04-03-2005 20:53									#1
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I honestly am dumbfounded. With the recent news of the 4 deaths in Alberta from the RCMP officers raiding a grow-op, the debate has ignited again.

The buzz is now all about how evil Marijuana clearly is.

Why is it banned? When demand for it is so high, and so many people use it (its use is increasnig in Canada last I checked), why do we still make people go to shady dealers for it? Why do we create this massive, profitable black market that profits organized crime and breeds violence?

The responsible thing to do is legalize the possession of, and distribution of, and growing of, marijuana. Eliminate the black market, regulate it, and tax it.

The only reason marijuana is a 'gateway drug' is because it forces users to deal with dealers, who likely try to push them into harder, more expensive drugs.

We need to legalize marijuana, and we need to educate people about it.

It's irresponsible to do otherwise. Four brave RCMP officers lost their lives to a career criminal who is using the black market for marijuana to make money. Remove that source of income from these scumbags, use the tax money from marijuana and put it directly in the health care system instead.

	04-03-2005 20:57									#2
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Also, one word: "Prohibition"

	04-03-2005 21:05									#3
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No disagreement from me.

	04-03-2005 21:10									#4
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Likewise, nice treatment of it Asher

	04-03-2005 21:12									#5
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Let's all get wasted!!!

	04-03-2005 22:03									#6
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Read the history on why it got banned banned in the first place, interesting read. As usual it's a case of "follow the money".

- tabak lobby
- farming lobby
- clothing lobby

	04-03-2005 22:21									#7
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Legalise drugs

	05-03-2005 00:10									#8
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The question arises however what the criminals will do once you take their source of income.
It's not that they'll stop being criminal. They'll find other sources and I bet they wouldn't be legal.
So maybe the state thinks that as of now they are doing least harm. Also heavy taxation and a tough price leads to people still visiting the well established black market, who will just make things cheaper.

just a thought...

Anyway, there is low chance for it to happen given the pressure they put on regular smokers nowadays.

	05-03-2005 00:51									#9
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What it really means is that the government wants to stop people having cheap fun.

You could add to the pro-pot lobby the makers of comfortable couches and the manufacturers of snack cakes.

	05-03-2005 01:07									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Atahualpa The question arises however what the criminals will do once you take their source of income. It's not that they'll stop being criminal. They'll find other sources and I bet they wouldn't be legal. So maybe the state thinks that as of now they are doing least harm. Also heavy taxation and a tough price leads to people still visiting the well established black market, who will just make things cheaper.

legalisation would destroy the black market. think of it this way, when the government puts taxes up on beer, you don't ring round your mates asking if anyone has any carling for sale, you sit in the pub and complain a little about the price increase.

in any case the price of every drug would drop a huge amount if they were legalised, which is kinda scary, considering how cheap some drugs are anyway

	05-03-2005 01:12									#11
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quote: Originally posted by C0ckney legalisation would destroy the black market. think of it this way, when the government puts taxes up on beer, you don't ring round your mates asking if anyone has any carling for sale, you sit in the pub and complain a little about the price increase. in any case the price of every drug would drop a huge amount if they were legalised, which is kinda scary, considering how cheap some drugs are anyway

If it were legalised, the price would rise. Canadians absolutely LOVE excessive taxation and no government in the land (provincial or federal) would pass up that cash cow.

The point to be addressed is what way do we want to go on this issue? Our feds think decriminalising is a good idea. Less punishment for using but to enforce strict laws against cultivation. This makes no sense. Where does the government think users are going to get their supply?

Any Libs want to defend this policy?

	05-03-2005 01:34									#12
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nah, i'm pretty sure the price would come down, it's all down to economies of scale and middle men.

some people grow gear at home, but there's only so much you can fit in a house, without it becoming very obvious to the outside world what you are doing. these people tend to sort out their mates at retail prices, which covers their costs and makes them a few quid on the side. of course a lot of weed comes from much bigger warehouse plantations or from fields, a lot is imported. however to get this stuff to the end user, it has to go a lot of people (and believe me, i mean a lot) and all of these people will be making some money off it, right down to the geezer who buys a few ounces and sells it off in 1/8s. there is money to be made even at this level.

now if it were legalised, all these small time growers and middle men would be cut out. a big company isn't going to buy from some dude with half a dozen plants in his room, and they're not going to let it pass through ten people's hands to get to the shops, so yes i think it would be very much cheaper

	05-03-2005 08:18									#13
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One of my closest friends almost died a month ago, from a bad reaction to his meds. He's a paranoid schizophrenic who before he got onto proper meds used to self-medicate with pot. Pot just made his mental illness even worse, and is much more difficult to treat.

So I fail to see why we should encourage more people to harm themselves than we do now.

	05-03-2005 08:23									#14
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legalize it

	05-03-2005 08:26									#15
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Asher the computer geek joins the unemployed commies for the common goal of legalizing pot.

I blame Apple.

	05-03-2005 08:29									#16
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quote: One of my closest friends almost died a month ago, from a bad reaction to his meds. He's a paranoid schizophrenic who before he got onto proper meds used to self-medicate with pot. Pot just made his mental illness even worse, and is much more difficult to treat.

Um... and you don't drink like a fish if you're a diabetic.

	05-03-2005 08:39									#17
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You know what I'm going with BK on this one. Apparently it's harmed me and there are a lot of psychiatrists who deal with wards of people my age and younger with schitzophrenia that really shouldn't, because of weed. Smoking reasonable amounts on rare occasions as an adult is ok, but too many kids of 15/16 and younger start, when the brain hasn't fully developed and long-term damage can be caused.

If I were to speak in strictly logical terms, then I would go for libertarianism and legalise it, but you can't run a society on very logical libertarian terms simply because people are just far too stupid. I haven't refuted keeping it legal like alcohol, and certainly that would undermine drug dealers and the gateway drug phenomenon, but then I'm yet to be convinced entirely between the two available options.

	05-03-2005 08:42									#18
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Wow I really am a complete schitzophrenic with this issue aren't I?

	05-03-2005 08:43									#19
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People with schizophrenia should not smoke weed.

People with diabetes should not drink Scotch heavily.

People with haemophilia should not inject heroin.

Healthy adults who wish to enjoy marijuana should be able to without the fun police busting them.

	05-03-2005 08:45									#20
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I support restricted marijuana sales. It should be regulated like alcohol and tobacco - like no sales to children.

Alcohol causes mental illness in some people too.

	05-03-2005 08:45									#21
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Ok that's good

	05-03-2005 08:46									#22
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<-- see location field

Of course. And why stop at pot?

	05-03-2005 08:50									#23
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Indeed, why stop at pot?

	05-03-2005 08:53									#24
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quote: Um... and you don't drink like a fish if you're a diabetic.

Pot is supposed to be harmless, why would people bother warning you that if you have a mental illness, that pot will make it worse?

I didn't even know that myself, until I got a chance to talk to my friend.

	05-03-2005 08:56									#25
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quote: Pot is supposed to be harmless

????

Noithing IS harmless, why expect it from pot?

	05-03-2005 08:59									#26
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I hear that all the time.

Pot is harmless. Pot has a medicinal benefit for many conditions, not met by current medications. Pot is less harmful than cigarettes.

The list goes on.

The truth takes quite a bit longer to put on her shoes.

	05-03-2005 09:02									#27
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quote: Pot is supposed to be harmless, why would people bother warning you that if you have a mental illness, that pot will make it worse?

Because it is harmless if taken by healthy adults in moderate amounts.

I knew a guy who drank a bottle of rum a day and killed himself with drink. That doesn't mean that alcohol is harmful to healthy people in moderate amounts.

Hell, if you have a heart condition, sex can be fatal. Are we going to ban sex too?

	05-03-2005 09:03									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon quote: Pot is supposed to be harmless, why would people bother warning you that if you have a mental illness, that pot will make it worse? Because it is harmless if taken by healthy adults in moderate amounts. I knew a guy who drank a bottle of rum a day and killed himself with drink. That doesn't mean that alcohol is harmful to healthy people in moderate amounts. Hell, if you have a heart condition, sex can be fatal. Are we going to ban sex too?

and fast food, don't forget that!

	05-03-2005 09:06									#29
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People who have never smoked pot have unrealistic ideas about what it does.

It turns you into a giggling, happy, hungry idiot, and that's about it.

Side effects for me included bloodshot eyes, a new appreciation for reggae, and a sore face from smiling too much.

	05-03-2005 09:11									#30
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Don't forge the heavy legs, oohh and the colors dude..don't forget about the colors... :hyppie: