26-05-2005 05:11									#1
	If you use BitTorrent, the terrorists have won... Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

http://www.fbi.gov/dojpressrel/pres...rrent052505.htm

quote: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CRT WEDNESDAY, MAY 25, 2005 (202) 514-2008 WWW.USDOJ.GOV TDD (202) 514-1888 FEDERAL LAW ENFORCEMENT ANNOUNCES OPERATION D-ELITE, CRACKDOWN ON P2P PIRACY NETWORK First Criminal Enforcement Against BitTorrent Network Users WASHINGTON, D.C. - Acting Assistant Attorney General John C. Richter of the Criminal Division, Homeland Security Assistant Secretary for Immigration and Customs Enforcement Michael J. Garcia, and Assistant Director Louis M. Reigel of the FBI's Cyber Division today announced the first criminal enforcement action targeting individuals committing copyright infringement on peer-to-peer (P2P) networks using cutting edge file-sharing technology known as BitTorrent. This morning, agents of the FBI and U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) executed 10 search warrants across the United States against leading members of a technologically sophisticated P2P network known as Elite Torrents. Employing technology known as BitTorrent, the Elite Torrents network attracted more than 133,000 members and, in the last four months, allegedly facilitated the illegal distribution of more than 17,800 titles-including movies and software-which were downloaded 2.1 million times. In addition to executing 10 warrants, federal agents also took control of the main server that coordinated all file-sharing activity on the Elite Torrents network. Anyone attempting to log on to Elitetorrents.org today will receive the following message: "This Site Has been Permanently Shut Down by the Federal Bureau of Investigation and U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement." "Our goal is to shut down as much of this illegal operation as quickly as possible to stem the serious financial damage to the victims of this high-tech piracy-the people who labor to produce these copyrighted products," said Acting Assistant Attorney General Richter. "Today's crackdown sends a clear and unmistakable message to anyone involved in the online theft of copyrighted works that they cannot hide behind new technology." "Internet pirates cost U.S. industry hundreds of billions of dollars in lost revenue every year from the illegal sale of copyrighted goods and new online file-sharing technologies make their job even easier," said Assistant Secretary Garcia. "Through today's landmark enforcement actions, ICE and the FBI have shut down a group of online criminals who were using legitimate technology to create one-stop shopping for the illegal sharing of movies, games, software and music." "The theft of copyrighted material is far from a victimless crime," said Assistant Director Reigel of the FBI. "When thieves steal this data, they are taking jobs away from hard workers in industry, which adversely impacts the U.S. economy. The FBI remains committed to working with our partners in law enforcement at all levels and private industry to identify and take action against those responsible." Building on the success of Operation Gridlock, a similar takedown announced by federal law enforcement last August that has already led to the felony convictions of three P2P copyright thieves, Operation D-Elite targeted the administrators and "first providers" or suppliers of copyrighted content to the Elite Torrents network. By utilizing BitTorrent, the newest generation of P2P technology, Elite Torrents members could download even the largest files-such as those associated with movies and software-far faster than was possible using more traditional P2P technology. The content selection available on the Elite Torrents network was virtually unlimited and often included illegal copies of copyrighted works before they were available in retail stores or movie theatres. For example, the final entry in the Star Wars series, "Episode III: Revenge of the Sith," was available for downloading on the network more than six hours before it was first shown in theatres. In the next 24 hours, it was downloaded more than 10,000 times. Operation D-Elite is being conducted jointly by ICE and the FBI as part of the Computer And Technology Crime High Tech Response Team (CATCH), a San Diego task force of specially trained prosecutors and law enforcement officers who focus on high-tech crime. Federal and state member agencies of CATCH include the ICE, the FBI, the Department of Justice, the San Diego District Attorney's Office, San Diego Police Department, the San Diego Sheriff's Department, and San Diego County Probation. Operation D-Elite was coordinated and will be prosecuted by the Justice Department's Computer Crime and Intellectual Property Section, with the assistance and support of Computer Hacking and Intellectual Property (CHIP) coordinators in San Diego and U.S. Attorneys' Offices in Arizona, Illinois, Kansas, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Texas, Virginia and Wisconsin. The Motion Picture Association of America provided valuable assistance to the investigation.

The FBI: Keeping you safe from anthrax-infected, radioactive ill-gotten movie files.

	26-05-2005 05:20									#2
	Remove this text

bittorent is da pwnage madafakaz...

	26-05-2005 05:22									#3
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Indie torrent is .

	26-05-2005 05:25									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I'm getting star wars 3 as we speak!

	26-05-2005 05:26									#5
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Bleh. The so-called "damages" that piracy causes are largely a myth, slightly impacting the incomes of the top 1% wealthiest media artists.

I'd be all KINDS of excited if my books were downloaded with that kind of frequency. As an artist supposedly impacted by this stuff, I say:

-=Vel=-

	26-05-2005 05:28									#6
	Increase Your PM Length

The 'would you steal from supermarket' is moot point. The point is can you REPLICATE the product. That is copying. Peopel have 0 logics.

Would you steal a Ferrari? Hell no. Would I replicate one if I knew how? HELL YES!

BUT there are some problems with pirating anyway. Just shooting down few broken analogues, like for example the most popular argument.

	26-05-2005 05:33									#7
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I think my avatar sums up my feelings on this. :smoke:

On that note I bought $189 worth of CDs today. I do buy the CDs I like because I want to reward artists plus I have a closet full of band t-shirts and I routinely go to concerts. I am a firm believer in trying before you buy. I just have to many crap CDs that I bought for one song then found the other ten songs all suck. Now I buy the great CDs and I download the singles. Don't like it? Tough.

	26-05-2005 05:40									#8
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

You realize you could have fed like a finnish student, me, for OVER 2 months with that money? In cheapo countries, you would have.. you would have prolly saved 10 lives for 2 years. I hope that the songs you got are good though.

	26-05-2005 05:50									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Now with search being integrated unto its core functionality , let's see how long the futile attempts to curb BT will go on .

The beauty of this network is that all it takes if one seed and one torrent , then the thing cannot be stopped . If you manage to get it out just once , there is no way anyone can stop it from spreading further .

BT is a great feat of engineering , and a huge middle finger raised at the people who illegally attempt to coercively control distribution channels .

	26-05-2005 05:51									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

If I've already paid for the movie tickets to movie X , then am I morally entitled to download movie X under terms of fair use ?

	26-05-2005 06:10									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: If I've already paid for the movie tickets to movie X , then am I morally entitled to download movie X under terms of fair use ?

No, because you didn't buy the movie, you bought a single showing of it.

	26-05-2005 06:19									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

There is some truth to "when you pirate MP3s you're downloading communism" though - the Interenet has been the only place I can find Socialist music.

	26-05-2005 06:58									#13
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin I think my avatar sums up my feelings on this. :smoke: On that note I bought $189 worth of CDs today. I do buy the CDs I like because I want to reward artists plus I have a closet full of band t-shirts and I routinely go to concerts. I am a firm believer in trying before you buy. I just have to many crap CDs that I bought for one song then found the other ten songs all suck. Now I buy the great CDs and I download the singles. Don't like it? Tough.

Same here, I've bought CD's to the tune of 1000-2000€ the past year and a half, and half of those I bought after downloading and liking them.

	26-05-2005 07:00									#14
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colon what the hell... what do you do for living? Are you a ... pimp? That's a lot of money on CDs.. jeesyh.. no that I'm trying to say what you should buy, I'm glad for you if you can buy CDs that much.. just interested, what do you do, what is your income, and where do you work? It's an innocent question don't get your panties on twist!

	26-05-2005 07:02									#15
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Pekka The 'would you steal from supermarket' is moot point. The point is can you REPLICATE the product. That is copying. Peopel have 0 logics.

Digital property doesn't mean it costs nothing to produce it.

	26-05-2005 07:07									#16
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So? Your point changing this fact how? It's still not the same as stealing a Ferrari. Digital schmigital. Spin spinarooni!

	26-05-2005 07:19									#17
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by Asher No, because you didn't buy the movie, you bought a single showing of it.

Wouldn't it be better to say that you've rented a seat in a theatre? Gives it a bit more distance from the subject.

	26-05-2005 07:24									#18
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Pekka So? Your point changing this fact how? It's still not the same as stealing a Ferrari. Digital schmigital. Spin spinarooni!

Unless you give some meaningless metaphysical superiority to material stuff, well yes, it must change your point. That something is made of metal doesn't imply the owner will lose more if the good is stolen.

	26-05-2005 07:26									#19
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by General Ludd Wouldn't it be better to say that you've rented a seat in a theatre? Gives it a bit more distance from the subject.

Not the same thing -- you don't pay for the seat, you pay for the showing. The seat is a bonus.

	26-05-2005 07:29									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Oncle Boris, YES SO? My point is still valid and the Ferrari argument is total BS. Copying is still not the same, even though if it would mean someone doesn't get paid. The analogue still fails.

	26-05-2005 07:40									#21
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Pekka colon what the hell... what do you do for living? Are you a ... pimp? That's a lot of money on CDs.. jeesyh.. no that I'm trying to say what you should buy, I'm glad for you if you can buy CDs that much.. just interested, what do you do, what is your income, and where do you work? It's an innocent question don't get your panties on twist!

Would you believe me if I said I don't understand myself how I can afford it?

	26-05-2005 07:42									#22
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

If someone paid 2m to make a movie, and that he got no revenue out of it because of piracy, he would not have lost less than someone who paid 2m for a McLaren and then had it stolen.

That's the same, actually.

	26-05-2005 07:45									#23
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Asher No, because you didn't buy the movie, you bought a single showing of it.

Well **** them. They can be happy with my $10 or they can get nothing. The choice is theirs.

	26-05-2005 07:49									#24
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Pekka colon what the hell... what do you do for living? Are you a ... pimp? That's a lot of money on CDs.. jeesyh.. no that I'm trying to say what you should buy, I'm glad for you if you can buy CDs that much.. just interested, what do you do, what is your income, and where do you work? It's an innocent question don't get your panties on twist!

You see how much your urchasing power improves when you don't live in a country with a 50% income tax and a 20% VAT?

	26-05-2005 07:49									#25
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Colon, I would, but you forgot to tell me your income, job and company you work for. ANSWERS please! My time, precious.. no time.. for these games..

Oncle Boris, no it is not the same. It doesn't make it the same what the hell are you on?

THE SAME situation would be when Ferrari comes out with a new model, no one has seen it yet, it's got new features in it too maybe, and they put it on sale, then some folks go there, take a sneak peak and are able to make the exact copies of the original to themselves while not paying for it, and letting others do the same for themselves. THAT IS THE SAME SITUATION.

	26-05-2005 07:49									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Oncle Boris If someone paid 2m to make a movie, and that he got no revenue out of it because of piracy, he would not have lost less than someone who paid 2m for a McLaren and then had it stolen. That's the same, actually.

The person who made the movie would still have the movie... the guy who bought the McLaren would no longer have it.

A better comparison would be a car dealership purchasing a Mclaren from the manufacturer to sell, but not being able to sell it.

	26-05-2005 07:52									#27
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Oerdin yes yes... ps those are not the ONLY taxes, but then again you'd know guess it. Comparatively lower salaries, etc etc. The DOWNSIDES of this welfare state. It has its good sides too no doubt about it. But those are the bad sides.. Good for the lazy and unfortunate, bad for the dreaming people and who have passion and goals.. unfair, fair, who knows. I'd say very Christian though? I think it's OK, I think a world seriously needs few more places like ours is, but this is not jsut for me.. for most this is it, for me it isn't. Maybe I'll grow wiser in my years and decide to stay anyway.. who knows. I feel like seeing the world.. even if I won't make any more money, I still want to see the world more..

	26-05-2005 07:53									#28
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Commerically, the movie itself is worth nothing more than the revenue it can generate.

Or are you going to argue that the guy who had his car stolen, still has pictures and footage of it?

	26-05-2005 07:55									#29
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: THE SAME situation would be when Ferrari comes out with a new model, no one has seen it yet, it's got new features in it too maybe, and they put it on sale, then some folks go there, take a sneak peak and are able to make the exact copies of the original to themselves while not paying for it, and letting others do the same for themselves. THAT IS THE SAME SITUATION.

No, a product is also worth its WORKMANSHIP, even if it has no physical reality. How hard is that to understand?

If people could only get paid for material, obviously they wouldn't work as hard on IP.

	26-05-2005 07:57									#30
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Oncle Boris If someone paid 2m to make a movie, and that he got no revenue out of it because of piracy, he would not have lost less than someone who paid 2m for a McLaren and then had it stolen. That's the same, actually.

Except study after study has showen that online word of mouth in the download community actually increase sales. Take for instance the Norweigen girl singer/guitarist Annie who released her first album Anniemal in very early 2004. She hardly got any intial sales outside of Norway and none of the big radio companies would give her air time. She didn't even have enough cash to make a video.

Some kind in Norway liked her music and uploaded it on a few P2Pnetworks and the next thing you know anniemal caught on like wildfire. When I bought in last year it was still almost impossible to get and I had to order it online for the Norweigen distributor, but, there was finally a backlog of orders and the Norweigen record company decided to pony up with the money to make a video since sales had picked up so much. Annie started touring in the North America and Europe and finally she was awarded the best new artist in 2004 award. This is dispite the fact that she had no US distributor and hardly any radio stations had bothered to play her music other then a underground stations in places like NYC and SF.

She caught on because she had good music but no one would have heard of her without P2P file sharing.