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Giancarlo
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Los Angeles
Apr 2000
time: 02:17
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quote:
Originally posted by The Emperor Fabulous
I told you before, the only people that I hate are based on their personality. Giancarlo is probably at the very top of my on-line list. He has no purpose on this planet except to make sure everyone else has as horrible a time as he is having. When he looks back on his life, provided he makes it to that age, if he does not see failure, he has certainly never reached maturity, adulthood, or the intelligence level of a human being. |
And I dislike ignorant snobs who characterize themselves as intellectuals and seem to think they have a solution to long standing issues. Horrible time I am having? Listen to me you commie, the only problem I am having is people like you trying to infiliitrate my freedoms. Trying to steal my right to defend myself and my right to speak! I AM SICK AND TIRED OF BEING SILENCED BY THE IMPUDENT MINORITY.
On the standing issue of paeophila I think those whom committed the unspeakable acts should be executed. Since I am existentialist, execution is a very harsh punishment because the time on earth is all we get in my opinion.
Last edited by Giancarlo on 26-02-2002 at 18:06
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Sirotnikov
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<--- Yes, It's a "kitty" in a boot.
Feb 2000
time: 07:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Logical Realist
Yes, they are allowed to criticize gays all they want up to the point of harassment. But that doesn't mean we can't criticize or dislike them for that. I also have a right to dislike Kaak's homophobia as much as Kaak has a right to dislike homosexuals. Kaak should realize this when he posts... |
You can criticize him as much as you want.
I think he understands it as well.
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also aren't yu being a bit hypocritical? (' ') You are saying that those criticizing Kaak are being harsh,intolerant of Kaak's dislikes and yet you got very critical on me when I seemed to be criticizing your precious theism and saying I don't like Christians as a group. |
I'm saying that IMO they criticize the wrong points.
Instead of arguing why his opinion of gay people is wrong, people argue why he is a bad person if he has this opinion of gay people.
And that's exaclty why I said that christianity has nothing to do with it. Because it hasn't.
He said : i think sodomy is icky, and i dislike gay people because they practice it
Most of you say : you are evil. you are also very religious and the bible is evil.
I'm saying that you should deal with the issue, not things sorrounding it, like Kaak's right to dislike people.
Show him why he shouldn't care, not why he isn't allowed to think like he does.
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Well if you can't judge hates how much more so can you judge dislikes? |
That's the whole point.
He doesn't ask you to judge his dislike as good or bad.
He asks you to comment on it and say why should he change it.
General points like "it makes you an evil person" are idiotic.
If I were arguing with a person who dislikes jews, telling him that it makes him a nazi and how hating people is wrong would be stupid and pointless.
I would tell him how jews are just like everyone else, and what good things they have contributed to society, and how their relgious rituals and their unity doesn't hurt him.
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which case, how come you are so willing to criticize my dislikes? Because they include you in a partial way most likely. See how different it is when you feel targeted? |
I don't criticize anyone for his dislikes.
I'm saying that you are arguing about useless points. By saying "thinking like you do is bad" you do nothing to change his mind.
I don't feel threatened nor do I feel targeted. I simply notice how you are chasing your own tail, convincing yourself, but not convincing him.
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Such dislike,epecially when one is so vocal about it inspires discrimination. |
He isn't so vocal about it.
He simply posted it here to talk about it.
Being vocal would in my opinion be trying to crush gay rights or something. Or yelling "kill gays" or something.
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Also anyone gay cares as Kaak said they were "disgusting". I imagine had someone said Jews were "disgusting" you would care. |
I would care.
But if I had come and said "you're not entitled to this p.o.v. because it's evil" it would be useless.
Instead I would explain to him why jews are ok and shouldn't bother him.
I wouldn't criticize him for hating jews, because he can if he wants to. I would try to convince him he shouldn't, but logically. I don't think that 'hating jews' is wrong because it's an immoral opinion or something. It's wrong because I don't see logical reasons to hate jews.
And even then, if a person hates jews - as long as he doesn't act upon it, he's welcome to hate me.
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As do I, because such bigotry has negative consequences and is baseless. I despise all irrational dislikes based on superstition, as well as such strong dislikes over something as petty and private as a person's sex life. |
I don't judge dislikes.
I simply try to explain to people why they shouldn't feel threatened. But I don't think of their view as plain wrong. They can hate anyone they (dis)like for any reason they (dis)like.
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Again though to use your own standards against you...If I limit myself to disliking religion and do not descriminate against the religious, who cares? You seem to. |
Sure I care.
And I would try to explain to you why you shouldn't hate relgion.
But nowhere will I say that you are not entitled to think so!
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You totally took that out of context. DM was saying that Kaak doesn't care about other's statements, in that, he's not open minded about nor giving them a fair hearing nor willing to change. |
I think most statements simply miss the rout of his dislike, which is disgust of sodomy.
Instead most people simply attack him for being an evil person, or attack the bible.
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All Kaak is interested in is expressing hatred and trying to spread/justify it in a half-baked manner. |
Not at all in my opinion.
He wasn't interested in expressing hatred nor in spreading it.
He simply wanted to have a discussion about this. Had he wanted to spread this he would have began a "gays are bad" thread.
Nowehre has he said so. He said that he dislikes them and in his opinion they sin. Nowehere did i notice him claiming he is the ultimate authority on it, nor calling for something to be done about this.
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In other words, he cares about shouting his views from the top of the roof, but when anyone else diagrees, he doesn't care to listen. |
You should attack his points and not him.
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Yes, but it akes very few bigots to turn a gays life into a nightmare. Especially if those more rational and tolerant elements of soceity aren't willing to counter their influence. |
But your attitude is wrong. Instead of shutting thier mouth, explain why they are wrong. That's my whole point.
Hi.
I'm siro
17/m/5'10/115lb
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you strike me as very hypocritical. When it comes to Kaak shouting about how he dislikes gays...that's fine. Even if his reasoning is flawed. |
Perhaps it is flawed.
I don't defend his opinion but rather his right to have one.
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When it comes to me disliking something that YOU hold dear...you get very offended and sound off. |
I don't think i got very offended.
I merely explained why i think she is wrong.
If she wants to go around hating religion or kaak or both, she is entitled to.
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Even if I present good reasons. You practice double standards. Like a child, you think its OK to harm others all you want, or for someone else to, but if someone offends you in anyway...now they are bad people. You're a joke. |
The joke is on you since you don't get what I'm saying.
I simply ask for reasonable debate.
I don't recall saying that DM is a bad person or that it's wrong to hate religion.
I said i think she is wrong, which is legitimate. And it's legitimate for her to think what ever she wants.
I may attack her opinion, but not her right to hold one.
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Kaak
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siro:  atleast you can forward *logical* arguements 
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And you could also make that comparison with with heterosexuals, ie "one who is turned on by child pornos has no more choice as to what flips his lid than does a heterosexual person" |
I agree. if you claim sexual orientation isn't a matter of choice, then it isn't a matter of choice. I just think that homosexuality is as blatantly wrong and gross as paedophilia.
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Kaak should realize this when he posts... |
I never said that you didn't have that right of course i realize this.
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yet you got very critical on me when I seemed to be criticizing your precious theism and saying I don't like Christians as a group. |
The problem here was that it's great and all that you can quote a few verses, but you really don't understand what it is to be a christian, or how the verses impact one.
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I imagine had someone said Jews were "disgusting" you would care. |
apples to oranges...
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Again though to use your own standards against you...If I limit myself to disliking religion and do not descriminate against the religious |
hmmm...and i thought you posted something entirely different...
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You totally took that out of context. |
Much like the verses you think are so swaying
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All Kaak is interested in is expressing hatred |
*goes back to count the times he said there was no hate, only dislike* Have you been reading this thread? or are you just responding to it generally as you would a stereotype?
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Even if his reasoning is flawed. When it comes to me disliking something that YOU hold dear...you get very offended and sound off. Even if I present good reasons. |
The irony here is that I admitted I might be wrong in my original post, while a) you think your reasons are good  and b) you think you are right
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IMO very few paedophiles limit themselves to just thinking about children in a sexual way, pictures and videos |
hmmm...any sources to support this? I would say, that as with many many other things, there are far more people who think about it than act on it.
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Do you want paedophilia to be as socially accepted as homosexuality? |
Actually, i don't think either should be socially accepted...
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Kaak
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bugs. seriously. you wouldn't have to wait if you would read. I've heard of things like one consenting adult defacating on another. The fact that both were consenting has absolutely no bearing on whether or not the act is gross to me.
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Kaak
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People generally make decisions on who they like and who they don't on the actions and decisions the person makes. If people do things that I find disgusting, i don't like that person. If people have a crude mouth, i don't like that person.
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Kaak
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"you are known by the company you keep"
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Asher
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Calgary, Alberta
Nov 1999
time: 22:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Sirotnikov
I'm saying that IMO they criticize the wrong points.
Instead of arguing why his opinion of gay people is wrong, people argue why he is a bad person if he has this opinion of gay people. |
So how come Kaak can argue that he doesn't like gays because of their decisions, but it's not okay for everyone else to argue that we don't like Kaak based upon his bigotry?
And that's exaclty why I said that christianity has nothing to do with it. Because it hasn't.
I agree here, I hate religious debates. Pointless.
He said : i think sodomy is icky, and i dislike gay people because they practice it
Most of you say : you are evil. you are also very religious and the bible is evil.
Nobody said he was evil, IIRC. Just that he's a close-minded bigot. Which he admits, and you can't argue otherwise.
Show him why he shouldn't care, not why he isn't allowed to think like he does.
How do you suppose we do that?
You can't just magically make him enlightened, he's still the dark God-fearing homophobe he was in the first place. He doesn't think homosexuality should be socially accepted, which worries me. What two people do behind close doors is none of anyone's business, and when people come up and try to stop two people from doing things they want to do, they've got some kind of agenda. With Kaak, he's either a religious nut who thinks the homosexuality is such a horrible sin nobody should be "allowed" to do it, or he's a "closet gay" homophobe who is tempted by the thought of being able to do it without reprecussion. If there's another logical explaination for his actions here, let me know. I sure don't see it.
quote:
That's the whole point.
He doesn't ask you to judge his dislike as good or bad.
He asks you to comment on it and say why should he change it.
General points like "it makes you an evil person" are idiotic. |
No, that's not the whole point.
The point is he trolled saying he doesn't like gays, and is somewhat surprised when the majority of people here respond to him with disgust.
Homosexuality isn't nearly as "bad" as bigotry. Here's why:
Homosexuality involves consenting adults.
Bigotry involves rejection, harassment, and ignorance.
So don't be the least bit surprised when people attack Kaak for his righteous bigotry. It's a major part of thie discussion on WHY he should change it.
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If I were arguing with a person who dislikes jews, telling him that it makes him a nazi and how hating people is wrong would be stupid and pointless. |
That's not accurate: In this analogy, he already admitted to being a Nazi. People are now replying with "thumbs-down" type posts and expressing disgust with his ignorant viewpoints.
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I would tell him how jews are just like everyone else, and what good things they have contributed to society, and how their relgious rituals and their unity doesn't hurt him. |
You seem to think nobody has tried that to Kaak before. None of that matters to him because he finds the acts homosexuals do "disgusting" so he doesn't care who the person is. For some "unexplained" reason he thinks about gay sex when he sees homosexuals. 
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I don't feel threatened nor do I feel targeted. I simply notice how you are chasing your own tail, convincing yourself, but not convincing him. |
Nobody's chasing their tail but Kaak here. And if anyone's doing the "i think i can" dance, it's him. 
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He isn't so vocal about it.
He simply posted it here to talk about it. |
Bullshit. In other threads we've already had the debate. Those die out, then he makes a new one confessing to disliking homosexuals.
He's very vocal about it.
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But if I had come and said "you're not entitled to this p.o.v. because it's evil" it would be useless. |
Nobody said that.
I said he's entitled to his p.o.v., but don't be surprised when it gets him fired.
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Instead I would explain to him why jews are ok and shouldn't bother him. |
Already tried that.
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I wouldn't criticize him for hating jews, because he can if he wants to. |
So I'm going to go make a thread right now, talking about my supreme disgust for those "militant" israelis who stole land from the "innocent" palestinians and how disgusting the Jews are. And then I want you not to criticize me in the slightest, and calmly tell me why Jews are good people.
Really, that doesn't fly.
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I would try to convince him he shouldn't, but logically. I don't think that 'hating jews' is wrong because it's an immoral opinion or something. It's wrong because I don't see logical reasons to hate jews. |
We established long ago that logic doesn't prevail with Kaak, at least on this topic. Arguing about the logic of it with him is like explaining discrete mathematics to a 3 year old.
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I don't judge dislikes. |
You don't judge dislikes, even when they're based entirely on somebody's sexuality rather than the person for who they are?
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I think most statements simply miss the rout of his dislike, which is disgust of sodomy. |
Most statements do miss that, because it's not supposed to be the issue. Many, many heterosexuals commit sodomy, why doesn't he just ask people he meets in the future: "Hey, have you ever gone in the back door with your woman?". If they respond yes, he can dislike them too. It's a great system of pre-judging!
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Not at all in my opinion.
He wasn't interested in expressing hatred nor in spreading it. |
He only said he "disliked Homosexuals" a dozen times in his first post.
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He simply wanted to have a discussion about this. Had he wanted to spread this he would have began a "gays are bad" thread. |
What is there to discuss other than his completely ignorant, arrogant, righteous, and wrong beliefs?
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You should attack his points and not him. |
Hypocrites!
If he's judging people based upon their sexual orientation, why can't we judge him based upon his limited mental capacity?
He attacked every single gay or bi person by saying he thought they were "disgusting" and said he didn't want homosexuality to be socially accepted. So now people are slamming him. Go cry about it elsehwere.
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But your attitude is wrong. Instead of shutting thier mouth, explain why they are wrong. That's my whole point. |
You don't get it.
We've already tried explaining why he is wrong. He doesn't care! He thinks it's disgusting and because he's not homosexual, therefore it's wrong and should not be socially acceptable.
People have been attacking those claims (With the exceptions of those religious-blasters).
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Asher
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Calgary, Alberta
Nov 1999
time: 22:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Kaak
siro: atleast you can forward *logical* arguements |
They were logical, but supremely misguided.
quote:
I agree. if you claim sexual orientation isn't a matter of choice, then it isn't a matter of choice. I just think that homosexuality is as blatantly wrong and gross as paedophilia. |
Sexuality is not a matter of choice. Think about it from your side:
When you were born, did you have to make the choice on if you wanted to be straight, bisexual, or gay? No, you already knew you were straight.
How would it be any different for somebody who is gay or bi?
It's not a choice, it's either decided by nature or nurture. They're not sure yet, but it doesn't matter.
If you think homosexuality is as bad as paedolphilia, I'd have to ask why you took a mensa IQ test.
Homosexuality is done behind closed doors, between two consenting adults.
Paedolphilia involves exploiting children.
The two are nowhere close. Any man with a shred of intelligent can see that.
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*goes back to count the times he said there was no hate, only dislike* Have you been reading this thread? or are you just responding to it generally as you would a stereotype? |
That's a bullshit statement.
There is hate.
Explain to me what would be different to how you treat homosexuals if you hated them and if you disliked them.
Also explain to me how Matthew Shephard died if he was merely "disliked".
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Actually, i don't think either should be socially accepted... |
God forbid people do what they want behind closed doors.
I think premarital sex should not be socially accepted, and sex should not be done for recreation. 
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darthmolar
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Kaak your views are as valid as anyone's. As you can see liberal minded people tell you to "keep your opionions to yourself" while preaching their own views. These people wish for the points to be heard and accepted and no one else's. All of these people make our points valid without us having to do so. Kaak you appear to be a good, just person with high ideals. Keep it up. I am in your corner. It is they who fear and hate us. As you know, we have nothing to fear from these peolpe or those of like mind. Hold to your ideals and your life will unfold productively and you will overcome any and all opposition.
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darthmolar
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quote:
I dislike bigots.
They attempt to keep down the next step in society's evolution.
[QUOTE]
How so?
[QUOTE]I dislike bigots.
Bigots are the only thing holding society back from pure freedom. If it weren't for bigots, people would have the freedom to do what they choose within the confines of human curtousey.
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A bigot excercises his or her first amendment right. This is an act of upholding freedom. I am a bigot, but I stand by other people's free agency.
[QUOTE]I dislike bigots.
Bigots seem unable to comprehend the simple fact that gays, blacks, women, and and everyone else are all people, that we all stem from the SAME line, and that making it a personal crusade to change other people is not only a waste of a person's life, it is a waste of their's as well.
[QUOTE]
Racists do. I am not a racist. All people stem from the same line. However, some things are clearly right and some things are clearly wrong. Maybe you can't see this simple fact.
[QUOTE]I dislike homophobes.
Whether based on Biblical or "natural" law, they take the parts which best serve their purposes and leave the rest in the dust. They attempt to control another's life because THEY ARE DIFFERENT (Oh no, not different!) They believe that their interpretation is right, and therefore, anyone who differs has no right to live. I find homophobes the most disgusting, despicable, VULGER excuses for human beings.
[QUOTE]
I am not a homophobe. I do not fear homosexuals. I simply think the act is vulgar. That is my opinion and my free right to speak on that. I loathe green bale peppers, but that does not mean that I fear them either.
[QUOTE]I dislike conservatives.
Conservatives, at least in this country, discount the basic principles that this country was founded on: Life, Liberty, and the Persuit of Happiness. Those who are religious also try to erase the barrier between church and state, which is another founding principle of these United States.
[QUOTE]
Conservatives (at least in the USA) do not discount the principles that this country was founded on. Life, Liberty, and the Persuit of Happiness is the basis for the constitution, which conservatives wish to uphold, and in some cases restore. Liberals have made countless changes to the constitution over the years, changes which were unnecessary. Not all of those who are religious try to erase the barrier between church and state, which is another founding principle of these United States. You need to have knowledge before you speak.
[QUOTE]I dislike conservatives.
They bring the Right to Bear Arms to the forefront and hide behind it, while the rest of the Constitution and Declaration are sent to hell. Most of these right-to-arms people are also "pro-life." HA!
[QUOTE]
Again you show your ignorance. The second amendment is vital to our nation and constitution. Guns do not kill people. People kill people. Criminal-minded people will not give up their weapons regardless of what laws are passed. I am pro-life. I am for the baby's choice. HA HA!!!
[QUOTE]I dislike Pro-Lifers.
While I agree that life is sacred, Pro-Lifers are hypocrites. You'll find that many "pro-life"ers also support the Death Penalty. Pro-Lifers seek to eliminate stem-cell research, research that could save not hundreds, not thousands, but HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF LIVES . Once that baby is born, Pro-Lifers will say "**** it, lets move out."
[QUOTE]
I support the death penalty. I support the rights of unborn children. I think that women who have numerous abortions as a means of birth control should have their tubes tied. How would you like to have been aborted. Probably did not think about that did you? I am also not a hypocrite. I practice what I preach.
[QUOTE]I dislike fundamentalists.
They skew the teachings of their religion, Christian or Muslim. Those "Christians" who decry homosexuals and kill abortion doctors violate the laws of Jesus and of the Ten Commandments. They are not true Christians. They hide behind their religion, not willing to take responsibility for their COWARDLY actions.
[QUOTE]
I am not a fundalmentalist.
And to those who said I was AWOL...I have a life, I have responsibilities, like a wife, kid, work, and so forth.
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26-02-2002 16:03
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