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Maquiladora
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Those PGR3 shots wouldnt look out of place in Forza, thats not to say theyre not good, but hardly anything i havent seen before. Certainly i havent seen the same leaps from PS1/Saturn/N64 to PS2/Xbox/DC/GC yet, graphics-wise.
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Asher
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Calgary, Alberta
Nov 1999
time: 22:36
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http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/11/t...ml?pagewanted=1
quote:
As it happens, Intel's was not the only alternative chip design that Apple had explored for the Mac. An executive close to Sony said that last year Mr. Jobs met in California with both Nobuyuki Idei, then the chairman and chief executive of the Japanese consumer electronics firm, and with Kenichi Kutaragi, the creator of the Sony PlayStation.
Mr. Kutaragi tried to interest Mr. Jobs in adopting the Cell chip, which is being developed by I.B.M. for use in the coming PlayStation 3, in exchange for access to certain Sony technologies. Mr. Jobs rejected the idea, telling Mr. Kutaragi that he was disappointed with the Cell design, which he believes will be even less effective than the PowerPC. |
Every once and a while, even Steve Jobs can be right. 
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nostromo
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Montréal, Québec
Mar 2002
time: 00:36
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Another Xbox 360 versus PS3 comparison. http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2453
quote:
Final Words
Game consoles have always been different, architecturally. The PlayStation 2 was very different from the original Xbox, and thus it is no surprise to see that the two platforms continue to be quite different this time around.
Given what we’ve discussed thus far, there are a number of conclusions we can draw:
The most important thing to keep in mind is that the revolution in physics engines and collision detection isn’t going to happen over night. The first games for both consoles will, for all intents and purposes, be single threaded titles. More adventurous developers may even split up execution into two concurrent threads, but for the most part don’t expect to see a dramatic change in the quality and reality of the physics simulation of the first titles, especially when compared to titles like Doom 3 and Half Life 2.
However, a change is coming and by the end of next year multi-threaded game engines should be commonplace on both consoles and PCs, which will hopefully lead to much more entertaining experiences. The approach to that change will be different according to the platform; without a doubt, developers will have their work cut out for them.
The transition to multi-threaded development alone will increase development time 2 or 3 fold. Not to mention that the approach to architecting game engines will differ whether you are porting to the Xbox 360 or the PlayStation 3. The Xbox 360 is clearly going to be the easier of the two to develop for once a game engine is multi-threaded, just because of the general purpose nature of its hardware. That being said, it won’t be impossible to get the same level of performance out of the PS3, it will just take more work. In fact, specialized hardware can be significantly faster than general purpose hardware at certain tasks, giving the PS3 the potential to outperform the Xbox 360 in CPU tasks. It has yet to be seen how much work is required to truly exploit that potential however, and it will definitely be a while before we can truly answer that question.
Cell’s on-die memory controller is a blessing for game performance; it most definitely will keep the PPE fed far better than the Xbox 360’s external memory controller. Even the cache size advantage of the 360 won’t be able to offset the reduction in memory latency thanks to an on-die memory controller.
The on-die memory controller is not all an advantage however, a big part of its inclusion is out of necessity. Remembering back to our discussion about the SPEs as being in-order with no cache, threads run on these processors only have access to 256KB of local memory, which is reasonable for a cache, but not much in the way of memory. So these SPEs will depend on having low latency access to memory in order to keep their pipeline filled and actually contribute any useful performance to the system.
At the end of day 1, when running mostly single threaded code, the performance difference from a CPU standpoint between the Xbox 360’s Xenon and the PS3’s Cell processor is basically a wash. The 360 has more cache, while the Cell has a lower latency path to main memory. In the end, the first generation or two of games will mainly be a GPU battle between the two consoles, and both will offer significant improvements over what we have with current consoles.
Graphics-wise the 360’s Xenos GPU and the PS3’s RSX are fairly different in implementation, but may end up being very similar in performance. Treating Xenos as a 24-pipe R420, it could be quite competitive with a 24-pipe RSX despite a lower clock speed. The unified shader architecture of the Xenos GPU will offer an advantage in the majority of games today where we aren’t very geometry limited. The free 4X AA support offered by Xenos is also extremely useful in a console, especially when hooked up to a large TV.
If the PS3’s RSX isn’t much more than a higher clocked G70 then at least we have a good idea of its performance. NVIDIA has mentioned that by the time the RSX launches we will have a faster GPU on the PC, which leads us to believe that the performance advantages of the RSX are mostly clock speed related. At 550MHz, the RSX GPU should have no problems handling both 720p and 1080p resolutions, although the latter won’t be possible in all games, mainly those that are more texture bandwidth bound. We do think it was a mistake for Microsoft not to support 1080p, even if only supported by a handful of games/developers. At the same time, by not imposing strict AA implementation regulations like Microsoft, Sony does open themselves up to having some PS3 games plagued by jaggies despite the power of the console. Given the amount of power in both of these consoles, we truly hope that their introduction will mark the end of aliasing in console games, but some how we have a feeling it won’t. Aliasing has plagued console games for too long for it to just disappear, that has to be too good to be true.
With at least 5 months before the official release of Microsoft’s Xbox 360, and a number of still unanswered questions about the PlayStation 3, there is surely much more to discuss in the future. The true nature of NVIDIA’s RSX GPU, the real world programming model for Cell, even final hardware details for both consoles has yet to be fully confirmed. As we come across more information we will analyze and dissect it, but until then we hope you’ve gained more of an understanding of these consoles through this article.
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Last edited by nostromo on 25-06-2005 at 01:14
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Asher
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Calgary, Alberta
Nov 1999
time: 22:36
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New PGR3 screen:
Also available is the wireframe version of that picture: http://media.xboxyde.com/gallery/pu...56/726_0002.jpg
And a wireframe version of the last picture (since a lot of people insisted it was a photograph): http://media.xboxyde.com/gallery/pu...56/726_0003.jpg
From their website:
quote:
Last week we released a single screenshot from PGR3 which seemed to cause quite a stir all over the Internet...
Initially, people claimed it was just a photograph! I think people have pretty much come to the correct conclusion now though - this is what people can genuinely expect from the next generation of video games. Bizarre Creations are proud to be one of the developers leading the charge toward High Definition, and we're very pleased with the results so far.
As a small gift to all of you who still refuse to believe that last week's image was a real screenshot, here we have the wire-frame version of the same scene, captured from the same dev kit that the original screenshot was taken. After reading the comments from all over the web (ranging from "That's awesome" to "That's a fake!"), we felt we had to release something which proved we're not messing with you.
Some people also claimed that we only showed this particular building because it's our most impressive. That's simply not true... and I wanted to work out a way to prove it to you. So as I wandered over to Chris's desk to get this wire-frame shot I decided that I would ask him to grab whatever was on his screen at that particular moment. After a couple of seconds of fiddling with his 360 controller to get the best angle, Chris rendered out this new shot for us. This is New York City again, in a slightly different area of town - and as with the shot last week, it's just a random street rather than a specific 'showpiece' area that some were worried about.
Yes, it is possible to get all areas of the game that need it up to this level of detail – that’s what you get for 2 years work with up to 35 artists here at Bizarre, plus additional help from outsourcing companies! Some areas (ie. those with simple buildings in real life) won’t be as detailed, but where buildings are that complex, the game will be that complex too. And in case you don’t believe me again, the wire frame screenshot is printed below, taken immediately afterwards from the same dev kit, by switching the game into wireframe mode.
This is how PGR3's artwork looks right now. On actual 360 hardware. Please bear in mind, however, that you're still looking at a work in progress video game, and that the final in-game effects and lighting aren't even in place yet. We're still a long way from the finish line, but things will only improve from this point on. Start preparing now, and save your pennies for a widescreen HDTV and surround sound system. Although the game will still look stellar on a regular TV, you'll get the best experience when you go High Def.
In other news, Roger (our super code monkey) did a small show 'n' tell for the team. He demonstrated some of the new effects that have recently been put into the game. A whole bunch of us crowded into the meeting room, and saw the game running in all it's 720p glory on a huge projector. Running into barriers and watching the crowd scatter in terror never gets old!
In our debug build, we can detach the camera and wander over the cityscape, without having to worry about driving our car to the particular bit of track we want to look at. It really helps when you need to get a good look at some of the buildings or other geometry in the game. Whilst I was whizzing about in the debug camera, I stumbled upon something really impressive...
When you zoom right up to the back of your car, you can actually see gases being vented from the engine! You notice heat haze at the back of your car's exhausts! It ripples the air around it, and gives the impression of heat blasting over the back bumper of your super car. (I'll try to get a screenshot of this soon). It's simply awesome - Should. Have. Sent. A. Poet.
Anyways, check back next week for more updates! |
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11-06-2005 08:57
Nintendo and want to play their games.
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