07-01-2002 10:41									#1
	The Best And The Worst Of Your Countries History. Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I posted a thread like this about a year ago. But there have been new faces since then and I thought I would try again.

In your opinion, what is

1. The absolute best moment in your countries history. The event(s) that you would use to explain all that is good about the people and culture of your country.

2. The absolute worst moment in your counrties history. The event(s) that you consider a low point in your countries treatment of it's neigbors, minority within your country, or people far away.


This is not about how you consider another country. This is about your country and your people.

I will post my choices later. There are so many to choose from in both catogories.

	07-01-2002 10:54									#2
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1. Hell, there are so many but I'm going to say the chain of events that led to the development, by American corporations and governments, of the transistor/integrated circuit/microprocessor/personal computer/internet.

2. The 3/5ths clause.

	07-01-2002 10:57									#3
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I personally feel that the greatest moment in United States history was period of time in which we were involved in World War II.

Here you had regular men, who wanted nothing more than to come home from a hard day's work and sit down to dinner with their families who were forced to go and defend their right to do that.

None of them truly wanted to fight a war, but they knew they had to, and they came together not just for a nation, but for a cause. And they won.

As for the worst moment, many are going to say that it was the sixties and seventies, and the Vietnam period.

I'm not sure though. To me, that wasn't so much bad period of history as it was a period of change. Some things changed for the worse, and some for the better.

K

	07-01-2002 11:07									#4
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Best Moment: When we won the American Revolution, allowing us to establish a good constitutional republic that protected freedoms, thus setting a model for all the world(Especially during the period after the Congress of Vienna, when in Europe freedom was in short supply.)

Worst Moment: The US subjugation of the Phillipines. An absolutely tragedy and disgrace, when we went against everything our country stood for.

	07-01-2002 11:10									#5
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We never had any good moments that I recall

	07-01-2002 15:03									#6
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Finland:
Best moment: The winter war 1939-1940; the finns repelled the soviet attack; the number of soviet soldiers was about ten times greater than finnish soldiers. Thank god Finland was not invaded.

Worst moment: the 90's recession - the unemployment was about 20 %. The recession was due to the crazy "casino-economy" led by finnish government and supported by the majority of finnish banks (or something like that).

	07-01-2002 15:42									#7
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wish I was swedish

	07-01-2002 15:56									#8
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USA

Best moment: The Whiskey Rebellion

Worst moment: Suppression of the Whiskey Rebellion

	07-01-2002 15:59									#9
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Holland:

The best as well as the worst moment in Dutch history:

The foundation of the VOC (Dutch East India Company) 400 years ago in 1602.

It is probably the best period because the Dutch ruled the wold seas during most of the 17th century, bringing in goods from the east and creating an enormous wealth in Holland, causing a great cultural development.

On the downside the monopoly on trade from the east was accompanied by some great brutality against local people and european rivals in the east. Slave trade and massacres were frequently used to enforce the monopoly on spices, tea, silk and chinese porcelain.

Because of the 400 year anniversary of the VOC this year this discussion is quite current at the moment.

	07-01-2002 16:20									#10
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USA


After September 11th. The headlines on TV read:
Nation Prays

that was awesome

worst moment, when the FatBoys broke up
but seriously, I would have to say there were so many
September 11th
White Water
Rodney King
Vietnam

too bad im not a history buff or I would probably have a better answer for the worst thing

	07-01-2002 17:23									#11
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Finnish best moment: Winter War.

Finnish worst moment: Civil War. Three months of senseless ideological slaughter with atrocities by both sides, followed by victorious Whites exerting cruel brand of 'justice' on Red losers. Compeletely inane.

	07-01-2002 18:29									#12
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Portugal:

Best:
- The courage of the Portuguese sailors, who explored a lot of the world by sea in the late XV, early XVI centuries.
- The democratic revolution in 1974; the fascist regime was overthrown by the military themselves, with only one man getting killed in the whole country. But for some time the people even thought that there hadn't been any bloodshed.
- Benfica

Worst:
- Rejecting Columbus idea to reach the Indies by west, letting him go to Spain for support for the journey. This tiny country could have its own pet continent by now!
- The almost vanish of agriculture in the country with all the richness coming from India, Africa and Brazil, that severely crippled the country economy when the riches started to fade away.
- The civil war in the XIX century. Could there be something worst than brothers killing each other?

	07-01-2002 18:40									#13
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Modern Israel :
Best : The end of the Six Days War of course. Absolute victory.
Worst : When those stupid politicians decided to stay in Lebanon after Arafat's mini-army was crushed.

Or, during the whole history of Israel :
Best : In the end of David's reign. Large, rich regional superpower.
Worst : It's really hard to think about some very low point... But i'm sure many people here will remind me about those.

	07-01-2002 19:43									#14
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Worst:
- Holocaust cooperation, which led to highest Holocaust victim/1000 population ratio (higher than Poland!:eek; shame on us.
- Partition of the Lithuanian-Polish state in the end of the 18th century
- Soviet occupation 1939-1991.

Best:

- Lithuania stretching from sea to shining sea (Baltic-Black sea) 15th century+being relatively nice to subjects in controlled territories (religious freedom, small taxes, progressive laws);
- Kicking the Teuton orders arse on a regular basis until its eventual dissolution in the 16th century;
- Regaining of independence in 1990-1991 WITHOUT a shot being fired

	07-01-2002 19:48									#15
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America - Best moment, friendly relations with both neighboring countries and the longest undefended border.

Worst Moment - Trail of Tears and all similar acts.

	07-01-2002 20:00									#16
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Best: The American Revolution

Worst: Some standouts are a) Our involvement in WWI & b) The Banana Wars.

PS What's so great about the Whisky Rebellion?

	07-01-2002 20:14									#17
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US -
Best: Writing the Constitution. The Revolution was swell, but would have been merely a coup d'etat without the Sacred Document.

Worst: Well, everything to do with slavery, but if a single moment has to be identified I guess I'll go with the striking of all references to slavery from the Declaration of Independence. That or the 3/5 clause, as JohnT mentioned. Very close second: the Trail of Tears.

Turkey-
Best: The War for Independence; Turkey fights a 3-front war, kicks French, Italian, and Greek @ss, and establishes the first secular state in the Islamic world.

Worst: The Armenian genocide (or, as they call it here, the "so-called Armenian genocide" )

	07-01-2002 20:19									#18
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Belgium:

The After WWII period:
-The very fast economical grown.
-The creation of the very good social security system that even survived until now.
-The creation by Belgium of the BeNeLux what later growned to the E.U.

The german occupation of Belgium in WWII:
-The killing of many jews, like in Antwerp.
-But even worser: the collaboration of some Belgians with the Germans in doing that, especial in Antwerp.

	07-01-2002 20:30									#19
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quote: Originally posted by kolpo The german occupation of Belgium in WWII: -The killing of many jews, like in Antwerp. -But even worser: the collaboration of some Belgians with the Germans in doing that, especial in Antwerp.

I'm not trolling, I'm just curious: do you and/or Belgians generally consider this worse than Belgium's atrocities in the Congo?

	07-01-2002 20:33									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Eli Worst : It's really hard to think about some very low point... But I'm sure many people here will remind me about those.

The destruction of Jerusalem by the Babylonians in 537 BC?

The Jewish rebellion against the Romans in 74 AD, which lead to a genocide of 1 million Jews?

The involvement of the Sanhedrin in the capture and death of a man called Jesus, considered by many (and I mean many) the Christ?

Hope I helped you, Eli!

	07-01-2002 20:36									#21
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Worst: 1933 Hitler came to power

Best: 1989 Fall of the Berlin wall

	07-01-2002 20:37									#22
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Argentina:

Best- The Campaña del Desierto after its completion (1882). It catapulted the conservatives under Roca to power and a period of unparallel growth made Argentina, in 30 years, the 6th world economic power.

Worst- The Dirty War, 1976-1983. The impunity to kill and repress were never so open.

	07-01-2002 20:40									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Zealot The destruction of Jerusalem by the Babylonians in 537 BC? The Jewish rebellion against the Romans in 74 AD, which lead to a genocide of 1 million Jews? The involvement of the Sinedrium in the capture and death of a man called Jesus, considered by many (and I mean many) the Christ? Hope I helped you, Eli!

I dont think we understand "worst" in the same way.

	07-01-2002 20:41									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Eli I dont think we understand "worst" in the same way.

Explain your definition of "worst" and I'll see if I can accomodate you.

	07-01-2002 20:52									#25
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My definition is identical to the other posters' definitions. The period when your country was one of the really bad guys. Like US and the slavery and the Finnish civil war. Not the period when your country suffered the most.

	07-01-2002 20:57									#26
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Worst: 1938-1945, for obvious reasons.

Best: Difficult to pick... the colonization and melting pot of bavarian, slavic and roman populations from the 8th to the 12th/13th century; the vibrant cultural and intellectual life in the decades leading up to WWI; the slow but steady development from banana republic to respectable democracy since the 1950s.

	07-01-2002 20:59									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Eli My definition is identical to the other posters' definitions. The period when your country was one of the really bad guys

1) Sanhedrin's "judgement" of Jesus.
2) Isreali genocide of the Canaanites.
3) Sicarii & Zealot terrorism against Rome.

I can go on if you wish.

	07-01-2002 21:08									#28
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quote: Originally posted by BeBro Worst: 1933 Hitler came to power Best: 1989 Fall of the Berlin wall

Germans being brief again?

I agree on the worst one, and your idea for the best moment came to my mind as well... but there were better moments in our thousand years history

18 January, 1871

	07-01-2002 21:09									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Roland Worst: 1938-1945, for obvious reasons.

We all know who to blame for 1933-1945

	07-01-2002 21:19									#30
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc 1) Sanhedrin's "judgement" of Jesus.

Oh, it's written that way in English? I'll correct it ASAP.

quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc 3) Sicarii & Zealot terrorism against Rome.

Zealot terrorism? No way! We're all nice chaps!

(I'm just kidding, I know what Zealots were )