13-06-2002 03:06									#31
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by Stefu Democracy... ..but it's the best we've invented so far.

no it ain't!

	13-06-2002 03:07									#32
	Put an end to popups!

Worst poll ever!

	13-06-2002 03:17									#33
	Support Apolyton

Oh no! Imran and EuroWiggy agree with me! This demolishes my EuroCom cred!

*backpedal backpedal backpedal*

I was wrong! Best kind of revolution is one where self-appointed representatives of people con illiterate poor into forcing the aforementioned self-appointed representatives of people to become new rulers at gunpoint, so SAROP can start their policy of recreational oppression, social engineering of Chernobyl level and ethnic anti-running dog genocide which might incidentally target few target ethnic groups most seeped with running-doggery! Yep, that's the ticket!

*frontpedal frontpedal frontpedal*

Naaah.

	13-06-2002 04:53									#34
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, Thomas Payne, Benjamin Franklin and George Washington.

	13-06-2002 05:06									#35
	Increase Your PM Length

I agree with Dr. Strangelove

	13-06-2002 05:24									#36
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Buenaventura Durruti, Benjamin Tucker and all the other American Libertarian Socialists of the late 19th century, and the Haymarket Martyrs.

	13-06-2002 05:33									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Ron Popeil, everything he amkes is "revolutionary."

	13-06-2002 05:39									#38
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Even though the Haitian Revolution resulted in genocide? All the French were killed.

Right -- it was the slaves' fault that those Frenchie bastards would not give up the island peacefully.


But seriously, you are right -- the Hatian Revolution was one of the more violent revolutions in the Western Hemisphere.
But still it was successful -- and can you really call it genocide?
Are you certain there were no French civilians who were allowed to remain on the island under the new government?

	13-06-2002 05:50									#39
	Increase the size of your Attachments

MrFun:

Successful?! And why is Haiti the poorest nation in the western hemisphere? L'Overture died and no one was left to unite the haitians. And jefferson, fearing the expansion of slave revolts into the South, and wanting better relations with Napoleon, promised he would not aid the Haitians so in the end, the slave revolt was not particularily successful.

And what you think of Bobby Seale and Huey Newton?


thanks

	13-06-2002 05:53									#40
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer MrFun: Successful?! And why is Haiti the poorest nation in the western hemisphere? L'Overture died and no one was left to unite the haitians. And jefferson, fearing the expansion of slave revolts into the South, and wanting better relations with Napoleon, promised he would not aid the Haitians so in the end, the slave revolt was not particularily successful. And what you think of Bobby Seale and Huey Newton? thanks

The Haitian Revolution was initially successful, in that this was the first successful slave revolt in the Western Hemisphere.
I do not deny that later, Haiti's economy went for the dumps.


As for the Black Panthers -- they helped establish free lunches at the schools in their communities, helped monitor abusive police activity, among other things.

In some aspects, the Black Panthers made positive contributions.

	13-06-2002 05:57									#41
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Yes, I would also include the Panthers in my list, although I disagree with their aim of state socialism

	13-06-2002 06:02									#42
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

sparkplug:

To get support from the Left. In the Chicago Democratic convention, the panthers found themselves with hippies and communists and though they despised these people (rich whiteys saying free sex is good... nowhere near the panther's idealogy), they had a rough union just to fight the status quo. Socialism was most likely not of concern to the panthers, but they wanted some sort of alliance with somebody...

	13-06-2002 06:03									#43
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

why'd you edit your question out?

	13-06-2002 06:13									#44
	Got spare money?

The Friends of Durrutti, Le CNT, the Haymarket Martyrs, the Zapatistas, the Paris Communards, etc.

quote: For instance, I also greatly admire the Haitian Revolution against slavery and French rule in early 19th century.

Toussaint L'Overture was a feudalistic bastard who supported a system not much better than slavery.

quote: And why is Haiti the poorest nation in the western hemisphere?

Probably has to do with the fact that we've ****ed up their country so badly.

	13-06-2002 06:14									#45
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Adalbertus Monteverdi - The only musical revolutioner who mastered the old style better than most of the others.

Bah. Beethoven was more of a revolutionary, and he certainly mastered the old style. Wagner, too.

	13-06-2002 06:29									#46
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Thomas Jefferson, John Adams, Thomas Payne, Benjamin Franklin and George Washington.

I finally tend to be persuaded that Americans are being brainwashed to believe that the only revolutionaries that ever existed have been these bunch of people. All the rest are just terrorists.

Oh no, I forgot, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo and Princess Leia are also considered revolutionaries in the United States (though not on par with the founding fathers)...

As for revolutionaries, if they fight for social progress, then they all have my sympathy. However, a special mention must go to citizen Grachus Babeuf who in 1795, was arrested and executed for pointing out that the French Revolution would be incomplete without the abolition of private property. He was the first communist of our times and he inspired many revolutionaries that followed him in 1830, 1848 and later.

	13-06-2002 06:29									#47
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer why'd you edit your question out?

Because I thought of the answer seconds after I posted the question. Smart I am. Yup.

	13-06-2002 06:31									#48
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Okay, having actually thought about the answer I'll have to say that the Khmer Rouge and Sendero Luminoso are not among those revolutionaries that I respect.

Mmmmm

Shining Path. So freaking crazy.

	13-06-2002 06:33									#49
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Stefu Oh no! Imran and EuroWiggy agree with me! This demolishes my EuroCom cred! *backpedal backpedal backpedal* I was wrong! Best kind of revolution is one where self-appointed representatives of people con illiterate poor into forcing the aforementioned self-appointed representatives of people to become new rulers at gunpoint, so SAROP can start their policy of recreational oppression, social engineering of Chernobyl level and ethnic anti-running dog genocide which might incidentally target few target ethnic groups most seeped with running-doggery! Yep, that's the ticket! *frontpedal frontpedal frontpedal* Naaah.

I'm more of a Eurocom than you've ever been...

	13-06-2002 06:33									#50
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

The Gracchi brothers

	13-06-2002 06:35									#51
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Here's a new one Joseph Smith.

	13-06-2002 07:00									#52
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by sparkplug Benjamin Tucker

Wow, never thought I'd see another Tuckerite on poly

quote: The Friends of Durrutti

bit too radical for me, prefer the more moderate and less thuggish elements of CNT...

	13-06-2002 07:04									#53
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I bet you 10Euro that he will be mentioning Nestor Machno next...

	13-06-2002 07:08									#54
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by axi I finally tend to be persuaded that Americans are being brainwashed to believe that the only revolutionaries that ever existed have been these bunch of people. All the rest are just terrorists. Oh no, I forgot, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo and Princess Leia are also considered revolutionaries in the United States (though not on par with the founding fathers)... As for revolutionaries, if they fight for social progress, then they all have my sympathy. However, a special mention must go to citizen Grachus Babeuf who in 1795, was arrested and executed for pointing out that the French Revolution would be incomplete without the abolition of private property. He was the first communist of our times and he inspired many revolutionaries that followed him in 1830, 1848 and later.

Isn't your entire statement biased? Only one person mentioned them. Are they not revolutionaries? Must he have listed several other revolutionaries along with these people? What about the people who listed other revolutionaries? Must they mention Grachus Babeuf as well or be labelled ignorant nationalists?

Frankly, your statement was way out of line. It doesn't demonstrate anything wrong with Americans, rather it demonstrates something it wrong with you. If you need to express your feelings about another nation, please do it in a civilized manner and in the appropriate place. Unsubstantiated and biased accusations are no way to get your point across.

	13-06-2002 07:23									#55
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Ray Kroc.
Akio Morita.
Charles Merrill.

	13-06-2002 07:54									#56
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Boshko Wow, never thought I'd see another Tuckerite on poly

That's not surprising, since Tuckerite anarchism is almost extinct today. Unless you include the 'anarcho'-capitalists adoption of American Individualist radicalism, which is quite silly, because Tucker was very anti capitalist.

	13-06-2002 08:28									#57
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Unless you include the 'anarcho'-capitalists adoption of American Individualist radicalism, which is quite silly, because Tucker was very anti capitalist.

Yes, I was pretty confused by berzerker (one of our resident anarcho-capitalists) liking him, having them like Spooner makes at least some sense though...
And next semester I'm in a communist/anarchist theory class and all the anarchist reading is by social anarchists, will have to do my bit to set people straight

	13-06-2002 08:33									#58
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Jose de San Martin.

Oliver Cromwell.

	13-06-2002 08:56									#59
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

"Oliver Cromwell"

Wow! I didn't know El Awrence would be one to support religious fundamentalists and those who comitt genocide!

	13-06-2002 08:58									#60
	Get a bigger avatar today!

If you become a Protestant then you have to think of Cromwell as a good guy...