30-06-2005 10:46									#181
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Aggie, Perhaps you can back Horsie up on his claim that the Wehrmacht was not disbanded? Maybe a link to the IJA surviving 1945? No?

In the post-war occupation of Vietnam, the Brits actually rearmed IJA ex-POWs and used them as security forces against the Vietnamese, as the Viet Minh were starting to get uppity about the concept of Vietnam being returned to France as a colony to sop the French ego and keep them being our *****es in Europe with respect to immediate postwar disputes with the USSR.

	30-06-2005 10:54									#182
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat I was a proponent of higher troop levels from the outset, if you remember

I remember. You were screaming at the incompetency.

quote: Bingo on the latter, and **** the need for a small footprint. In the aftermath of 9/11, nobody was going to **** with us, and we should have dumpted the entire XVIII Airborne Corps in from Parachinar to the Khyber Pass and dared anybody (i.e. Musharraf) to stop us.

This has been the tragic mistake. Bin Laden is in Pakistan and everybody damn well knows it. The border region with Afghanistan is remote from the population anyway and is the best place for a large foreign unit to operate in without disturbing the locals. So the plan as it was carried out would have worked well, with that blocking force you are talking about put against the border to suck in the runaways.

Assuming that he hadn't have run away in the month it took us to deploy.

How fast does it take to get one of those Airbourne or Force Recon units on the move ?

	30-06-2005 11:06									#183
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat In the post-war occupation of Vietnam, the Brits actually rearmed IJA ex-POWs and used them as security forces against the Vietnamese, as the Viet Minh were starting to get uppity about the concept of Vietnam being returned to France as a colony to sop the French ego and keep them being our *****es in Europe with respect to immediate postwar disputes with the USSR.

But the IJA was still dissolved in September 1945, was it not?

Were these soldiers in Vietnam receiving secret messages from Tojo from his jail cell?

	30-06-2005 11:07									#184
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I have been having all sorts of information finding information online about postwar occupation statistics. I guess I'll have to actually go and do it the old fashioned way.

For example, there HAS to be a troop deployment level statistic for allied occupation forces deployed in Japan and Germany, but I can't find it anywhere.

	30-06-2005 11:17									#185
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I'll save you the trouble.

The IJA was disbanded in September 1945.

The Werhmacht was disbanded in 1945-46.

West Germany was allowed to establish the Bundeswehr in 1955.

The Japanese formed the JDF some years after the IJA was dissolved as well

	30-06-2005 11:22									#186
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Oh sorry, I was referring to the allied armies that were occupying the area.

But that's good info to know.

	30-06-2005 12:01									#187
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Aggie?

I'm waiting.

	30-06-2005 12:22									#188
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither But the IJA was still dissolved in September 1945, was it not?

nah - it was just rebadged after a bit of purging - the IJA became the JDF - same with the Wehrmacht - the staff officers and NCO's continued - those who wanted to - either into the West or East German army - the German regiments today trace back to WWII formations and before - even down to the colours, regional links and regimental songs.

Imagine having Stalingrad in your regimental battle roll - probably also true for the Austrian regiments.

	30-06-2005 12:24									#189
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Uhmm, yeah. Perhaps then you can explain the 10 year absense of any armed forces whatsoever in Germany.

	30-06-2005 12:25									#190
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and that the JDF did not form until after American occupation officially ended.

	30-06-2005 12:40									#191
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quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker How fast does it take to get one of those Airbourne or Force Recon units on the move ?

In theory, the ready brigade for the month is deployable anywhere in 24 hours, and one division can be half-assedly deployed in a week, but that's BS because we don't maintain the airdrop capability.

In the case of blockading southern and southeastern Afghanistan, there aren't airfields worth a **** to do forced entry, so we'd have had to go set one up the old fashioned way in the valley areas around Ghazny to Khowst. Given weather and FOB setup times, probably 45 days to mobilize all the light forces for XVIII Airborne Corps - that's 82ABD, 101AAD and 10MD plus corps support elements and aviation, assuming an absolute balls out effort.

That would still be faster than Omar/bin Laden would have been prepared to react and move - we'd have been inserting forces around the clock and commencing recon and interdiction activities almost immediately after arrival.

	30-06-2005 12:43									#192
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither But the IJA was still dissolved in September 1945, was it not? Were these soldiers in Vietnam receiving secret messages from Tojo from his jail cell?

Isn't that a bit semantic? The relevant point to Iraq is that the soldiers of the defeated power were immediately re-employed and re-armed, albeit under a different ultimate command authority.

It certainly helped tilt the Viet Minh against the US and the west, and gave them a propaganda coup.

	30-06-2005 12:49									#193
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I don't think so.

In both the cases of Germany and Japan, America and the allies (from East and West) put more than enough boots on the ground to crush any slim hope of avoiding the aftermath of defeat.

The difference in Iraq is your chickenshit administration who thought they would 'go light'.

Disbanding the army of a dictatorship, that has its hands running red with the blood of its own citizens, and others, is never a bad policy...

So long as you know WTF you are doing when you go in.

	30-06-2005 12:56									#194
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The European press would be very freindly ATM as they run stories of an ex Republican Guards unit (now renamed whatever the hell you want, it wouldn't buy you ten seconds of good publicity) rolling into and over a Kurdish town, or a hotel district in Baghdad.

	30-06-2005 13:14									#195
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Uhmm, yeah. Perhaps then you can explain the 10 year absense of any armed forces whatsoever in Germany.

I think you'll find the staff officers and NCO's were attached to allied formations during that period - and other formations like the federal border force.

Officially the Bundeswehr says it has no links with the Wehrmacht but if you look at its history have a guess who was recruited to raise the force

http://www.germanculture.com.ua/lib..._bundeswehr.htm

If you look up the East German army you'll find it was formed from WWII POW's who went over to the Russians. Its officer cadre was active assisting in psy ops and intelligence well before WWII ended.

	30-06-2005 13:20									#196
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I think, if you look, you've just conceded what you said earlier is bullshit, and that you are clinging by your fingernails.

	30-06-2005 15:13									#197
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really? here's the bios of the first 3 CinC of the Bundeswehr - no links with the Wehrmacht whatsoever

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/GERheusinger.htm

http://www.generals.dk/general/Foer...ch/Germany.html

http://www.specialcamp11.fsnet.co.u...z%20Trettner%20(Luftwaffe).htm