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Kidicious
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Diety of Kidiverse
Mar 2003
time: 21:26
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This is really part of our macho culture. We can't blame this individual anymore than we blame ourselves.
Last edited by Kidicious on 05-02-2005 at 08:20
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Dis
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Las Vegas, Nevada
Feb 2000
time: 21:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Alexander's Horse
You haven't met any Australian soldiers then.
I was chatting with a naval officer recently, a lt. commander on a frigate, about shore visits. He said his men had 2 priorities on shore leave - sex and brawling - and then he added, thank God they still have some mongrel in them, that they like to fight, you need troops like that. I had to agree.
This general was foolish to speak publicly like that but most fighting troops are in it to kill and blow things up. Most successful generals are blood thirsty, cold blooded characters. |
navy is different from actual combat troops. This will be the case no matter what country. Navy faces different types dangers, they don't act like infantry etc. I was on a carrier, I didn't face any dangers  . I was safer on a carrier than driving down the highway. sure there could be steam rupter (which will kill you in seconds), I won't even mention a reactor accident, that was very unlikely. Either case we never have to face our enemy face to face.
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molly bloom
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Lundenwic
Oct 2001
time: 15:26
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quote:
Originally posted by The diplomat
No, I don't support anyone killing for fun. But let's remember that who we are fighting. We are killing terrorists who murder, rape and abuse women and children. These terrorists are barbarians.
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Now why is terrorism bad now, but good when Reagan was in power?
It seems to me it was perfectly acceptable to American Republicans to countenance the murder, rape and abuse of men women and children in El Salvador, Guatemala, Nicaragua and Angola.
When did the Damascene conversion to being all touchy-feely about the human rights of foreigners take place?
Now, William Calley. Was he a barbarian terrorist ? His behaviour seems hardly distinguishable from that of some Islamic fundamentalists.
And if so, where did he learn his barbarity?
"The Viet Cong were not in the village and instead more than 500 unarmed civilians were brutally killed in an unprovoked attack by US troops.
Lieutenant Calley will be sentenced in the next few days after the verdict was announced at Fort Benning, Georgia today.
The jury of six army officers spent 13 days weighing up evidence from a four month trial.
They rejected his claim he was merely following orders in a military chain of command instilled in him since joining the army.
Lieutenant Calley faced four charges:
the murder of at least 30 "oriental human beings" at a junction of two trails
killing 70 others in a ditch
shooting a man who approached him with his hands raised begging for mercy
killing a child running from the ditch where the 70 died.
He was found guilty on the first three charges, although the number of the first was slashed from 30 to one because of conflicting evidence, and the death toll in the second charge was reduced to 20.
The final charge was reduced to assault with intent to kill a child of which he was found guilty."
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/...000/2530975.stm
Rape and kill American nuns- get out of jail (almost) free:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/137381.stm
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General Ludd
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Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Odin
That is a bunch of warm-and-fuzzy blank slate crap. Violence against people who are not a member of a person's group (clan, tribe, nation, ethnicity, religion, sports team, etc) is part of human nature, a trait we share with chimps. |
No, it's not. It's a part of culture, or on a more personal level, a frame of mind. To say it's a part of human nature is to say that every human has acted like that, does act like that, and always will act like that - none of which are even close to being true.
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Odin
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Biology Nerd at Minnesota State University Moorhead
Sep 2000
time: 23:26
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quote:
Originally posted by General Ludd
It being human nature would mean that it is the normal, assumed, behaviour for a human and that invariably, everyone is inclined to behave that way. That's not true. |
You have a very strange definition of human nature. Human nature doesn't allways means we will do it, it also means we have a predisposition for it, and that predisposition for violence, especially in males, is in every human group. I suggest you read the books The Origins of Virtue and Nature via Nurture by Matt Ridley.
I get annoyed when the nurture partisans start spouting BS, most of it for ideological reasons rather than scientific ones. The nature partisans are almost as annoying, but thier problem is not ideological, it is mostly not realizing that Nature and Nurture are not opposed to each other, they cooperate.
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General Ludd
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Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Odin
You have a very strange definition of human nature. Human nature doesn't allways means we will do it, it also means we have a predisposition for it |
That's what I just said. That it is the assumed, default, behaviour and that every human being would naturally be inclined to that behaviour - ie. a predisposition.
quote:
and that predisposition for violence, especially in males, is in every human group |
Which rings us back to the original comment that started this...
quote:
This is really part of our macho culture. |
But it is not in every human group, thankfully, because it is not a part of human nature. As I said before, it's a result of culture, or on the personal level, a state of mind. Characteristicly that of macho/masculine sort, as you point out. If it was human nature, it would not be found "especially in males" because it would be a behaviour that is taken for granted to be found in everyone at some level.
But because it is a result of culture, it can be found "especially in males", or in this case, amongst those who ascribe to the popular macho culture that encourages violence, competition, and dominance. (which is not exclusive to males, or inclusive of all males, even though it has traditionally been masculine notion)
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05-02-2005 08:04
Except at their own goverments. 
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