12-06-2002 04:15									#1
	Minister (and other governmental staff) Duties Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Well, while waiting for the final result of the poll on what positions we should have at start we might as well start discussing what the different offices shall do.

These are the positions with currently over 50% support
President
Vice-president
Science Advisor
Foreign Advisor
Military Advisor
Trade Advisor
City Planner
Imperial Expansion
Historian
Public Works Minister
Financial Minister


I know that some of this already has been stated in the Constitutional Convention

However, I think it is best to have a thread sole for this, or maybe a thread for each position, and just links to them from here. (That can be decided later). The entries in the Constitutional Convention about these jobs has been moved here. I might have added a few things, but I've not removed anything.

And remember these are just suggestions everything can change. We'll probably have to poll on some of the powers of the advisors anyway, so I decided to keep everything.


I'll post a second post in this threat to have expansion space if needed later.


President
The President shall physically play the game after conducting polls, referring to his advisors, and generally checking with his people. If we are to have turnchats he shall play the game during these chats were instant decisions, which couldn't be planned for, are taken.
Once the turns for a chat are played the president shall send out the save per email to the people authorized to have access to the save. The Historian shall receive saves from the beginning of each turn, but the others shall only get the latest save.

The President shall be granted the power to veto any action that was passed with less than 50% of the vote, so long as the Vice President agrees, and backs him. He may call for a re-vote with a detailed explanation of why he vetoed the action. The veto cannot be overturned, but if the revote yields similar result, the President must go with the will of the people.

The President shall have the power to call for a vote to change our Government type. The vote must pass with a 2/3 majority.

The President also has the power to call for a vote of confidence if he thinks that any minister is working against the empire.


Vice-president
The right hand of the President; in case the President fails to show up for the turnchat the Vice-president shall play the turns instead. He shall then follow the rules for the president. This means that he shall have the latest save.



Science Advisor
The Science Advisor is given the power to choose which advances to research, and which path on the tech tree we travel. He has the power to create polls for all of his powers, but is NOT obligated to FOLLOW them, unless one option gets over 50% of the votes. He has the power to choose on his own what is best for our nation.

The Science Advisor is granted the power to offer/accept deals regarding the exchange of Technology.

The Science Advisor needs to work closely with the other ministers to be able to do what is bet for out nation. He needs to come to an understanding with the finance and trade advisor to get a tech rate that suits the empire. He also needs to work with ministers who want certain technologies for their duties.



Foreign Advisor
The Foreign Advisor manages all the treaties of our game.

The Foreign Advisor is granted the power to make/accept peace, declare war, offer/accept Mutual Protection Pacts, offer/accept Right of Passage Agreements, and offer/accept Military Alliances.

For gifts in treaties the appropriate ministers shall be consulted.



Military Advisor
The Military Advisor is in charge of all military planning.

The Military Advisor is granted the power to make polls on the # of cities dedicated to making military units.

The Military Advisor is granted the power to set up the army's strategy. He tells what troops to move where, and which battles to engage.

The Military Advisor is granted the power to request that the Foreign Minister Demand Tribute from an enemy civ.

The Military Advisor is granted the power to take part in the Negotiation of any Trade including the signing of a Peace Treaty, Mutual Protection Pact, or a Right of Passage agreement. (Foreign Advisor calls the shots, but the Military Advisor must have his voice heard)

The Military Advisor can request the Public Works minister to build fortresses in war-zones, as well as roads and rail roads up to the war-zone.

It’s in the duty of the Military Advisor to protect all the Workers that our Nation posses, both captured and trained. The Advisor must also maintain the security for Settlers sent out by the Imperial expansion minister as well as provide over sea transports for non-military units if requested. These obligation are also involving protection of great leaders.

The Military Advisor is also responsibly for the protection of our borders and cities from invasions.

The Military advisor has the power to request a city to draft citizens. However, this has to be done in agreement with the City Planner.

The Military advisor shall have the power to call for a vote to change of Mobilization. The vote must pass with a 2/3 or 50% majority. - POLL Now



Trade Advisor
The Trade Advisor manages all international trade.

The Trade Advisor is granted the power to make/accept Trade Embargos.

The Trade Advisor is granted the power to offer/accept deals regarding the exchange of luxury or strategic resources.

The Trade Advisor may request the Public Works minister to connect cities to the trade network as well as to new resources and to international trade networks.

The trade advisor may request the City Planner to create Harbours and Airports for connections to the trade network. These requests are limited to one per local network not over other civs territories.

(NOTE: The Science Advisor and the Trade Advisor both play a role in Diplomacy. The Science Advisor would have to say "I allow you to trade Nationalism at free will", if the Trade Advisor wanted to trade Nationalism for Dyes) Shall we amend this?



City Planner
The City Planner is in charge of controlling the cities under our control.

The City Planner has the power to control Building Queues and manage the citizens in the Cities.

The City Planner may request the Public Works minister to improve the city tiles.

The City Planner may request the Trade Advisor to connect the city to the trade network.



Imperial Expansion Minister
The Imperial Expansion Minister is in charge of placing new cities.

The Imperial Expansion Minister may request the City Planner to build Settlers in certain Areas.



Historian
The Historian logs everything that happens to our nation.

The Historian has no power to control anything, and is the only governmental post not allowed to vote in governmental polls.

The Historian may request detailed information on certain things from the President, and shall be granted access to one save per turn.



Public Works minister
The Public Works Minister is in charge of all Workers in our empire.

The Public Works Minister has the power to assign workers to different projects.

The Public Works Minister may request workers to be produced.

The Public Works Minister has the power to decide whether to keep slave workers or join them with cities.



Financial Minister
The Financial Minister has the power to control the budget of our civ. That involves assigning Income for science, trade and luxury. It also involves making the maintenance payable in all cities.

The Financial Minister has the power to create a budget surplus or budget deficit when the treasury requires or allows it.

The Financial Minister has the power to request financial improvements to be built in cities were they would mean an earning with at least five gold per turn after the maintenance for them are paid.

The Financial Minister also has the Power to regret any more Buildings/Units if the economy can’t handle it. In such cases the game shall halt and the high council shall take a log at the economy together to be able to solve the situation, or decide what to cut down on. Units needed for the safety of the cities may not be regretted.

Last edited by Gramphos on 13-06-2002 at 03:53

	12-06-2002 04:18									#2
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---Expansion Space---

	12-06-2002 04:33									#3
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Thanks for such a great summary.
I'm sure both n00bs and oldbs will appreciate it.

	12-06-2002 04:37									#4
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quote: Originally posted by Trip Thanks for such a great summary. I'm sure both n00bs and oldbs will appreciate it.

@ "oldbs"

	12-06-2002 04:40									#5
	Increase Your PM Length

Now we only need to gfet some discussion. I myself is a little concerned about

quote: He has the power to create polls for all of his powers, but is NOT obligated to FOLLOW them

	12-06-2002 04:44									#6
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youre talking about my proposal for science advisor...

i believe that if a tech votes comes out, and the winner only comes out with 30%, it wasnt really that "clear cut" of a descision, and the science advisor should have discression over what our empire really needs.

it's like the electoral college system in the USA, the state legislators don't HAVE to vote according to their people, but they always do anyway.

if the people make a gross error (ie diving for mapmaking on a huge pangea), the science advisor should be able to rectify it

	12-06-2002 04:47									#7
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Well, the way it is witten it might be abused. I however added a condition to that one wile proting it tho this thread... Still I don't know if it's safe enough.

	12-06-2002 04:51									#8
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Complete and clear, I love it

	12-06-2002 05:51									#9
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Perhaps this is obvious, but I think all ministers should begin a thread entitled '(Insert position here) Department - Term (whatever)' at the beginning of each term.

	12-06-2002 06:12									#10
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Punkbass :
Sorry, I didn't understand. Could you explain it gurtger plz ?

	12-06-2002 06:18									#11
	Tired of ads?

science advisor should have almost all control over tech deals, unless the foreign/trade minister disagrees. Similarly, the trade guy can make a deal giving a tech for a lux if the science guy doesnt mind.

On the other hand, if the people vote to do it, shouldnt it happen no matter what (except in a few rare previoulsy mentioned cases)?

	12-06-2002 06:40									#12
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Thanks to Mark for topping the threads!

	12-06-2002 06:41									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor Punkbass : Sorry, I didn't understand. Could you explain it gurtger plz ?

I meant that every term, the minister of every department should start a thread for their department.

	12-06-2002 07:33									#14
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Considering that the financial minister is out for the time being I think his duties should fall to the VP.

I don't have a problem with any of the descriptions in there at this time; but I think that failure to do these duties should only be met with punishment at the ballot box.

I also think that a minister can only be removed (before his term is over) via impeachment, which will require a two thirds vote from the populous.

	12-06-2002 07:36									#15
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quote: The President also has the power to call for a vote of confidence if he thinks that any minister is working against the empire.

That basically sums things up.
If anyone recommends someone be removed, I'll review their concern, and if I agree I'll set up a poll.

	12-06-2002 07:53									#16
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Crap figures that I miss the one point that I disagree with. Now that I think about it more, only the president should be subject to impeachment; because if he is protecting an unpopular minister, he could be impeached.

	12-06-2002 08:15									#17
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Of course, the President is always subject to public impeachment.

	12-06-2002 15:09									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Moral Hazard Considering that the financial minister is out for the time being I think his duties should fall to the VP.

He has 55.77% support at the time being. How can he be out?

	12-06-2002 18:09									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Gramphos He has 55.77% support at the time being. How can he be out?

Uber didn't put that position in the Campaign thread for whatever reason....

so there were no canidates.

	12-06-2002 18:50									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Trip Uber didn't put that position in the Campaign thread for whatever reason.... so there were no canidates.

That's Uber's way of overruling democratic desicions.

	12-06-2002 18:57									#21
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Well, you can't overrule a vote, at least as long as I'm President.

	12-06-2002 20:42									#22
	Suffering from ads?

I'll run for finance minister, if the majority of our members voted for finance minister such a position should be created

	13-06-2002 01:59									#23
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

What I meant by out was there was nobody in the position. Therefore it was vacant, hence the position should be run by the VP during the interem. But if Atawa wants the job.

	13-06-2002 02:50									#24
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I think that no one should have the ability to ignore a poll and make an independent decision, unless the poll is exactly tied AND it would be extremely difficult to repoll. Even if ignoring a poll will get one impeached, it shouldn't be allowed in the first place. Polls are sacred. Polls are god. We must worship polls. If we don't, it's not a Democracy Game anymore, it's a U.S. Government Game, and NO ONE wants that.

	13-06-2002 02:54									#25
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The Military advisor shall have the power to call for a vote to change of Mobilization. The vote must pass with a 2/3 majority.

I would like this ammended to 50%

	13-06-2002 03:05									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Moral Hazard The Military advisor shall have the power to call for a vote to change of Mobilization. The vote must pass with a 2/3 majority. I would like this ammended to 50%

Agreed, same here. Change it, would ya Gramphos? It's not officially been adopted yet, so it doesn't need to be officially amended yet.

	13-06-2002 03:05									#27
	Tired of ads?

This is an excerpt from my proposed constitution (note that I am not actually in favor of a constitution and I am a member of the 3A2C3, I'm just posting this for the ideas):

Article 5: Tasks that require special authorization

Section 1: Declaring War

To declare war on another country there must be a poll in which at least 20 people vote and at least 60% of the votes are for war.

Section 2: Negotiating Peace

To negotiate peace there must be a poll in which at least fifteen people vote and at least 60% of the votes are for attempting to negotiate peace. Decisions on specific deals during negotiations will be made during the turn chat.

Section 3: Wonder Construction

To begin construction of a wonder there must be a poll in which at least ten people vote and the wonder with a simple plurality will win. There must be a second poll regarding at which city the wonder should be constructed, but this poll is a normal poll.

Section 4: Nuclear Weapons

To use nuclear weapons, for the first time there must be a poll in which at least 25 people vote and at least 75% of the votes are for using nukes. Each subsequent use only requires 15 voters and at least 60% of the votes. If we are nuked first then the first authorization is bypassed and authorization is the same as subsequent nukes. If the decision must be made during the turn chat, authorization will be given by rules determined during the chat.

	13-06-2002 03:06									#28
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Don't you think there ought to be more than 20 people? What if the community goes over, say, 1,000 people? You should change it to 50% of the people (which should be all polls).

	13-06-2002 03:23									#29
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Maybe 50% is too much, as some poeple will participate in the early game and will forget it later. I think 25-30% is more reasonable.
I also think 60% majority fr mobilization is needed, because it's not easy to come back on the decision.

	13-06-2002 03:28									#30
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by Trip Agreed, same here. Change it, would ya Gramphos? It's not officially been adopted yet, so it doesn't need to be officially amended yet.

I'll do a POLL on it.