06-12-2001 17:04									#91
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quote: Originally posted by Roland What I find funny though is that pan-angloism. Even funnier that it is so prominent among the Yanks. Now we continental europeans have some quibbles with the Brits, but tieing up with you Americans would be a total culture shocks for both sides. Can you imagine dubya in PM's question time ?

Not all of us "Yanks" are into this idea, believe me. It would be like doubling the size of our Northeast, which is the most 'liberal' (ie uptight and statist) part of the country.

My girlfriend has her own version of PM question time, but in her case the PM stands for Pre-Menstrual, and I have a good idea what GW would feel like if he became the President of Pan-Anglia and faced the opposition in a parliementary free for all.

	06-12-2001 17:09									#92
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quote: Originally posted by Sikander ... I have a good idea what GW would feel like if he became the President of Pan-Anglia and faced the opposition in a parliementary free for all.

BUT IT WOULD BE LIVE ON TV!

	06-12-2001 17:13									#93
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Is stammering out lame and implausible answers to visciously crafted question good or bad tv?

	06-12-2001 17:14									#94
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Wurstlander complains about American tv and news but can't stop watching it.

	06-12-2001 18:01									#95
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"Is stammering out lame and implausible answers to visciously crafted question good or bad tv?"

Dubya allowed to ramble: bad TV
Dubya challanged to make sense: excellent TV

"Wurstlander complains about American tv and news but can't stop watching it."

I admit, it is absolutely fascinating, especially in its description of its alien home planet. Yet I can't stand more than maybe 15 minutes of it in one chunk....

	07-12-2001 01:25									#96
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quote: Dr Spin - you do realise that Roland is Austrian don't you?

No, I didn't.

quote: I don't know where you have been on the European continent

France, Germany, Switzerland, Italy.

quote: but it is fairly indistinguishable from the UK in many ways. Obviously there is regional variation (which is a good thing) but I find myself much more 'at home' in Continental Europe than in the US.

I should probably ask "where" in the U.S. Naturally, you would feel less at home in Dallas than in say, Boston. Or in Savannah vs. Hartford.

As for the UK being indistinguishable from CE in 'many ways', of course it is. You can doubtless find many similarities between UK and Germany, as well as ones between the UK and US. It's all a matter of what 'weights' you put on each, and how you tally at the end of the day. It's really a matter of opinion how you weigh cultural value. Arguing for matters of opinion, I find boorish and not useful.

quote: For one thing, the people of Britian and the rest of Europe have much more in common with each pollitically and morally other than the US has in common with either.

Again, It's helpful to remember that America is a BIG country. I doubt that there is more (political) variation between New York and Britian, than there is between New York and Georgia.

quote: It is just a myth that the British like to perpetuate to Americans that we are 'just like you'. Thank God we are not!

I've never heard this. I'm basing my opinions on what I've seen first-hand.

Aside: Did you ever work on NA38 or NA50???

quote: For annoying jingoism and endorsing reporting of displays of annoying jingoism, Fox is not that much worse than the others.

I thought you were speaking of me personally. Yes, Fox news is silly, as is much of the rest of American media. They are into selling a product, of course, in a competetive market.

quote: So you got to pick between pathetic little daddy boys from both parties as the result of a hopelessly corrupt political process.

Define 'corrupt'. To me, corrupt involves a conscious conspiracy. I think it more incompetent. Personally, I find this line of conversation pedantic, and non-sequitor.

quote: "music" - pretty much international "movies" - dito

Perhaps on your side of the pond, but over here, Britian sells, while CE doesn't.

quote: "sitcom television" - I have the impression that one of the sharpest devides between Americans and Brits is humour... I mean, humor.

There is a strong market over here for British humor. Both John Cleese and Benny Hill are hugely popular.

As for spelling, as long as we understand the meaning, It doesn't matter. I will understand if you insert the superfluous British u's.

quote: This (NHS) is quite un-american (it's no large corporation after all), and is quite leftist from a continental POV.

Again, I remind you that America is a big diverse country. There is a sizeable population what wants a form of NHS (myself included). NHS is popular in the Northeast and California.

quote: Or Brits trust their government with outlawing virtually all private gun ownership. Rather extreme, even from a continental perspective.

Again, look to state-to-state variation.

quote: "petty nationalism" - not even close to the US. Nowhere near.

Not in my experience. I have heard quite the nationalist venom when discussing EU integration.

quote: If we take war in Afghanistan, popular sentiment seems more in line with other european countries (ie ~50-70 % approval, rather than 90 %).

Since it was the US directly attacked, of course it would. Look instead to the action in Bosnia, Iraq, or Lybia (are you old enough to remember that one?).

quote: Because the government policy is tied into the US "political-military-industrial complex".

I don't know what this means.

	07-12-2001 13:52									#97
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Spin:

"Again, It's helpful to remember that America is a BIG country. I doubt that there is more (political) variation between New York and Britian, than there is between New York and Georgia."

Interesting point... now you can hold NY and Georgia together through nationalism, but Georgia and Britain ?

"I thought you were speaking of me personally."

No. Sorry if I gave rise to such a misunderstanding.

"Define 'corrupt'."

How big is the weight of money in primaries ? Where does the money come from ? What favours are promised in return ?
It's worth adding in that context that the UK has quite strict laws on campaign funding (and the occasional scandal, that would pass as everyday practice in the US).

"Perhaps on your side of the pond, but over here, Britian sells, while CE doesn't."

Britain sells here too. Also US to some extent, with the locals mixed into it. On the other hand, I here get to listen to quite little say portuguese music.

"There is a strong market over here for British humor. Both John Cleese and Benny Hill are hugely popular."

Well that's not excatly canned-laughter-sitcom.

"Again, I remind you that America is a big diverse country. There is a sizeable population what wants a form of NHS (myself included). NHS is popular in the Northeast and California."

Ehm... how do you think the NHS operates ?

Gun ownership: Which US state has a UK-like ban ?

"Not in my experience. I have heard quite the nationalist venom when discussing EU integration."

Anti-EU-talk, sure. And the tabloids with their obsession with ze war. But how much "Britain is/has the best XYZ in the world" have you heard ?

"...or Lybia (are you old enough to remember that one?)."

Ordered by Thatcher, who was widely hated in the UK. I do not remember public sentiment on that one or how it related to the embassy shooting though....

"I don't know what this means."

Britain's key military capabilities (nukes, nuclear subs, intelligence, tranport) is closely tied in with the US. UK politicians have in a way made a deal that they can still play mini-superpower, for going along with US policies.

	07-12-2001 14:58									#98
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"Both John Cleese and Benny Hill are hugely popular."

And Benny Hill stopped being popular here nearly 20 years ago...

	07-12-2001 15:19									#99
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Ugh. I totally overread that crap...

So, correction:

"There is a strong market over here for British humor. Both John Cleese and Benny Hill are hugely popular."

Well John Cleese is not exactly canned-laughter-sitcom. And Benny Hill is ugh....

	08-12-2001 07:30									#100
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quote: And Benny Hill stopped being popular here nearly 20 years ago...

I suppose sarcasm doesn't translate well in writing. I haven't seen Benny Hill here in 20 yrs.

quote: now you can hold NY and Georgia together through nationalism, but Georgia and Britain ?

I'm not saying you should. I'm not proposing an integrated pan-anglican superstate (with a single government), but rather a NAFTA-like trade bloc. Canada has her differences with the US too. I would like to see US-UK enjoy a more US-Canada like relationship.

quote: How big is the weight of money in primaries ? Where does the money come from ? What favours are promised in return ?

In order: very big; private individuals, buisinesses, and federal matching funds; all kinds.

quote: It's worth adding in that context that the UK has quite strict laws on campaign funding (and the occasional scandal, that would pass as everyday practice in the US).

Campaign finance reform is a major political issue here (which I support).

quote: Well that's not excatly canned-laughter-sitcom.

If you look at the numbers, you'll find that 'c-l-s' programming is not hugely popular (out of proportion to its ubiquity). The programming which gets numbers are the better crime dramas (a genre popular you-know-where) and satire. In the case of the recent spate of awful 'reality' programming, guilty as charged. Hopefully, it's just a fad (and yes, I know where it originated... think of our exported sitcoms as payback for reality TV).

quote: Gun ownership: Which US state has a UK-like ban ?

I don't know the specifics of UK law. Is it different in the cities than the country? When is firearm ownership allowed?

quote: But how much "Britain is/has the best XYZ in the world" have you heard ?

You probably shouldn't characterize an entire nation based on the ramblings of a few vocal nitwits. And yes, our nitwits are vocal. Most of the populace isn't like that... but then you wouldn't know, because they generally keep their mouths shut and go about their buisiness.

quote: Ordered by Thatcher, who was widely hated in the UK.

She couldn't have been THAT hated. I imagine she is a figure like Reagan. Adored by a few, hated by a few, laughed at by the rest.

quote: Britain's key military capabilities (nukes, nuclear subs, intelligence, tranport) is closely tied in with the US. UK politicians have in a way made a deal that they can still play mini-superpower, for going along with US policies.

I think it's a bit more complicated than that. Yes, Britian is a major US military partner, but I think it's more a function of similar national interests than them wanting to 'play mini-superpower' strictly for the sake of prestige.

Again, I don't see the US-UK gulf being much farther than the US-Canada gulf, and closer than some of the interstate gulfs that exist within the US.