04-06-2005 00:04									#331
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Regardless, I would like to see an option to either lock your post count or delete it, I actually find myself worrying about being accused of spam and going back and editing posts that probably warrant a new post (like when I put a reply to someone's response to my post in my original post, must make it confusing for someone reading it latter and i am not sure the original responder would ever see it

Sparrowhawk I suppose you could always ask for a MtG...*

*MichaeltheGreat had his post count reset by Markos about a year ago.

He should technically be a deity by now...

	04-06-2005 00:06									#332
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Dr Zoidberg But you have to draw the line somewhere I guess, and canīt really complain about the current state of things

Yeah you can. See above.

	04-06-2005 00:06									#333
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quote: Originally posted by Carolus Rex Heh, heh! I know a troll when I see one... Carolus

do ya now?



Ahh 'tis good to be a Troll even unto Grandparie Trollarie

	04-06-2005 00:40									#334
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quote: Perhaps we're all more mature now, but back then off-topic was a zoo and you know it!

****, I'm getting Berzerked.

What happened "back then" is irrelevant to the situation today.

quote: This might be true.

It is true - no need to qualify it. And not just because they're gone from Apolyton, but that they're gone from the rest of the net not dedicated to Nick Jr-watching n00bs.

quote: Perhaps this is true, but I imagine it's easier to moderate on-topic fora than an off-topic one.

Again, it is true. For the people who really care about post count, they're left with one thing to do - creatively spam the on-topic forums.

Also, I imagine that it's easier to be lax in one's moderatorship duties when your forum is getting, perhaps, five threads a week.

And who is there to moderate whether a game is actually being played? You obviously have problems with the suggestion that games are being faked to increase post count, but LOTM didn't seem so "shocked." And one thread hardly a rebuttal makes, nor was my example limited to "Civ" games but also forum games that are nothing more than post-count padders. Hangman?

quote: If I were you I would try to change things... Make all the OT posters stay away for a week to lower the revenue and show your importance... Or propose that only people who contribute financially to the site get post counts... Or figure out something else...

In regards to your first part, why bother? I have no desire to "lead" such a silly movement for such a worthless cause, but neither should I really accept being considered second-rate in a forum that I financially support through the PLUS program. In regards to your second point, I've already suggested that OT post counts be included for PLUS members many times. Not once has the suggestion even been responded. In regards to your third point, I did suggest the elimination of post counts altogether in this very thread (and before). That's "figuring something else" out. Where are your suggestions?

quote: Lashing out at people only cement old (and current?) views on the OT people...

I didn't lash out at you, Carolus, I called your position BS as it is not born about by the conditions that actually exist. Don't internalize this discussion by taking it personally.

However, again note the implied cliqueishness on your part in the bolded sentence fragment. "The OT people." Yes, fear us because we're The OT People!

This is precisely the sort of attitude that both led to this idiotic situation and perpetuates it.

Ben:

quote: However, I am sure the very last mafia game has contributed a portion greater than 1.5 percent of my total post count, or 45 posts. I see nothing wrong with rasputin making a 150 posts in a thread with more than 20 times that number of posts.

Yes, but photographs of your homes, hangman, and "Mafia" games are not Civ related, which is the stated reason for OT posts not counting.

FYI, The Gorecki Third Symphony was a reference to a recent Boris Godunov thread in the OT. The reference to the thread was a joke likely recognizable only to readers of the thread.

Lastly my post was serious and was not a troll. I truly think that removing the OT post counts was a purely spiteful act and instead of benefiting the community it has increased the divisiveness of it. "The OT people." And the stated reasons for not having them count is increasingly untenable given the vast amount of non-Civ spam in the "official" forums. Couple that with the Law of Unintended Consequences (heavy amounts of spam in the on-topic forums), a voluntary financial program that many long-time OTers have supported and you have a decision that is increasingly obsolete, irrelevant and wrong.

	04-06-2005 00:44									#335
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wow, I lost interest in this thread pages ago. I can't believe it's up to 334 posts. I figured it'd be shut down by now because of spamming. I don't push my luck in threads like this. I don't want a PCR. I make a few posts and leave.

oh, and to post something related to the thread topic. I would be a deity if I had not had my post count reduced a few times.

	04-06-2005 01:01									#336
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by JohnT And who is there to moderate whether a game is actually being played? You obviously have problems with the suggestion that games are being faked to increase post count, but LOTM didn't seem so "shocked."

obviously someone is missing the irony.

quote: Again, it is true. For the people who really care about post count, they're left with one thing to do - creatively spam the on-topic forums

Oh, but its the creativity thats so beautiful.


The only good spam, is metametaspam.

	04-06-2005 01:06									#337
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quote: obviously someone is missing the irony.

Perhaps I am. Brighter minds than ours have noticed the death of irony and subtlety on the internet.

Regardless, even granting that Carolus is correct and all PBEM and "your turn" posts do, in fact, refer to games that are being played, it doesn't change the other points.

	04-06-2005 01:08									#338
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

What's the deal with post counts anyway? I'll admit it was cool getting away from "settler" and even better getting a custom avatar. But after that? Pfft...


Give us custom titles*, let OT-posts count again** and let the moderator deal with the spammers.



*It was cool using "Kriegsminister" over at webring.
**I don't care but why not...

	04-06-2005 04:41									#339
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

This is a gaming site. It isn't such a stretch that games (yes, even hangman) are counted while well-though-out analysis of music are not. Then again, both examples are in the minority of the catagories they represent.

In the Other Games forum alone, Hangman is at the extreme low range of effort per +1. Every other forum game represents a great deal of effort and though behind each and every "sent" post, even if that isn't visible to the casual viewer. Galactic Overlord, Nuclear War, Nascar, each needs effort for the person involved.

Then there is the OT. Do I really need to argue that most posts there have little thought behind them?

	04-06-2005 05:16									#340
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by JohnT What happened "back then" is irrelevant to the situation today.

Well, you brought up the reason (in your opinion) why post counts in the OT forum were eliminated "back then". I only put the record straight, or at least balanced the view.

quote: Originally posted by JohnT And who is there to moderate whether a game is actually being played? You obviously have problems with the suggestion that games are being faked to increase post count, but LOTM didn't seem so "shocked." And one thread hardly a rebuttal makes, nor was my example limited to "Civ" games but also forum games that are nothing more than post-count padders. Hangman?

This is downright ludicrous...

i) I am not "shocked", I just find it so silly I don't even know where to begin... Perhaps there are people faking PBEM games... Give me one single example, ok? For every one you give, I'll give you 50 spammers from the OT...

ii) Look at the current PBEM duel between Slowthinker and Peaster (it's in the Civ 2 PBEM forum if you care to check it out). Look at the extent of their individual posts, where they share their respective strategies...

This is spam in your book? What the heck should we then call the garbage that's posted in all the other fora (not just OT)?

iii) Don't you realise that people who play a computer game that's soon 10 years old (an eternity for a computer game, for heaven's sake!) love that game?

You seriously think they're spammers? Heck, I haven't seen Slowthinker even post outside Civ 2 fora... And that should be seen as suspicious? At a site created to spur discussion on Civ franchise games?

iv) I didn't say anything about your points regarding FG; I even hinted that I agree with you!

quote: Originally posted by JohnT Where are your suggestions?

Huh? You just cited them above...

quote: Originally posted by JohnT However, again note the implied cliqueishness on your part in the bolded sentence fragment. "The OT people." Yes, fear us because we're The OT People! This is precisely the sort of attitude that both led to this idiotic situation and perpetuates it.

I phrased it like that, because I knew it would tick you off...

I respect a lot of the posters in the OT. Sten Sture was one of my best buddies here at Apolyton until we lost contact (I asked recently if someone in OT knew his current whereabouts)...

What we need less of (in terms of attitude) is "I call BS on your points!"...

Carolus

	04-06-2005 05:24									#341
	Remove this text

now I been watching and reading and trying to be objective.

I have some input

I love Apolyton

I do post a lot and no not very much is earth shattering revelations along the GNOME THEORY Line

But

I play a lot of Games..CIV based Games and have a lot of fun doing so

I have so much fun in fact my wife sees my happiness and says why dont you go ahead and and get a lifetime PLUS subscription

Ok I do

I spend most of my free time here

I have learned some slic coding

some scenario making

some story writing opportunities

What have I "contributed" to the site?
not much except trying to be a regular member and keep games alive

I post and post often

I do what others do or should do and that is post that a turn is sent

I add comments and yes some mean absolutely nothing

I attach images and notice that a lot of people do, not all and perhaps I may be the leader I am not sure

I wanted to be a Deity

I wanted to post a lot

I want to be known as an active participant and I never said I was as smart or profound as the MODS or the great skilled,schooled and scholared folks whom grace our hallowed forums.

But whats wrong with that?

Why cant I be a Deity and post within the parameters of the site?

Why should it be a problem that I have posted over 13,000 posts, one of only 7 to post that many

Is that a bad thing to be proud of?

I am a supporter of this site and active

When I joined, I saw a lot of Pompous Posting going on but thought"Be your self" Bruce.

I have seen a lot of debates going on, riding the horse into the ground over the same old point.

If someone does that ios that correct?

If they offer a fresh perspective maybe or maybe not

My point is what is it hurting to post within the sites acceptable standards

We got some here whom post "Part Hard" to encourage

We then have some whom post a




or



and then get a 1+ is that right or wrong?

I think all here post things, including Mods, that are not exactly within the spirit of the posting spirit

I think if someone doesnt like Deities with post counts exceeding 10,000 posts too bad

If Mark changes it or Dan or Ming decides to (and not sure if he has or has not that authority) to say enough is enough

then and then the rules have changed

I enjoy Apolyton and as Long as I do I shall be here

I want to again Thank Markos and Dan for this awesome site

I also want to thanks all the folks I choose as online friends and occassional foes

I wouldnt miss it for the world

Bruce "Grandpa Troll" Cronkite

Attachment: cameron-bruce.jpg
This has been downloaded 125 time(s).

	04-06-2005 05:34									#342
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Great post! A distinct summary of my own devotion to Apolyton...

Hail to Apolyton and hail to Grandpa Troll!

Carolus

Last edited by Carolus Rex on 04-06-2005 at 05:39

	04-06-2005 06:07									#343
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wow, great post, Grandpa.

	04-06-2005 07:50									#344
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Nice post Gramps. And while I don't post quite as much as you, I have the same general attitude about the site.

	04-06-2005 18:50									#345
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I never got the logic in disabling pc in the OTF, but saying it makes us "2nd class citizens" is pretty bizarre ...

	04-06-2005 19:00									#346
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quote: Originally posted by Last Conformist I never got the logic in disabling pc in the OTF, but saying it makes us "2nd class citizens" is pretty bizarre ...

I dont consider anyone here a second class citizen..including you my friend

I do however see that I often come in second place in efforts to make all feel welcome to our home here at Apolyton

Gramps

	04-06-2005 23:19									#347
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Last Conformist I never got the logic in disabling pc in the OTF, but saying it makes us "2nd class citizens" is pretty bizarre ...

I actually agree with it (though it still annoys me).

People already spam as it is, no need to make things worse.

	08-06-2005 06:03									#348
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Last Conformist I never got the logic in disabling pc in the OTF, but saying it makes us "2nd class citizens" is pretty bizarre ...

It isn't so much as what we see now in the OTF, but what used to be...

Blatant spam posted solely for the purpose of increasing post counts. It got really bad; people were complaining that the interesting threads kept getting pushed off the front page (or 1st 2 pages!!) by all the spam threads. It's too bad, cuz some of them were fun.

But I remember and can understand why post count doesn't count in the OT. I don't like it either, but I wouldn't want to go back.

	09-06-2005 23:02									#349
	Increase Your PM Length

Yeah, based on how the activity is there now, I wouldn't mind them counting. But I too remember the days before. It wasn't pretty. I will admit that some of it was outright hilarious. I wouldn't want to go back. Especially now that I'm a mod and would have to spend more time controlling order.

	09-06-2005 23:13									#350
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quote: Yeah, based on how the activity is there now, I wouldn't mind them counting.

Only if they started counting now again, the old situation would arise again, as people would start posting single-sentence replies 50 times a day.

	09-06-2005 23:22									#351
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Yes, agreed, that's why I said I wouldn't want to go back to it.

	09-06-2005 23:30									#352
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quote: Originally posted by Solver quote: Yeah, based on how the activity is there now, I wouldn't mind them counting. Only if they started counting now again, the old situation would arise again, as people would start posting single-sentence replies 50 times a day.

HAve you checked out PBEM tracker threads recently?

	09-06-2005 23:55									#353
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by Solver quote: Yeah, based on how the activity is there now, I wouldn't mind them counting. Only if they started counting now again, the old situation would arise again, as people would start posting single-sentence replies 50 times a day.

Who's to say that still doesn't go on- although it seems to happen in the on-topic forums more nowadays.

Honestly, it does seem like the average post lengths, as someone else mentioned before, have become much shorter than they were in the past.

But that may very well be due to the preponderance of DSL at people's places of work and school, so that they can check for updates and reply every hour or so instead of every 8 hours

	10-06-2005 00:23									#354
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Dauphin HAve you checked out PBEM tracker threads recently?

So whats wrong with the PBEM Tracking thread?

I mean

If a person posts "turn 123 sent"

then the players waiting know whom should have it

I have seen too many games that no one knows where the turn is and the game goes stagnant

Like in this thread everyone who posts here is doing what? Replying to 21 deities

exactly how is this in or out of the prescribed boundaries of posting properly?

(That is any different than pbem)

oh

@ RAH

I love the ferret and thats why I be good dun want to have it nipping at me GT's

Gramps

	10-06-2005 00:31									#355
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quote: Originally posted by Grandpa Troll So whats wrong with the PBEM Tracking thread?

Absolutely nothing, they serve a purpose, but do they require to have post counts associated with them? I don't think they do, but then I think the whole concept of post counts rather banal so my views are rather irrelevant in this regard.

	10-06-2005 00:40									#356
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by Dauphin Absolutely nothing wrong with my giving my post count to Grandpa Troll,unlike OT Posters ranting,what Grandpa Troll posts does serve a purpose, but does anyone else? Is anyone else deserving such they require to have post counts associated with them? I don't think they do, but then I think the whole concept of post counts rather banal so my views are rather irrelevant in this regard. Please remember Gramps has little to make him whole so if posts counts do, please give him mine

Ok

Dauphin

If you insist

I am only here to please

Grandpa Troll

	10-06-2005 01:04									#357
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

You're welcome to them.

	10-06-2005 03:46									#358
	Get a bigger avatar today!

geee granps you are a funny fellow...


but back on topic ..

it is sad that the members top 20 posters no longer lists all the deitys

	10-06-2005 04:59									#359
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Rasputin geee granps you are a funny fellow... but back on topic .. it is sad that the members top 20 posters no longer lists all the deitys

why is this sad?

It is not a bad thing that we have the top twenty posters as Deities and a second page with one future more

I am soo confused

Why does anyone make such a big deal that we have more deities

Oh well

my guess is anyone dont wanna reach deity then they better not post since it only adds up

kinda like going to the doctore and telling him it hurts to bend my arm this way
to which the Doc sez..

Dont do it

	10-06-2005 05:02									#360
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Grandpa Troll why is this sad? It is not a bad thing that we have the top twenty posters as Deities and a second page with one future more I am soo confused Why does anyone make such a big deal that we have more deities Oh well my guess is anyone dont wanna reach deity then they better not post since it only adds up kinda like going to the doctore and telling him it hurts to bend my arm this way to which the Doc sez.. Dont do it

Well, some people believe that the Deity list is now filling up with spammers.