21-03-2002 23:30									#181
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Sheesh Stew, you're bad enough with bisexuals. God knows what you'd be like with bisexuals who smoke, are left-winged and like arses

	22-03-2002 00:17									#182
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coming out is not being afraid of who you are, and no longer feeling the need to hide who you are from people like YOU, stew.

	22-03-2002 01:12									#183
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quote: Originally posted by Boddington's Coming out is letting people know you're gay because otherwise they'd assume you are straight. Isn't that about it?

So that means what I discussed in a previous thread about coming out did not enter your mind at all??

Let me reiterate for you, Boddington.

Psychological reason for coming out: Homosexuals and bisexuals who come out decide to risk being honest with their family and friends about part of their identity. And the first person that anyone comes out to first is themselves -- realizing that part of their own identity.

Political reason for coming out: Homosexuals and bisexuals have been subjected to social double standards in that they cannot behave in the same way that would be seen as appropriate by heterosexuals. We also use Gay Pride as a community, civic event while at the same time advocating for social equality.

THESE ARE THE REASONS FOR COMING OUT. Let me know what part of what I posted that you do not understand.

	22-03-2002 10:37									#184
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I hope it's not taking you this long to understand the basic concepts of coming out, Boddington.

	22-03-2002 14:59									#185
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To be honest looking at the times you posted that he was probably asleep.

	22-03-2002 16:57									#186
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The gay guy down my corridor came out when he was pissed on New Year's Eve. Doesn't sound much like a political or psychological statement to me.

	22-03-2002 17:01									#187
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He'd been wanting to come out for ages and it was preying on his mind so much that when he got really drunk on New Years Eve he couldn't keep it in any longer and had to tell everyone who he really was you mean?

	22-03-2002 20:35									#188
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quote: Originally posted by Boddington's The gay guy down my corridor came out when he was pissed on New Year's Eve. Doesn't sound much like a political or psychological statement to me.

Boddington, would you like to buy a clue??

You can bet that situation you described definitely was psychological! Some homosexuals get VERY upset over a long period of time after letting out the resentment of repressing themselves and letting their anxiety build up within them, without finding the right way to express their true self.

As a result, some people might come out at what appears to be the strangest time or place. Under that kind of stress, anxiety, or resentment, this is understandable.

Are there some homosexuals and bisexuals who abuse or misuse coming out just for shock value? Are there some who come out at the wrong time or place? Yes, but just because some of us abuse or misuse coming out, that does not mean you can disregard or ignore the legitimate reasons behind coming out for many homosexuals and bisexuals.

	22-03-2002 20:47									#189
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quote: Originally posted by Kropotkin ... asian schoolgirls...)

Where?

The bisexuals I have known have been attracted to someone and did not see their gender as an issue at all. Few have actually ended up in relationships with the objects of their affection (or lust), so they could be called EITHER actively gay or straight, yet without having to think within the constricting ideals of one or the other label.

I guess I'm trying to say that bisexuals are those people attracted to other people for the same reasons anyone is attracted to anyone else - and gender is not important in that equation.

Perhaps one day in the future everyone will be this way, and the ppl who are only either straight or gay will have carnivals every year in Sydney to celebrate their lifestyle.




It so too could happen.

	22-03-2002 23:40									#190
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I admit I am a trisexual. I try but I don't get any.

	22-03-2002 23:45									#191
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quote: Originally posted by MrWhereItsAt Perhaps one day in the future everyone will be this way, It so too could happen.

Oh, if only

But wait! I would not be trendy anymore

	23-03-2002 14:13									#192
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Actually, I think I can see some evidence for Boddington's viewpoint here. This does not mean that my intellectual inclination tends in any way towards agreeing with Boddington's argument (I think it's disgusting, decadent, and offensive to all heterological people). Just call me intellectually curious

When I was at public school in Britain, it was very trendy for a girl to pretend she was bisexual. Part of this rested on the fact that there were disproportionately few girls at that public school. Part of this also rested on a curious phenomenon I have noticed - that men often find lesbian women alluring, but that not so many women find the idea of gay men alluring. Add the two up and a girl often pretended to bisexuality, knowing that it would raise her popularity stock with the boys.

Of course, this was only popular during the childish high school years. In my experience it tailed off in my university years, but the northen location of my uni might have been to blame for this. (The north of Britain doesn't have a particularly progressive view towards homosexuality... "are y'caalin uz a fookin' pooftah?!? Reet - ootside - noow!!".)

I have also tried Boddington's lager with a female friend but I didn't enjoy it after the first time and I think I'll stick to bitter.

	23-03-2002 22:45									#193
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quote: Originally posted by Alinestra Covelia Actually, I think I can see some evidence for Boddington's viewpoint here. This does not mean that my intellectual inclination tends in any way towards agreeing with Boddington's argument (I think it's disgusting, decadent, and offensive to all heterological people). Just call me intellectually curious When I was at public school in Britain, it was very trendy for a girl to pretend she was bisexual. Part of this rested on the fact that there were disproportionately few girls at that public school. Part of this also rested on a curious phenomenon I have noticed - that men often find lesbian women alluring, but that not so many women find the idea of gay men alluring. Add the two up and a girl often pretended to bisexuality, knowing that it would raise her popularity stock with the boys. Of course, this was only popular during the childish high school years. In my experience it tailed off in my university years, but the northen location of my uni might have been to blame for this. (The north of Britain doesn't have a particularly progressive view towards homosexuality... "are y'caalin uz a fookin' pooftah?!? Reet - ootside - noow!!".) I have also tried Boddington's lager with a female friend but I didn't enjoy it after the first time and I think I'll stick to bitter.

I forgive you for your infatuation with Boddington's ideas.

But seriously though -- what makes you think straight women would not enjoy watching two gay men having sex anymore than straight men would enjoy watching two lesbians having sex??

It's only because of double standards in media entertainment that more x-rated movies show straight men watching two women have sex. You will never see the male-dominated entertainment industry giving straight women their fair share of what THEY would enjoy watching.

Same with breasts and cocks. Movies more freely show breasts in r-rated and x-rated movies. But they rarely, if ever show cocks. Why? Because the male-dominated entertainment industry imposes that double standard.

But this is thread-jacking. Give your comments to mine if you want to, on this, but then after that, we need to get back onto the original topic.

	24-03-2002 13:38									#194
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Sure thing.

First of all, this is a phenomenon that I have observed amongst my friends. The guys like the idea of two women having sex, and the girls don't particularly like the idea of two guys having sex.

I don't know why this is, and I don't pretend to comment on the "rightness" or "wrongness" of such a situation. I merely mention what I see. (Oh, all right. With a fair bit of bewilderment too. )

I agree with you about movies and nudity. There's a strange feeling that you can show more of a man's body before it becomes "adult" material (you can show a man stripped to the waist and it will still be family friendly - not so with a woman). However, once it becomes "adult" material, all of the woman's body becomes viewable, whereas still relatively few movies will show all the man's body.

I don't think this is particularly through sexual tastes of the viewership. I think this is more to do with visibility. Most adult females, breasts aside, don't have any visible sexual organs even in the buff (unless you get gynaecologically close... mind that damn camera! close). There are exceptions but these are usually quite brave specimens of womanhood who possess no small degree of razorblade proficiency.

However, adult males have very visible organs whilst nude, even if not in a state of arousal. If you watch a movie such as Schindler's List, where the context of nudity is largely non sexual (I'm thinking to that bit where the Jewish refugees are stripped and registered by the Nazi concentration camp guards), you will probably see an equal weighting as far as gender nudity is concerned.

Once the element becomes sexually charged, you cannot show a male body without it being either A) Pornographic (although whatever that means is up to your definition), or B) Strangely unexcited (in which case it's somewhat unsuited to the context).

< /red herring >

Hang on, I need to say something meaningful. Okay...

Boddington's nonchalant response, that admitting something whilst pissed is not an admission at all, is not entirely correct.

I have known very fervent classic homophobes (by classic I mean people so frightened by the possibility of their own homosexuality that they attack the same in others) who, unable to admit their sexuality openly during sobriety, needed the freedom of inebriation in order to admit their true preferences.

Sometimes very true things are spoken whilst drunk, especially if it's something that the speaker feels he or she cannot normally admit to. Eg I need a few stiff ones before I'll admit to liking Quake III. Except I don't. Not a bit. Not even curious.