16-07-2005 15:43									#91
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this thread is crazy!

	16-07-2005 16:05									#92
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Mr Reagan says we will protect you, I don't subscribe to this point of view.

Believe me when I say to you: Don't ya think the Chicoms love their children, too

	16-07-2005 16:55									#93
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china..biggest importer of oil and steel right...what do you need to wage war? oil and steel, boscott if needed problem solved...oil price goes down the US happy again...and the EU is always happy...

	16-07-2005 17:50									#94
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That or an all out coordinated attack on all of their nuclear bases.

I mean it is time now to make a choice, to choose between two admittedly regrettable but nevertheless distinguishable post war environments: one where you got 1 billion people killed and one where you got 1.3 billion people killed!

	16-07-2005 18:26									#95
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quote: Originally posted by Ecthelion War crimes charges? There can be no such charges against you when you're a WINNER.

So young, so angry. Damn that rap music!

	16-07-2005 18:39									#96
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Angry? I think I'm rather rational compared to these whiners.

Also, I don't do rap music.

	16-07-2005 19:45									#97
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hmmm........you do realise that a mass nuclear strike by america would stuff up the world, wether or not china/russia/evil empire managed to get of a retaliation. Its not a clinical computer game simualtion? Fallout - winds - atmospheric pollution - longterm radioactive contamination of many systems we need to survive on(food/water etc)

	16-07-2005 19:46									#98
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From a certain point of view it is.

	16-07-2005 19:52									#99
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quote: Originally posted by Ecthelion From a certain point of view it is.

if your the "swamp thing"(toxic avenger?) i guess so.

	16-07-2005 20:05									#100
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quote: Originally posted by Ecthelion Angry? I think I'm rather rational compared to these whiners. Also, I don't do rap music.

It's a referrence to something the lizard said in Eddie Murphy's Dr. Doolittle. You're angry because the allies wrote the history of the first half of the 20th century.

	16-07-2005 20:21									#101
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove edit.... You're angry because the allies wrote the history of the first half of the 20th century.

indeed - and we're living with exactly the consequences we've sown.

	16-07-2005 23:49									#102
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quote: Originally posted by Tingkai Follow through with your thinking. What happens to the US economy if the US government cuts its spending by 33-50%? The sudden decrease in spending creates recessionary effects. It's basic economics.

It suffers a little pain now as compared with a great deal of pain later. The giant trade deficit liquidity trap being eliminated would offset to some degree the loss of government spending however.

	16-07-2005 23:50									#103
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon Soon those evil Chinese will be invading our countries and starting opium dens in which good white protestant women will become prosituted to their filthy yellow desires.... the Terror of the Tongs!! Help!!! This frankly racist Sinophobia on Apolyton is becoming ridiculous....

Or they could turn around and do the whole open door policy thing with us.

	17-07-2005 06:18									#104
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quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker Let's give it back to the Portuguese, problem solved.

You mean the Dutch. The first European country to find Taiwan.

	17-07-2005 06:20									#105
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quote: Originally posted by Ecthelion Mr Reagan says we will protect you, I don't subscribe to this point of view. Believe me when I say to you: Don't ya think the Chicoms love their children, too

Only the parents of those Children, and not the Government.

	17-07-2005 07:20									#106
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quote: Originally posted by GePap What is sad is that any of you think the US can actually strategically threaten China in this situation. Its does show an utter and complete lack of reason or cognitive capabilities.

Really? Let me ask you another question, can China strategically threaten the United States? Perhaps you will argue that the US needs the Chinese trade, but I think most of us here are well aware that the Chinese are more dependent on us than we Americans of them...

Bottom line, the United States has the upper hand, clearly, both militarily, economically, and diplomatically...

You think that it would be hard to convince Americans that "China is teh evil"? Do you recall the American attitudes towards the soviet communists? Never mind that China is opening its markets, never mind that Communism is slowly peeling away...

All you have to do is tell Americans that China has seriously threatend them...not some crackpot general's remarks, but real, public threats...and Americans will seek the blood of yet another "communist" regime, even if it isn't really communist...

And a further note, I don't believe any one here said the US could get away with attacking china first...it would seem this thread is more about China attacking first or threatening first, hence the name of the thread...

	17-07-2005 07:46									#107
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Posted this a while ago in some other most likely similar thread, enjoy.
Chinese Map of World

Attachment: world_of_china.gif
This has been downloaded 59 time(s).

	17-07-2005 08:51									#108
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quote: Originally posted by Tingkai Is that risk worth declaring Taiwan official independent, as oppose to its de factor independence?

Dunno, ask the leadership of the PRC why they are pushing the military bluff over the issue.

	17-07-2005 08:52									#109
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer It all starts with independance for Tiawan, the rest of China will join Tiawan in time, not the other way around. Play China's bluff.

No more Munichs!

	17-07-2005 08:55									#110
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quote: Originally posted by Joseph You mean the Dutch. The first European country to find Taiwan.

Oops sorry. Portugese first "discovered" Taiwan but Dutch occupied it.

I think I was thinking of Macau.

	17-07-2005 09:05									#111
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I wonder what people would think if some American general, just about at retirement, was speaking at some function where the press were present and mentioned that given the probability of Chinese reactions to American efforts to defend Taiwan, the US might have to regard any attack on Taiwan as an attack on the United States and that a nuclear first strike would be an option should the United States be attacked.

I wonder if GePap would react calmly to that.

	17-07-2005 11:45									#112
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quote: Originally posted by Whoha It suffers a little pain now as compared with a great deal of pain later. The giant trade deficit liquidity trap being eliminated would offset to some degree the loss of government spending however.

A little pain?

Try major economic crisis. The US economy is so fragile it's already on the brink. It's not a question of if there will be a crisis, but when.

Besides which, American consumers are not about to give up buying crappy plastic gadgets they don't need.

And corporate America won't be willing to give up on a major source of profits.

Washington can't afford to alienate its major lender.

The U.S. can do nothing about China in terms of trade because China has the U.S. by the balls.

	17-07-2005 12:04									#113
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The US needs to become self-sufficient.

Seriously though, why does the US hold such value with Taiwan? Yeah, it's a democratic nation. I've stated in an earlier thread on my views so I won't pollute this thread with them.

I mean, seriously, why? Why does the US hold such value in Taiwan? Bases, don't we have enough in Japan?

	17-07-2005 12:27									#114
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Democracy isn't enough?

What do you value more?

	17-07-2005 12:28									#115
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan The US needs to become self-sufficient. Seriously though, why does the US hold such value with Taiwan? Yeah, it's a democratic nation. I've stated in an earlier thread on my views so I won't pollute this thread with them. I mean, seriously, why? Why does the US hold such value in Taiwan? Bases, don't we have enough in Japan?

By making a stand with Tawain, it increases the average **** size for Americans who have small ****s.

	17-07-2005 12:31									#116
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan The US needs to become self-sufficient. Seriously though, why does the US hold such value with Taiwan? Yeah, it's a democratic nation. I've stated in an earlier thread on my views so I won't pollute this thread with them. I mean, seriously, why? Why does the US hold such value in Taiwan? Bases, don't we have enough in Japan?

Historical reasons. Political silliness. Strategic opportunism.

	17-07-2005 12:43									#117
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Democracy isn't enough? What do you value more?

So you're telling me if some African democratic nation was invaded by a Communist regime or whatever that the US would step in? I dunno about that...



So...if the shiznit hit the fan in Asia, we'd risk potential war (maybe even going nuclear) because it's "strategic"? WTF? I don't think so. With the war in Afghanistan, Iraq, and terrorists in general...the US is going to risk another conflict in China? Isn't that spreading our forces too thin?

	17-07-2005 13:07									#118
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quote: Washington can't afford to alienate its major lender.

Japan? How is America alienating them?

	17-07-2005 14:24									#119
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China's foreign reserves, including Hong Kong (now about $833 billion) will overtake Japan's reserves (about $845 billion) within this quarter. Meanwhile, the US gets deeper and deeper in debt.

	17-07-2005 15:19									#120
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So China isn't America's major lender then. Thought so...

edit: It's not even close.

Last edited by Drake Tungsten on 17-07-2005 at 15:25