14-08-2001 15:47									#1
	Expansion Pack Civs (Part 2) Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

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quote: There has been a lot of debate about which civs should have been included in Civ3 but weren't and should thus be put in an Expansion Pack (if there will ever be one). In my opinion there have been too many threads about this subject already and it's getting tiresome but I decided to start my own anyway. This is because IMHO none of the existing threads is really satisfactory: all these threads are standard vBB polls that only allow 10 options, while there are many more civs to choose from and some civs are more important than others. That's why I suggest a different system, one that allows everyone to vote for those civs which (s)he thinks are the most important. Hopefully this allows everyone to say their thing and be done with it... I suggest we use the following system: you can post up to 16 civs that you feel should be included in an expansion pack (no more since an expansion pack is not likely to contain more and because it would only be more work to keep track of). You can post any civs you feel should be included, whether it's a big civ like Spain or a small one like Liechtenstein You can assign points to each of these civs: the more points you give, the more important you think it is for this civ to be included. You can assign at most 160 points in total and 20 to a single civ (this to prevent people from giving a lot of points to one civ and thus disrupting the 'reliability' of this poll). I'll volunteer to keep track of all posts and keep an overall ranking in this first post. Edit: a couple of new 'rules' to avoid misunderstandings: * If you just post civ names and no points, the points will be distributed equally among all choices. So if you post 16 names without points, all choices will get 10 points. If you post 8 names, all choices will get 20 points. If you don't agree with the points I assigned to your choices, give points yourself in the first place or change your vote afterwards (see below). * Post an exact name: for the purpose of this thread, different names indicate different civs. Of course, it doesn't matter when you vote for Celts, Kelts or Celtic but it does matter when you post for Israeli, Jews or Hebrew. If you vote for Hebrew your points go to the Hebrew, if you vote for Israeli your points go to the Israeli, whether you think these two are the same or not (same with Turks/Ottoman, etc). If you post several names, e.g. Turks/Ottoman or Carthagian/Phoenician, all points go to the name you post first. So in the examples the points would go to Turks and Carthagian. * If you wish to change your vote for any reason, that's possible but please don't edit your existing post or just post a new list. This would be very confusing for me to keep track of. Instead, only post the changes you wish to make. FE, if you already voted but see someone vote for the Cubans and think 'that's brilliant, why didn't I think of that?', you can change your vote by posting 'Arabs -7, Cubans +7' or something like that. Please do this even if you still have enough points left, so I can doublecheck to make sure you don't exceed the maximum number of civs/points. So if you only 'spent' 150 points over 12 civs, don't just posts 'Cubans 10' but rather 'Cubans +10'. TIA for doing so. Some example civs to guide you in picking your civs (by no means exhaustive, feel free to post others): (Africa) Bantu, Zimbabwe, Swahili, Nigeria, Benin, Ghana, Mali, Moors, Morocco, Ethiopia/Axum, Nubia, Carthage, South Africa/Boer (Americas) Eskimo, Canada, Sioux, Cheyenne, Apache, Navajo, Hopi, Olmec, Maya, Inca, Tolmec, Mexico, Brazil, Argentina (Oceania) Maori, Aboriginals, Australia, Polynesia, Philippines, Indonesia (Asia) Khmer, Siam/Thai, Burma/Myanmar, Cambodia, Mongol, Annam/Vietnam, Korea, Tibet, Tamil, Sikh, Moghul, Kazakh, Pakistan, Parthia, Bactria, Armenia, Arabia, Hebrew, Hittites, Sumerian, Turkish/Ottomans, Byzantine, Phoenicia, Fillistines(sp?), Iraq (Europe) Spanish, Dutch, Minoan, Celts, Viking, Polish, Austria(-Hungary), Italy, Sweden, Norway, Finland, Danish, Scots, Irish, Belgium, Portuguese, Basque, Slavic, Serbia, Macedonia, Czech, Swiss, Bulgaria, Ukraine, Goths (for more: see ranking) Here's the overall ranking (last update: Cybershy, # of votes: 51, # of points: 7734): #  Civilizations          Points    Votes 1. Mongols 637 40 2. Spanish 597 38 3. Vikings 573 37 4. Arabs 566 37 5. Inca 499 35 6. Turks/Ottomans 461 35 7. Hebrew/Israelis 344 26 8. Celts 321 24 9. Maya 266 24 10. Ethiopians 253 19 11. Carthaginians 247 18 12. Dutch 218 18 13. Koreans 125 9 14. Phoenicians 180 15 15. Portuguese 165 14 16. Sioux/Dakota 130 12 17. Polynesians 111 10 18. Byzantines 97 9 19. Khmer 94 10 20. Mali 85 9 21. Assyrians 80 7 22. Australians 79 7 23. Huns 66 6 24. Polish 61 8 25. Siamese 55 5 26. Apache 54 5 27. Aborigines 53 4 28. Canadians 50 4 29. Italians 50 3 30. Tibetans 49 5 31. Eskimos 49 4 32. Trojans 41 3 33. Sumerians 40 4 34. Songhai 40 3 35. Serbs 40 2 36. Zimbabwe 39 4 37. Vietnamese 37 3 38. Ghanaians 33 3 39. Magyar/Hungarian 32 4 40. Philistines 30 2 41. Philippines 30 2 42. Mexicans 28 3 43. Olmec 28 3 44. Austro-Hungarians 25 3 45. Hittites 25 3 46. Nigerians 25 3 47. Slavs 25 3 48. Kushites 25 2 49. Inuit 21 3 50. Scandinavians 20 3 51. Scots 20 2 52. Bangladesh 20 1 53. Bedouin 20 1 54. Confederates 20 1 55. Cuba 20 1 56. Indonesia 20 1 57. Iraq 20 1 58. Kilwans 20 1 59. Tartars 20 1 60. Ugandians 20 1 61. Welsh 20 1 62. Neanderthals 18 2 63. Hopi 16 2 64. Nubians 16 2 65. Cherokee 15 2 66. Etruscs 15 2 67. Goths 15 2 68. Hawaiians 15 2 69. Navaho 15 2 70. Yankees 15 2 71. Anasazi 15 1 72. Native Americans 14 2 73. Berbers 13 2 74. Boers 13 2 75. Hmong 13 2 76. Tunguz 13 2 77. Mesopotamians 12 1 78. Argentinians 10 1 79. Armenia 10 1 80. Bantu 10 1 81. Harappan 10 1 82. Indus Valley People 10 1 83. Javans 10 1 84. Maori 10 1 85. Columbians 7 1 86. Kazakhs 5 1

	14-08-2001 15:49									#2
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

previous thread
http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...?threadid=24304

	14-08-2001 18:05									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

edit : never mind....

	14-08-2001 18:42									#4
	Get a bigger avatar today!

i have a correction... i gave 5 points to indus valley people

	14-08-2001 19:50									#5
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Cool thread!

Mongols 20
Arabs 20
Spanish 15
Hebrews 15
Turks 15
Assyrians 15
Byzantines 15
Phoenicians 15
Vikings 10
Minoans 10
Incas 10

	14-08-2001 21:22									#6
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Australia 20
New Zealand 10
Fiji 10
Tonga 5
Papua New Guinea 5

	14-08-2001 22:00									#7
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Going local, eh, Raz?

Arabs 20
Maya 20
Spanish 20
Dutch 15
Assyrians 15
Inca 10
Dakota 10
Khmer 10
Accra 10
Cretan (Minoan) 10
Byzantines 10
Huns -10

	14-08-2001 22:38									#8
	Support Apolyton

Turks 20
Mongols 5
Spanish 10
Vikings 5
Hebrew 5
Eskimos 15
Sioux 15
Italians 10

	14-08-2001 22:48									#9
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Viking -10
Spanish -5
Inca -5
Anasazi -5
Hawaiian +5
Hebrew -10
Arab -5
Ethiopia +7
Boer +7
Berber +7
Hmong +7
Tibetan +7
Suggestions for other people to vote for: Trolls, Elves, Atlanteans, Leprechauns, Fairies, Titans, Olympian Gods, Centaurs, Satyrs, Chechens, Khazars, Turkmen, Kazakhs, Siberians, Taiwanese, Ainu, Manchurians, Nepalese, Mandarins, Cantonese, Mongolians, Vietnamese, Cambodians, Aryans, Tongans, Tahitians, Samoans, Fijians, Tupi, Guarani, Arawak, Miwok, Maidu, Utes, Paiutes, Powhatans, Creek Indians, Misssissipian Indians, Hopewell, Mound Builders, Athapaskans, Cree, Mormons, Shakers, Amish, Afro Americans, Texans, Oregonians, Californians, Quebecois, New Englanders, Mid Atlantic Americans, Acadians (Cajuns), Missourians, Mulattoes, Mestizoes, Gypsies, Finno-Ugrics, Bushmen, Bantu, Khoisan, Malagasy, Apes, Cetaceans, Cro Magnons, Royalists, Communists, Socialists, Fascists, democrats, republicans, Thracians, Normans, Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Castillians, Basque, Catalans, Sevillians, Leonians, Aragonians
I think its neat that people have chosen Confederates, Neanderthals, Trojans, Indus Valley Civ, Bedouins, and Tatars.
The Hmong are a culture from Southeast Asia who I don't think have ever had their own territory.
I'm glad you liked my list. Just what was it you found unusual about it? I like your thread, and its rules, they are brilliant! I'm glad to have gotten in on it near the beginning.
Here are some suggested individual expansion packs: Greece, British Isles, Holy Land, United States Political , Racial, And Religious Factions, Californian Native Americans, and Nigerian Tribes.
Possible Neanderthal city names might include Ooga Booga, Ugh, Grunt, Zugzug, Flaw, Atook, Bambam, Pebbles, Bedrock, Flintstone, Rubble, Stone, and Slate.
The following is just a joke, but maybe my list should have followed my ancestry: Norwegian 20, Swiss 5, English 1, French 1, Irish 1, Scotch 1, Cherokee 1.
Carthage and Phonecia should be separate just like Celts, English, and Americans are.

	14-08-2001 23:29									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Huns 20
Spanish 20
Mongols 20
Vikings 20
Inca 20
Arabs 20
Turks 20
Magyar 20

	15-08-2001 00:52									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Turks 20
Byzantines 20
Ethiopians 20
Phoenicians 20
Trojans 20
Austro-Hungarians 20

	15-08-2001 01:39									#12
	Why is everybody talking about the "Vikings"? Suffering from ads?

Does anybody know what they are talking about?

The Vikings was a designation of a man who went over sea as an explorer, trader or pirate. Their "true nationality" where Danes, Norwegian, Swede or some of the other lokal scandinavian tribes.

Calling that Scandinavian civilisation "the Vikins" is like calling the Americans "The Marines" or the Japanese "the Samurai".

Laros, "Non Viking"

	15-08-2001 01:41									#13
	Got spare money?

BTW, MarkG, considering this is Locutus' project, shouldn't he have been the one making the first post? I mean, he still has to edit it, you know. Now the post having all the results has to be somewhere in the middle of first page of thread.

	15-08-2001 01:41									#14
	Put an end to popups!

Poland 10
Tibet 10
Vikings 10
Australia 10
Brazil 10
Indonesia 10
Mongols 10
Sumerians 10
Ethiopia 10
South Afrika 10
Iran 10
Oekraïne 10
Spain 10
Portugal 10
Incas 10
Thai 10

	15-08-2001 02:31									#15
	Remove this text

Snake Mound: 20
Anasazi: 20
Native Americans: 5 (Replace the Iroquois League)
Ghana: 10
Mali: 10
Mongols: 20
Spanish: 20
Carthaginians: 10
Vikings!: 20
Hebrew: 10
Turkish: 15

-160


For that matter, laros, you could argue that the Germans be considered Prussia and any number of other minor city states.
I believe that history agrees with you up to the point where you say they werent a civilization. They were a group of raiding parties and an army centered around a central cause, roughly like the Mongols.

	15-08-2001 03:59									#16
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

All, please stop posting in this thread but continue here.

Markos,
Thanks for posting this thread when that other one started to act weird. However, as Stefu said, I can't edit the first post here and thus not post any updates. Would you be so kind as to untop and close this thread and top the new one. TIA...