26-04-2002 11:18									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Zkribbler 5) Launched a sneak attack on the nation of Greneda, which was the moral equivant of the Japanese sneak attack at Pearl Harbor.

I've never heard this description of Grenada before. Gotta love all the crackpot theories and hyperbole on display here at 'Poly.

	26-04-2002 11:43									#62
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This has been the first thread in a while where I enjoyed reading it. Quite educational and a few viewpoints at the same time.

	26-04-2002 16:06									#63
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He was really good for America. And just good for the rest of the world. Together with Alan Greenspan he fought inflation and unemployment. He didn't seem to be very brightminded, otoh pretty honest for a politian.

	26-04-2002 19:18									#64
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Better diction???? Well, maybe compared to the majority of cockneyed Brits.

	26-04-2002 19:19									#65
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quote: Originally posted by SlowwHand Better diction???? Well, maybe compared to the majority of cockneyed Brits.

and certainly to Ronnie Raygun

	26-04-2002 19:24									#66
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The worst president of the 20th Century. The arms races and socio/economic political battles against Communism are the root of all problems in the current world. Reagan effectively armed half of the third world to the teeth. But he's not entirely to blame. The commies are equally as bad.

As for his domestic policy. Making the top 1% richer and raising the poverty line. How can anyone see this as good? Well, other than the greedy people who profited from it at least.

	26-04-2002 19:37									#67
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He slew the inflation dragon that had been building from the late 60s. This necessarily caused some adjustments, but I think we're better off for it.

The Reagan-Vatican axis was also quite instrumental in Glastnost and ultimately the fall of the Soviet Union. While the covert operation they launched together didn't cost a lot, this was the origin of the political reforms that came after.

He had a wonderful feel for speaking. "Tear down this wall" is one of the best classic lines we will ever hear. Right up there with "I have a dream today." Prophetic, in hindsight.

	26-04-2002 20:00									#68
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Moral decline is in evidence everywhere ...here and abroad. If America had no presidents like Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush to levy out the Carters and Clintons, she would decline and become indistiquisable from European nations...

	26-04-2002 20:02									#69
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quote: Originally posted by jimmytrick Moral decline is in evidence everywhere ...here and abroad. If America had no presidents like Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush to levy out the Carters and Clintons, she would decline and become indistiquisable from European nations...

European countries have a better sense of morals than the United States. You don't see 12 year old trailer park trash having sex with 30 guys in France.

	26-04-2002 20:11									#70
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quote: European countries have a better sense of morals than the United States. You don't see 12 year old trailer park trash having sex with 30 guys in France.

How many trailer parks are in France anyway.

However Gérard Depardieu participated in a gang rape when he was young and it was at most a misdemeanor at the time.

	26-04-2002 20:14									#71
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quote: Originally posted by jimmytrick Moral decline is in evidence everywhere ...here and abroad. If America had no presidents like Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush to levy out the Carters and Clintons, she would decline and become indistiquisable from European nations...

Reagan is the reason I quit the Republican Party. I still think his eight years was good for the world and the US generally but it sure was bad for El Salvador and Nicaragua. Somebody else would have been better.

Ronnie and Nancy had their first kid together seven months after they got married.

Full term.

Family values started later I guess.

	26-04-2002 21:02									#72
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Sometimes I think their are only two kinds of people in the world.

1. People who acknowledge moral standards despite the fact that they often fall short of them. Humans are prone to mistakes. I think this type of person is the bulwark of civilization and I admire people who, knowing they are subject to criticism, take a stand.
2. People who attack type number one. I don't understand these people, their motivations or thought processes. They are a mystery to me.

There might be other kinds of people but most often these two types stand out.

	26-04-2002 21:06									#73
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I fall into category 3.

3. Perfect in every possible way

	26-04-2002 21:15									#74
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I think it would be more accurate to define the categories this way:

1. People who believe in moral standards and follow them. These people usually do not dismiss moral failures with cheap rationalizations like "humans are prone to mistakes".

2. People who attack the moral failures of others, even though they are not moral themselves. These people are hypocrites.

	26-04-2002 21:16									#75
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quote: Originally posted by jimmytrick Sometimes I think their are only two kinds of people in the world. 1. People who acknowledge moral standards despite the fact that they often fall short of them. Humans are prone to mistakes. I think this type of person is the bulwark of civilization and I admire people who, knowing they are subject to criticism, take a stand. 2. People who attack type number one. I don't understand these people, their motivations or thought processes. They are a mystery to me. There might be other kinds of people but most often these two types stand out.

You forgot hypocrites. Ron and Nancy and a lot other people in the Family Values crusade are hypocrites.

I am in the first group Jimmy. I am moral. I do make mistakes. I don't try to force others to be that way however.

Actually Ron and Nancy weren't part of the Family Values crap. Its Reagans worshippers that did that. I am just pointing out the god of the Republicans and the Relgious Right was not what they pretend he was.

Reagan even signed the law that legalized abortion in California. Pretended later that he didn't forsee the implications. He always talked more conservative than he acted even as President when he was more conservative than as Governor of California.

I voted for Reagan. Twice for President plus once for governor. I still quit the party though.

	26-04-2002 21:18									#76
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quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison 3. Perfect in every possible way

You and Mary Poppins. The only two of your kind.

	26-04-2002 21:19									#77
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*doing the threadjacking dance, doing the threadjacking dance*

Well, since Reganomics was based on a curve written by a half-buzzed man on the back of a cocktail napkin, brought NO benefit to Americans, and was fortunate enough to occur during an oil glut which lowered fuel prices and subsequent inflation, I have to go against Regan.
Plus, Clinton's scandal involved mouthation of the wang, while Regan's involved handing over foreign policy to a bunch of lower echilon people who gave missiles to a country who gives us the cute nickname "Great Satan" for the purpose of circumventing a Congressional ban on money to a brutal guerrila army, it's not a tough choice.
And, to finish off:
SDI
Cut Social Services
Dereg
Tax Cuts
Nancy

	26-04-2002 21:22									#78
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quote: Originally posted by Ethelred You and Mary Poppins. The only two of your kind.

Mary Poppins isn't perfect... she doesn't 'put out'.

	26-04-2002 21:34									#79
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quote: Originally posted by MrBaggins Mary Poppins isn't perfect... she doesn't 'put out'.

Try telling that to the chimney sweeps. What do you think they were so enthralled with her for?

	26-04-2002 21:36									#80
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quote: Originally posted by Ethelred Try telling that to the chimney sweeps. What do you think they were so enthralled with her for?

She was just their drug dealer. What do you think she kept in that handbag?

No way would intercourse happen with all those layers and buttons and hooks. The Victorians were into bondage, socially, in a HUGE way.

	26-04-2002 22:13									#81
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Nationalist ?

Are you aware that while you say you're right-winged in your political opinion, you've been defending purely left-winged ideas in this whole thread ?

Come to the light, man, we'll show you the way

	27-04-2002 19:57									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui quote: True, but does it make sense when you're increasing spending to slash your income by giving staggering tax cuts to the ultra-wealthy? Also had to drag the economy out of recession at the same time.

1981 Tax cuts enacted.
1982 Recession sets in.

You figure out which is the cause and which is the effect.

	27-04-2002 22:10									#83
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Imran :
I bow before your economical fundamentalism and close-mindedness. You believe absolutely in the "scientific theories" liberal economists write, with no reguards for the real world. You seem to think we live under the pure and perfect competition system. That everything decided is a question of percentages, taxes and so on.

Let me give you an example : when Daimler and Chrysler financially merged, they didn't merge their executive staff, their factories and so on ? Why ? Simply because the German and American management methods were different, because it takes time to move a factory from one place to another, because German and American workers were competent at their work etc. It's called concrete reasons. You seem to forget them to focus only on figures. Thus you prove you didn't understand anything to economy, like V. Hayek or Laffer.

	27-04-2002 22:14									#84
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Oh, BTW, about Reagan :
Voted 2 : he's a complete ass, demagogue, he bears responsibility for bring Friedman's dangerous ideas to the world (like Thatcher), promoted fascist dictatorships in the whole world while presenting himself as the hero of the "free world".

He didn't win the cold war, the USSR lost it because of internal problems, mostly economic. The military expenses were a way to counter-balance his catastrophic economic decisions, with a keynesian pump-up.

	27-04-2002 22:15									#85
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quote: Originally posted by Akka le Vil Nationalist ? Are you aware that while you say you're right-winged in your political opinion, you've been defending purely left-winged ideas in this whole thread ? Come to the light, man, we'll show you the way

I'm socially right wing. Economically I'm anti-Socialism, but I don't hold free market Capitalism up as being an unalterable. unquestionable God. I'm for the working man Reaganomics ****ed over my dad (a steelworker) along with millions over other working men. Thanks to him, my family was pushed into welfare for a few years.

	27-04-2002 22:27									#86
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Imran . . . You believe absolutely in the "scientific theories" liberal economists write . . .

Er...if you're calling Imran a liberal, I feel a libel suit coming on.

	27-04-2002 22:30									#87
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quote: Originally posted by Zkribbler Er...if you're calling Imran a liberal, I feel a libel suit coming on.

He's not referring to liberal/conservative, but using economic terms liberal (free-market)/command (Communist) economy. Reagan was a Republican, meaning a political conservative but a economic liberal.

	27-04-2002 22:40									#88
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quote: Originally posted by nationalist He's not referring to liberal/conservative, but using economic terms liberal (free-market)/command (Communist) economy. Reagan was a Republican, meaning a political conservative but a economic liberal.

Whew for a moment there I thought he'd gone mad.

('cept now you're using Reagan and liberal in the same sentence. O my poor brain. )

	27-04-2002 22:48									#89
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Sorry. Here in France, the term "liberal" only refers to economy and the belief in free markets, not to the moralistic position (we opppose "conservatives" to "progressists" then). So, with the French terms, Reagan was ultraliberal and unltraconservative, like Thatcher

	28-04-2002 00:20									#90
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor He didn't win the cold war, the USSR lost it because of internal problems, mostly economic.

You disagree with most people who observed the disintegration of the Soviet bloc.

Just why do you think they fell apart economically at that time? Could it have been that they burned out trying to keep up with American military spending? Could it be that their leadership lost the will to continue in the face of the determination of the West as evidenced by Reagan and Thatcher? Nahh.