CTP1/2 Manager & Civ4 Co-Manager
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Hengelo, The Netherlands
Nov 1999
time: 06:17
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I worked for PB (well, not for PB itself but for an external company that was contracted by PB) for several years. My first advice to anyone would be: never EVER EVER buy a PB pc. You WILL regret it.
If you want to buy a brand, buy Dell. It's expensive but, in my experience, worth it (that is, if you're not pc savvy enough to build your own pc).
quote:
Originally posted by lord of the mark
wait im confused COT - youre saying the Packard Bell is your NEW machine? But didnt PB go out of business some years ago? |
No, they're still around. They were bought up by NEC though, maybe you're confused with that?
quote:
Nothings worked so far, but this weekend i'll have a go at flashing the Bios, as the main problem is that with the current Bios options i've got, i dont seem to have enough options to fix my problem. If this isn't the answer then possibly it could be due to the power supply not having enough juice(its got a 150W one). |
Of all the thousands of PB systems I've worked with, I've only seen 1 or 2 systems where onboard stuff could not be turned off, and I'm fairly certain none of them were i810 systems. Certainly a BIOS option or jumper should be present. It might be that it doesn't work, but it should be present. And if it doesn't work, a BIOS upgrade is indeed the way to go (though you might first want to simply try using a different slot, sometimes that solves the problem as well), though make sure you get the right version as PB mobos are not always standard editions. Get it from the PB website rather than the Mobo manufacturor, if at all possible. PM/IM/email me your serial number and I may be able to help you.
Last edited by Locutus on 05-02-2005 at 17:18
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child of Thor
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Cheers for the offer - you may well here from me next week sometime
quote:
Originally posted by Locutus
Of all the thousands of PB systems I've worked with, I've only seen 1 or 2 systems where onboard stuff could not be turned off, and I'm fairly certain none of them were i810 systems. 1. Certainly a BIOS option should be present, especially if it's the system less than 5 years old. It might be that the option doesn't work, but it should be present. And if it doesn't work, a BIOS upgrade is indeed the way to go. 2. (though you might first want to simply try using a different slot, sometimes that solves the problem as well), though make sure you. 3. get the right version as PB mobos are not always standard editions. Get it from the PB website rather than the Mobo manufacturor, if at all possible. PM/IM/email me your serial number and I may be able to help you. |
ref bold point 1.
well the only thing that looks like it might be relevent in the current Bios are two options:
1. is you can choose either 'On-board VGA' or 'Add-on board VGA'
2. is a 'PCI snooping thingy' 'on' or 'off'
i've played with both sets of options and either i get the Geforce as an extra monitor in the display manager settings box(in this case if the monitor is plugged into the new cards port you get a display saying something like 'this card is properly configured and recognised - to access it plug your monitor back into the monitor port and change the settings within the Display Manager dialog boxes' - but its only ever a second monitor, even after unchecking the 'exits in hardware mode' boxes for the current main card(i810e or VGA standard) etc), or it doesnt even boot up.
The pc makes one beep sound, then nothing - no monitor light or anything(with the monitor plugged into either the new cards port or the origonal port on the pc case) although the power-on light on the pc is on, but no hard-drive noise etc.
ref bold point 2.
I've tried all three of the PCI slots - but i just the same issues as above(i've taken out all the modems etc, to free up all the PCI slots).
ref bold point 3.
Ok this sounds like a good idea - i did get the Bios from the motherboard manufacturer(its a Gigabyte GA-6WMM by the way). So i'll go check the PB website and see what i can find although i think i couldn't even find my exact model of PC on their site - i guess its too old? well there was the 'iWork' range that sounded pretty close? I'll go check anyway.
If i can get this PC to run with the new graphics card then i'll have my mid-range games pc sorted(circa 1995-2000ish).
The plan has been to have 3 home PCs that i can cover the gaming spectrum with(from the 80's through to present day).
The last PC, which i've yet to get, is going to be the one that costs me money rather than just time, and one i'm sure Dr.Spike will approve off
Thanks again for the offer of help Locutus 
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08-12-2004 19:31
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