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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
I see. Then I suppose much of what is said about the defeat of the British when the US gained independence is 'nationalistic, a-historical garbage'. |
And by the way, yes. Most of it is. This is changing though with more analytical authors like Howard Zinn increasingly being used to supplement high school US history text books - as was the case with me.
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cinch
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Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Jul 2002
time: 22:19
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As a product of the FAR-from-perfect (so incredibly far...) Alberta school system, I have to say that our social studies classes never failed to focus on issues like residential schools and interning the Japanese. So I think it's a stretch to say that nobody is informed of these atrocities.
And this was in Alberta, for god's sake!
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by notyoueither
I thought this thread was aimed at idiot Canadians who thought our **** didn't stink, but oops, the idiot Canadian turned out to be a Yank. |
This bit doesn't really make any sense. And what exactly does my country of birth have to do with anything? Please, do tell.
quote:
Have a good, long, look, Jimmy. Bring us back the examples of Canadians thinking that there are no dark deeds in our past. |
Ok, clearly you trailed somewhere along the line in reading this thread and lost track of whats going on. I'll sum up by asking you a few questions:
A. Do you believe that Canada has dark periods in its past?
B. Do you believe that not all is being done (or that more can be done) to raise awareness of these periods?
C. Do you believe that any wrong actions of Canada in the past have ever been removed (intentionally or not) from public attention in order to foster a benign view of Canada?
If you answered yes to these questions then we have no argument and its apparent that you clearly haven't been reading my posts. On the other hand if you answered no, then why don't you go stick your head back in the sand.
quote:
Honestly, Jimmy, where's your sense of pride? You launched a tirade on Canada and Canadians based on a false assumption of the nationality of a random moron who has discovered the internet and managed to get published. |
His nationality is irrelevent. What is relevent is that the views and opinions in his article are all too typical and serve to paint an illegitimate and undeservingly saintly portait of this country. If you disagree on this point, thats fine... but I don't know what else to say to you.
quote:
Your further denunciations after being shown that you were point blank wrong are just digging you deeper. |
You don't even fully understand my argument, how could you possibly prove me "point blank wrong"? In fact you haven't even attempted to offer one shred of evidence to the contrary.
Get over yourself, you're making an argument where there is none.
Last edited by JimmyCracksCorn on 05-07-2005 at 11:01
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by notyoueither
quote:
I'm arguing that Canada's record is no worse than other like-countries, but certainly no better either. |
And this is the part of your spiel where I gag.
You want to use some kind of relativistic mumbo-jumbo to get your own stared and stripped ass off the hook. For what, Jimmy?
You alone are not responsible for the massacres of the plains Indians. You alone are not responsible for the use of nuclear weapons. You alone are not responsible for Mai Lai. You alone are not responsible for Iraq, etc., etc., etc.
But you are responsible for attempting to paint others as being guilty as sin to match the pitch black nature of the American soul (in your eyes). If you like the gutter so much, live in it, but don't try to drag everyone else down to your level of hell.
You are the anti-Chuckman. Both of you are distorting reality to suit your own ideological ends, but you approach it in different ways. He calls down the US in comparison to his new found ****-don't-stink land, while you call down your new home to make it stink as much as the swamp you think you left behind. Same ****. Different reaction. |
You've failed. Re-read the thread.
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by cinch
As a product of the FAR-from-perfect (so incredibly far...) Alberta school system, I have to say that our social studies classes never failed to focus on issues like residential schools and interning the Japanese. So I think it's a stretch to say that nobody is informed of these atrocities.
And this was in Alberta, for god's sake! |
Thats a good thing. I'm not claiming that nothing has been done to raise awareness, I'm just arguing that not all has been done and that in fact more can be done.
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notyoueither
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of naught
Aug 2001
time: 22:19
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quote:
Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn
This bit doesn't really make any sense. And what exactly does my country of birth have to do with anything? Please, do tell. |
Deep in de Nile. There's dangerous crocs there, you know.
quote:
Ok, clearly you trailed somewhere along the line in reading this thread and lost track of whats going on. I'll sum up by asking you a few questions:
A. Do you believe that Canada has dark periods in its past?
B. Do you believe that not all is being done (or that more can be done) to raise awareness of these periods?
C. Do you believe that any wrong actions of Canada in the past have been removed (intentionally or not) from public attention in order to foster a benign view of Canada?
If you answered yes to these questions then we have no argument and its apparent that you clearly haven't been reading my posts. On the other hand if you answered no, then why don't you go stick your head back in the sand. |
Your muliple choice exam lacks an option.
D. Jimmy has burst a blood vessel due to harsh and unfair criticism of the US as compared to Canada... which turns out to have been written by an American.
I'll choose D for $100, Alex.
quote:
His nationality is irrelevent. What is relevent is that the views and opinions in his article are all too typical and serve to paint an illegitimate and undeservingly saintly portait of this country. If you disagree on this point, thats fine... but I don't know what else to say to you. |
No, his nationality is not irrelevant. I knew within the first 5 lines of your OP that the writer was not a Canuck, that is why I spent some time to find proof to back that up. You, however, fell for it.
The fact is they are NOT typical of Canadian views. That may be because they are NOT the views of a Canuck.
quote:
You don't even fully understand my argument, how could you possibly prove me "point blank wrong"? In fact you haven't even attempted to offer one shred of evidence to the contrary.
Get over yourself, you're making an argument where there is none. |
You have no argument! Beyond the 'well, shucks yeah, maybe I was wrong in the OP, but you guys are still the sons of Satan (just to cover my butt).
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by notyoueither
Deep in de Nile. There's dangerous crocs there, you know.
Your muliple choice exam lacks an option. |
You answer yes or no, but nice attempt to evade the questions.
quote:
D. Jimmy has burst a blood vessel due to harsh and unfair criticism of the US as compared to Canada... which turns out to have been written by an American.
I'll choose D for $100, Alex. |
Thats a funny one.
quote:
No, his nationality is not irrelevant. I knew within the first 5 lines of your OP that the writer was not a Canuck, that is why I spent some time to find proof to back that up. You, however, fell for it. |
Ok, why does his nationality matter again?
quote:
The fact is they are NOT typical of Canadian views. That may be because they are NOT the views of a Canuck. |
Oh, so Canadians never compare themselves favorably to the US? Chuckman's article doesn't sound familiar at all? What rock have you been living under?
quote:
You have no argument! Beyond the 'well, shucks yeah, maybe I was wrong in the OP, but you guys are still the sons of Satan (just to cover my butt). |
Every point in the OP I made I still stand by... the fact that you think my argument regarded the nationality of the author doesn't say much for your comprehension skills.
Again, re-read the thread. As it stands you're putting words into my mouth and in the process sticking your own foot down yours.
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
You are the anti-Chuckman. Both of you are distorting reality to suit your own ideological ends, but you approach it in different ways. He calls down the US in comparison to his new found ****-don't-stink land, while you call down your new home to make it stink as much as the swamp you think you left behind. Same ****. Different reaction. |
You're cute. I missed this bit.
Stick a fork in yourself, NYE. I think you're done.
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Not as interesting as your responses have been, little one... |
Such as...? Everything I've said has been a simple reiteration of what I said in the OP.
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by KrazyHorse
As has been so aptly demonstrated in this thread, on that you are clueless. |
Like what? I made my position known, and you have every right to disagree with me.
But since I started this thread, the burden of proof is on you to prove me wrong.
You haven't done this yet.
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by KrazyHorse
Simple, yes. |
Which is why I find it so amazing that neither you or NYE fully understand them.
Disagree with me, fine. But the character bashing has you and NYE constantly on the defensive.
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notyoueither
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of naught
Aug 2001
time: 22:19
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quote:
Originally posted by JimmyCracksCorn
You answer yes or no, but nice attempt to evade the questions. |
I don't march 'cause you say so massah!
quote:
Ok, why does his nationality matter again? |
It matters because your whole rant rests on Canadians feel this way and how dare they?
When it is pointed out that it wasn't a Canadian, and we don't feel the way you think we do, you don't say 'damn' and call it a day, you launch further into your invective.
Well guess what? You've been wrong since post one, and I await any attempt you may bring to prove that Canadians are ignorant of or don't care about what happened to the Japanese, Chinese, Indians (from both continents) or just about any other cause you could bring. Fer Christs sake, we even feel guilty about the penguins! But not the seals. Thems deserves whats they getsess.
quote:
Oh, so Canadians never compare themselves favorably to the US? |
Of course we do. Don't be silly! Just like the French and English, the Dutch and belgians, the Germans and... everyone.
The point is not to get trolled. You've been trolled, my freind. Big time.
quote:
Chuckman's article doesn't sound familiar at all? What rock have you been living under? |
Yes it did sound familiar. It struck an immediate chord of Yank biting Yank. How do you think I knew to go looking for the fact that Chuckman is from the South Side of Chicago?
quote:
Every point in the OP I made I still stand by... the fact that you think my argument regarded the nationality of the author doesn't say much for your comprehension skills.
Again, re-read the thread. As it stands you're putting words into my mouth and in the process sticking your own foot down yours. |
I'll let other people be the judge of that. I haven't even begun to take apart your OP. I have been hoping you would be man enough to say 'oops', but apparently not.
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KrazyHorse
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Macedonia
May 2001
time: 00:19
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Let's summarise this thread, from the time Jimmy leaves the US to the present moment:
Jimmy immigrates to Canada. This leaves him feeling slightly traitorous, although he can at least pacify himself with the knowledge that Canada is barely a sovereign nation, and envies the US greatly.
Jimmy spends the next 5 years finding out that Canadians do not envy the US, and have a slightly different version of the war of 1812.
GW wins the 2001 elections. Canadians are, understandably, tickled pink that Americans would do something that stupid to themselves. Jimmy grows annoyed at what he views as Canada's smug sense of superiority, further fueling his inferiority complex.
GW continues his muddleheaded presidency. Canada pretends not to be home when he calls concerning possible Canadian involvement in Iraq. He's confused by Chrétien's bilingual doublespeak on the answering machine, and leaves a poorly worded message about liking maple syrup. Jimmy is hotly embarrassed when Lloyd Roberts plays the tape on the air the next day. He starts his Tim Horton voodoo doll. Tim, having been dead for 30 years, is none the worse for wear. Jimmy is infuriated at his own impotence.
GW is reelected. Canadians feel that the joke is wearing a bit thin, and start to feel sorry for their benighted southern neighbours. Jimmy is driven into a frenzy. In his heart he agrees with them, but pride ties a knot in his stomach.
Jimmy wakes up in the morning and decides to peruse CounterPunch as a reliable source of news and views (?)
Jimmy reads an article by an expat (?) American excoriating the US and sucking Canada's dick. Jimmy decides that this is indicative of the average Canadian's ignorance of historical fact and tendency toward jingoism.
Jimmy posts thread lambasting Canadians for being ignorant, chauvinist nationalists.
It is quickly pointed out to him that the author of the article is American, and that the average Canadian is, in fact, well aware of his country's faults.
Jimmy spins off into madness brought on by once more having been pwn3d by a mere Canuck.
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JimmyCracksCorn
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Macedonia - Sovereign country north of Greece.
Dec 2002
time: 05:19
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quote:
Well guess what? You've been wrong since post one, and I await any attempt you may bring to prove that Canadians are ignorant of or don't care about what happened to the Japanese, Chinese, Indians (from both continents) or just about any other cause you could bring. Fer Christs sake, we even feel guilty about the penguins! But not the seals. Thems deserves whats they getsess. |
Again, putting words into my mouth. I never said Canadians didn't care, I said they're still far too complacent as regards their history, especially the not so flattering parts - just like every other country!
quote:
I'll let other people be the judge of that. I haven't even begun to take apart your OP. I have been hoping you would be man enough to say 'oops', but apparently not. |
Maybe that would have been a good place for you to have started. Please, tear apart my OP. Thats what these threads are for. Intelligent debate, not you making assumptions about my character or bashing my nationality.
So lets make up and start over. My argument is:
-Everything from the OP
and
-That I don't believe (as in, my opinion) that enough is being done to educate people about wrongful state actions of the past - in Canada and everywhere else.
You say: That enough is being done in these regards? No further action is necessary?
- I also say that the views in Chuckman's article are typical of Canadian pop-mythology.
You say: It isn't.
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05-07-2005 10:12
. Because at the end of the war, it was still British territory, so not really a traditional War of Independence, where the victor gets to go on free from burden from the mother country.
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