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WesW
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Florence, Al., USA
Jan 1970
time: 23:14
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Engineer, you can modify the Medpack to your own setup fairly easily, unless I am mistaken. Simply take the MM2_gamefile.txt, and replace the names for individual files with names from your mod and save it as ENG_gamefile for example. Then you take the MM2_units.txt and make changes to it, and save it as ENG_units.txt, then specify that file in your gamefile text instead of MM2_units.txt. You may have to keep up with this thread, since I am still correcting bugs in the units text, but I hope you get the picture.
Dale, the pics look great. This will definitely improve the game.
Gnoll, you are right about the Cruise Missile. Find the unit in units.txt, and change the four CanAttack lines to CanBombard.
Martin, fill me in sometime on you work with goods. I have not delved into this at all for Ctp2. Tim, have you experimented any?
Btw, I went through the citymod readmes and updated the Medpack readmes.
Rhuarc, Crusade will be the next major public release of the Medpack II.
Jani, it sounds like your files are corrupted. Get the latest text update and see if things don't clear up.
Jules, send Wouter (Locutus) your work, and I will let you two get the SLIC worked out. If text changes need to be made, send everything to me and I will get it posted.
I would still like for someone to verify this without using the cheat mode, since it would seem to make existing triggers more complicated, which I do not like.
If and when it is verified, however, fixing it needs to be our top priority right now.
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Locutus
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ACS CTP1/2 Manager & Civ4 Co-Manager
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Hengelo, The Netherlands
Nov 1999
time: 06:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Wes
It is hard to give appropriate style to civs like the Mongols and Zulus who are known for their conquests rather than their buildings. |
Giving appropriate city styles is hard for all civs if you ask me. The Dutch had a very specific architecture that doesn't really resemble any of the existing styles. Polynesians, Zulus and Bantus lived in huts rather than in houses, Indonesian architecture didn't resemble the currently used Chinese style at all, what to do with modern civs like the Americans, Australians or Canadians, etc, etc. The only way to be historically accurate would be to give every civ it's own city style but that would require a massive amount of graphics. If you ask me, the best you can do is distribute the various styles roughly evenly over all civs (following historic whenever possible) so you don't have to look at the same two or three styles 80-90% of the time. In my setup I gave the Pyramids to all nations you mentioned plus the Zulu. I also made a couple of other changes to my own setup so that almost all styles are used by 6 civs. Since I usually play with 6 or 7 civs per game I usually encounter 5 or 6 (of 7) different citystyles in every game.
quote:
Originally posted by janilxx
Some early South American nations had same kind of pyramids too(for example Incas) so if there is incas or other South American nation in the game(I do not remember) they could have pyramids too. |
Yes, but those are already represented in the game by the Mayan/Aztec style: those are Pyramids too. Only American Pyramids looked quite different compared to their Egyptian counterparts.
Hmm, good thing I brought the city expansion thing up then. I'll start working on the pirate code and renewed elite code as soon as I can. I'll also have a look at that wonderbuilding code, see if I can reproduce Jules' bug-report myself. However, I'll be out of town most of the weekend and after that my summer job starts, so I have no idea how long it will take me to do all that.
quote:
(Where would this mod be without the Dutch? Go figure.) |
 Thanks, Wes  (Don't worry, you didn't hurt my feelings or anything; personally I just find it funny how people always mistake us for some other nationality  )
About the pirates code: I'm just gonna write a very generic version for the pirate code and let Wes decide (in advance and/or after playtesting) on when/how often/how strong/etc they should be.
I agree with Immortal Wombat that random events, in particular natural disasters, would be a nice addition. Of course, the details would have to be worked out first (which events, what effects, how often, etc) before coding should begin.
Jules, you're right about the KillWonder event: it doesn't exist. I swore it did but I must have been confused with DestroyBuilding and/or RemoveAdvance or something. Unfortunately there's no equivilant for Wonders, only a WonderDestroyed event but IIRC that could only be listened for and didn't actually destroy the wonder itself. I guess we'll have to go with your solution after all. On the food bonuses: exactly what I was thinking. The only problem could be the 64-buildings limit.
Those diplo-pics are looking great, Dale! 
Last edited by Locutus on 06-07-2001 at 20:28
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StarGazer
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San Francisco
Jun 2001
time: 21:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Martin Gühmann
StarGazer a Freight Transport is worth three Caravans. If you build one Freight Transport you will get three Caravans for the trade screen. So for your problem you have to build five more Caravans or two Freight Transport. I think your problem is a problem of names. Replace the term Caravan by trade units in the trade screen. (Of course in your mind.)
-Martin |
No, Martin, I don't get three Caravans for one Freight Transport in the trade screen. That's the problem. I get only one Caravan for each Freight Transport. Although I now have three Freight Transports built, the Trade Manager says that I still need to build FIVE more Caravans in order to establish a trade route that requires eight Caravans.
Wes, can you solve this? Thanks!
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Jules
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Chairman & CEO, Dallas Oil Company
Jul 2001
time: 00:14
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Locutus,
Do you know how to make the CreateWonder trigger work? My original idea to fix the bug was to create "anti" wonders. Plus, with Wes's idea of bonus food from advances, that'd leave us with a few improvements to work with before reaching the 64-building limit. I've been using CreateWonder with CityBeginTurn, so for example:
HandleEvent(CityBeginTurn) 'MakeWonderTest' post {
if (CityHasWonder(city[0], WonderDB(WONDER_STONEHENGE))) {
if (HasAdvance(city[0].owner, ID_ADVANCE_RAILROAD)) {
Event:CreateWonder(city[0], WonderDB(WONDER_PENICILLIN));
DisableTrigger('MakeWonderTest');
}
}
}
If it worked, this would create the Penicillin wonder in a city that possessed Stonehenge after that civ discovered Railroad; then the trigger would be disabled. Problem is, CTP2 crashes to desktop when the prerequisite conditions for creating Penicillin are satisfied. Perhaps wonders can't be created during the CityBeginTurn phase; maybe at a different point in the turn. Any ideas?
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Locutus
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ACS CTP1/2 Manager & Civ4 Co-Manager
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Hengelo, The Netherlands
Nov 1999
time: 06:14
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You may want to look at some of the code I made for the MedMod or other stuff, I used this sort of this dozens of times. Yes, player[0] is where the player is stored. The second int is probably the year, but I never needed that so I didn't bother to test it, first city is indeed 0. It should be roughly like this (usual disclaimer: untested, blah, blah)
code:
EventHandler(BeginTurn) 'WonderTest' post {
city_t tmpCity;
int_t i;
for (i = 0; i < player[0].cities; i = i + 1) {
GetCityByIndex(player[0], i, tmpCity);
if (CityHasWonder(tmpCity, WonderDB(WONDER_STONEHENGE))) {
if (HasAdvance(tmpCity.owner, ID_ADVANCE_RAILROAD)) {
Event:CreateWonder(tmpCity, WonderDB(WONDER_PENICILLIN));
DisableTrigger('MakeWonderTest');
}
}
}
}
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Peter Triggs
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Gone Fishin, Canada
Jan 2000
time: 05:14
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I've used CityBeginTurn before without encountering any problems. So I just plugged an insignificantly changed version of Jule's code into a scenario I'm running and it worked fine. What error messages are you getting Jules?
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Peter Triggs
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Gone Fishin, Canada
Jan 2000
time: 05:14
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Not exactly. What I used was:
code:
HandleEvent(CityBeginTurn) 'MakeWonderTest' post {
if (CityHasWonder(city[0], WonderDB(WONDER_ARISTOTLES_LYCEUM))) {
if (HasAdvance(city[0].owner, ID_ADVANCE_FEUDALISM)) {
Event:CreateWonder(city[0], WonderDB(WONDER_PENICILLIN));
DisableTrigger('MakeWonderTest');
}
}
}
because of the time I was at. I went into Cheat mode, gave a city ARISTOTLES_LYCEUM (the owner already had FEUDALISM), and it immediately got the PENICILLIN wonder.
Your error message might have something to do with the way your Mod is set up. I don't think it has anything to do with the SLIC.
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StarGazer
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San Francisco
Jun 2001
time: 21:14
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Wes, I have learned that building Shopping Malls does not increase the income for cities -- at least, in the MM2 game I'm playing there is no change of income indicated in the City and National Manger windows.
For example, one of my cities, Richmond, had an income deficit of minus 15. So I built three shopping malls within the city limits (the white city outline), two in jungle areas, one on plains. Although the malls are completely built and have been so for several turns now, the deficit remains at minus 15.
Another example, Detroit, my chief maufacturing city, has an income deficit of minus 70. One space was left -- hills -- so I built a shopping mall there. Despite the existence of the mall, the deficit remains at minus 70.
And I could cite further examples.
Is this a bug?
Since the focus of my game is economic/diplomatic, I'm somewhat disturbed by these seeming bugs as regards trade (see my earlier post about the Freight Transport producing only one trade point instead of three) and now the shopping mall. I hope they can be fixed.
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WesW
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Florence, Al., USA
Jan 1970
time: 23:14
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Frogger, what I need is for you to load up the game where you had the Lyceum, and write down your research production the turn before the wonder expired, and compare that with the number after the wonder expired. The Lyceum goes out with Public Education, when the Public School becomes available.
If anyone else can do this for any of the wonders, it would all be helpful.
It would not surprise me if Jules is right. Actually I would be surprised if he was wrong given the way he checked to see what was happening, but verification is always welcome. This bug may be why the designers made most wonders not go obsolete, unlike Ctp1.
Peter wrote me a few days ago about his new unit updater. It automatically upgrades the AI's units ala Leonardo's workshop in Civ2. The human has to pay gold to update his units.
I am hesitant to include this in the mod right now for a few reasons. The biggest is that I hope it is not needed, now that the AIs are more agressive. I know that they seem to do a good job of upgrading their units up until the Renaissance age.
From your experiences in the last month or so with the Medpack, do the AIs keep upgrading, or not? If not, then I would consider having the trigger kick in sometime during the Renaissance age or later.
Another reason I am hesitant right now is that there are still bugs in the trigger dealing with technology exchange and goody huts. I don't think the huts would be a factor if the trigger kicks in mid-way through the game, but the tech exchanges could put unlucky AIs at a disadvantage.
A third reason is that not having to build new units leaves a lot of production that there may not be a use for. There is also the issue of AIs with large standing armies becoming overburdened with support costs if all their units are suddenly upgraded into more costly to maintain units. Since these units are not obsolete, the AIs would not disband them, either.
Game balance is the hardest part of the game to get right, and it is the key to a good game. This trigger would have a pretty big impact on game balance, and it may be a headache to incorporate it into the game correctly. I am just hesitant to get into it unless it is really necessary.
Btw, has anyone else noticed a problem with the Freight unit that Stargazer described?
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Jules
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Chairman & CEO, Dallas Oil Company
Jul 2001
time: 00:14
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quote:
Originally posted by WesW
There are a couple of advances that I would like to have the effect of increasing a city's food income, and another that I would like to have decrease its income. Did you find that it was possible to do this without creating new buildings? I got a little lost in all the posts here. |
Wes,
Which ones did you have in mind for reducing food income? I'm assuming that means you'd like to simulate the slowdown in population growth that has occurred in the Western world since the introduction of the "pill".
About the "anti" wonders, now I'm not sure how well this will work. There are wonder flags to deal with the benefits of six of the seven affected wonders (Lyceum--science, Chichen and Drug Rehab--crime, Stonehenge--food, Karnak and Ramayana--happiness). For Great Wall, however, there are no wonder flags I know of to counter city walls (i.e., city defense bonus and protection from slavers). The only way to counter Great Wall is with my anti-City Walls improvement.
There is also a problem for Stonehenge, Karnak, and Ramayana when you rebuild Granary, Shrine and Theater, respectively. Although these wonders can be countered with an appropriate anti-wonder, when you rebuild the improvement it will have no effect. This is the "building-in-the-same-city-twice" problem I discussed in my July 3rd post. In brief, Stonehenge gives the city a free Granary. But when you discover Railroad the Granary is still there, although you can rebuild it. You rebuild it, but the game ignores its effects since there already is a Granary present from Stonehenge. Hence you can't have the same building in a city twice.
Anti-wonders will work for Lyceum, Chichen and Drug Rehab, though, since Academy, Courthouse, and Prison expire at the same time their wonder expires. So we can use anti-wonders for these three, but only anti-buildings will work for the other four. I don't know if you want the solution mixed up this way.
FOOD ADVANCES
The only way I know of to do this is write a SLIC program giving a free food improvement to every city once the civ discovers a certain advance. Locutus seems to agree this is the best way.
Another possibility is to create advanced farmer specialists that produce more food than regular farmers.
Or, if you want the population boom to coincide with the Industrial Age, why not just allow the overcrowding improvements Sewer and Hospital to give bonus food? The effect of these innovations was to dramatically reduce death rates, allowing populations to grow much faster than before.
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Jules
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Chairman & CEO, Dallas Oil Company
Jul 2001
time: 00:14
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It suddenly occurred to me that there might be another way to think about solving this problem, one that avoids messy anti-buildings or wonders being created through SLIC.
The bug is only with the BuildingEverywhere wonder flag--doesn't expire. But there are other flags which would basically have the same effect as BuildingEverywhere (e.g., reduce crime, give food, science or happiness) and do expire. Locutus's code already turns off the building in the build list when its wonder is built. It could easily be modified to handle prerequisite building issues.
For example:
Change the Ramayana so that instead of giving a free Theater everywhere it increases empire happiness by +2 (i.e., same effect as a Theater in every city). Locutus's SLIC already prevents you from building Theater while you have Ramayana. Write a program that will destroy any existing Theaters you may have (so you don't get the benefit twice). Finally, modify Locutus's SLIC to include every building requiring a Theater (I think Arena is the only one), so that if the civ has Ramayana and they haven't discovered Electrification yet its cities can build Arenas until that advance is discovered. Otherwise, Arena can't be built unless a Theater is present (then remove the Theater prerequisite from Arena in "buildings.txt").
This fix avoids having to create buildings or wonders that counteract a wonder's effect when it expires, so in that sense it's "cleaner". There is a 64-building limit, and we need some for Wes's "bonus-food-from-advances" idea. Plus other modders might come up with some new city improvement ideas. We wanna leave room in the text files for further modification.
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06-07-2001 07:15
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