06-08-2002 21:14									#61
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drake, well.. at the time of war, the country is having hard time, exceptional time, and everyone must pull very hard together to work it. It's exceptional time, so there are exceptinoal rules. I don't believe it's cool to execute someone because of deserting. Only in cases of shooting own people at purpose if not mentally ill (Yeah, and who's not in those situations) or massacring innocent civilians (enemys) or maybe bad bad treason like giving absolutly essential information to the enemy.

It's exceptional times, and it's the matter of surviving or destruction for many countries, maybe this doesn't include to big powers. So in the matter of surviving, everyone must blend to the mold, to fight the enemy, to survive. No exceptions.
And that's when you're being invaded, not attacking even if it's for own defense.

	06-08-2002 21:20									#62
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as a sidenote I must add, that it wouldn't include enemy soldiers. They could be imprisoned, but after war returned, and let them deside what they want to do.
Only own people, in extreme cases.

But this doesn't mean I like it very much. It means I would accept it. If there would be no law of possible death penalties at war time, that would be much better.

	06-08-2002 21:21									#63
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quote: Originally posted by FlameFlash You give a criminal a shovel and force him/her to dig a hole big enough for them to sit in and lay in (think digging your own grave.) ...

IIRC, that's how gaols used to work in some places--you dug your own prison. (Rather than have the prisoner dig a hole too deep to climb out of, though, the prisoner was instead given a limited amount of time in which to dig his/her hole, after which the gaol had bars put over it to prevent escape. The prisoner would want to dig as deep a hole as possible, though, in order to prevent drowning when it rained into his/her gaol.)

	06-08-2002 21:41									#64
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I like that too loinburger.

	06-08-2002 22:07									#65
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The death penalty certainly does act as a deterent to a great many, but not all, people. You can't take the minority of people, to whom the death penalty didn't act as a deterent, and extrapolate "see it doesn't work". What about silent cases you never hear about because the killer decids not to comite homicide?

	06-08-2002 23:01									#66
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Yes, I too laugh at people that think the have God's all knowing sight and can say that it has never been a deterrent for ANYONE. Especially with documented statements by prisoners that used plastic guns in robberies to avoid stiffer sentences including the DP. It's just a standard line people use to justify their position. THEY CAN"T POSSIBLY KNOW. Especially those that throw out non relevant statistics. Statistics don't measure a man's soul.

	06-08-2002 23:11									#67
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I'm for death penalty for suicide bombers

	07-08-2002 00:16									#68
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quote: Originally posted by drake I thought they exchanged recipes and sewed together.....and played parcheesi

Damn! You got to this one before I could...

	07-08-2002 00:19									#69
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quote: Originally posted by Q Cubed i am against the death penalty in the case of humans. in animals, i don't think it makes a whit of difference. that said: i don't think many on earth right now qualifes as "human". a human being is intelligent, using reason, logic, and emotion in a manner which allows it to grow and learn from past mistakes, assimilate new knowledge by observation, and can retain that information for future use. until humans can show that they learn from past mistakes, there will always be a death penalty, whether or not it seems just or fair. on a species-wide level, humans haven't shown that they learn from past mistakes. humans haven't proven that they are any better than animals. you have idiotic animals who don't realize that a suicide bomber killing innocent youth leads to an advanced tank crushing more children leading to yet another suicide bomber, ad infinitum. i don't like the death penalty. the sanctity of human life is among the highest and most treasured things in existence. i just don't think many of us qualify for such consideration.

*stands up to applaude*

	07-08-2002 00:31									#70
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quote: Originally posted by Zkribbler Against. If there were any credible evidence that the death penalty served as a deterrent, I would support it. But there is none. Indeed, I have concluded the death penalty probably encourages murder. When society kills someone with premeditation, this act sends a message that killing can be justified. Thus, members of the populous, when faced with a problem, are increasingly likely to turn to letal force as a solution. The U.S. is the only industrialized nation to still have the death penalty. The U.S. also has the highest murder rate of any industrialized nation. It's clear that something in the U.S. legal system is not working. One final note: The vast majority of murderers are not Mafia hit men or even criminals. They're citizens who get liquored up and, in a fit of anger & stupidity, take out an annoying spouse or some poor bastard living down the block. Most of the above posts seem oblivious to this fact.

I believe the reason why the US has the highest murder rate has very little if anything to do with our legal sytem (and if it did, it would have probably nothing to do with the DP). The reason why our crime is so high is for many factors. Our huge diversity of race, religion, politics, etc, although contribut vastly to our culture, it creates conflicts where crime is more likely. Also, US has lost much of its 'family values'that rear children on ethics and morals. And then you have this liberal (im not a conservative) bullsh1t on child rearing, about 'letting them discover themselves" and 'dont yell at young children, it could scar them for life' sh1t like that. Please, I was never spanked as a child, but I had the **** screamed out of me many a time - and I think I turned out alright, my most major offense being sneaking candy into a movie theater. These are just a few of the many, many factors of the US' crime problem.
Im telling you, corporal punishment would change that in just a matter of years. But then you'll have people cryong that its 'cruel and unusal'. Please.I bet once you get mugged or raped on a city street, you would change your toon...

Kman

	07-08-2002 00:45									#71
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I am completely for Captial Punishment. Execution is the only answer for some crimes. For example, the man arrested for raping and murdering the five year old in California, if guilty of the crime, deserves death. Life imprisonment is too kind for him. He has taken the right to live away from that girl. Now his right to live must be taken away.

	07-08-2002 00:46									#72
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Corporal punishment

	07-08-2002 01:12									#73
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quote: Originally posted by Theben

THEBEN SIGHTING!!!!!!!!!


Call me, you putz!

	07-08-2002 01:28									#74
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Against death penalty because innocents are being killed.

Besides life imprisonment is far more suffering.

	07-08-2002 01:31									#75
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quote: Originally posted by nationalist I am completely for Captial Punishment. Execution is the only answer for some crimes. For example, the man arrested for raping and murdering the five year old in California, if guilty of the crime, deserves death. Life imprisonment is too kind for him. He has taken the right to live away from that girl. Now his right to live must be taken away.

*sniffle*
*tear*
That is too true... such bastards are probably deserving of torture. Death is a cake walk compared to what I would do if put in a room with a sicko like that...

	07-08-2002 01:40									#76
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 Against death penalty because innocents are being killed.

Sad, but true for now. But as racism, in the US at least, becomes more and more a thing of the past, and new technologie such as DNA testing become more and more practiced, then falsely accused people should be almost 100% exonerated. Many peope do spend around 20 years on death row after all, giving them much time for appeals for either innocence or a lesser punishment.

quote: Besides life imprisonment is far more suffering.

Maybe in Greece, but in US prisons the only worries they have are getting raped by other prisoners, and occasionally being murdered by rival gangs. And most like the thrill of conflict to keep them entertained while slugging through their sentence.
Truth is, prison isnt that bad here. If they restricted freedoms more than they do, then maybe the case for a more suffering punishment would be true. But the DP still has the psychological deterant, every human has the instinct to survive hardwired into their brain, everyody wants to live - with very few exceptions. For this reason the DP prevents many murders. Not all mind you, there are those who dont want to live anymore, but they usually kill themselves after murding however, usually an estranged spouse or something.

Kman

	07-08-2002 02:19									#77
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I dont think you will ever and under all circumstances be certain that no inoccent will be convicted.

Prisons in Greece are actually now overcroweded since the influx of immigrants started. 1/3 of prison's population are immigrants...

murderes which escape for the prisons of albania come here are caught and are thrown again in prison after their sentence they are deported.

BTW i think that the threat of being awqarded a DP doesn deter a criminal. he is confrotnted with possible death every step of his "career" anyway. he keeps on doing it anyway.

	07-08-2002 02:26									#78
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quote: BTW i think that the threat of being awqarded a DP doesn deter a criminal. he is confrotnted with possible death every step of his "career" anyway. he keeps on doing it anyway.

So a man who rapes and murders little girls faces death everyday?
"Look out Joe! That girls packing heat!". I dont think so. If you were refering to death from police chasing them, the US police departments have strict 'can not fire unless in iminenant danger' type protocalls. Therefore the vast majority of accused murderers are arrested and not shot (which is good, because many end up inocent in court). Besides, like someone said earlier, what about all the silent cases, in which there were no murders because someone was afraid of being caugt and put to death? We never hear about those because 1) there was no murder, and 2) no one is going to say they were going to murder someone.

Kman

	07-08-2002 02:27									#79
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Against. We killed far too many innocent or insufficiently culpable people when we had it, and I doubt Britain was/is the only country who did so.

	07-08-2002 02:30									#80
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Kramer, well we dont have these sort of violent crimes with little children here. one every decade or so.

im talking about the criminal which robs etc

besides life incarceration is more humbling to the mind than death, i bet those people think that.

	07-08-2002 02:33									#81
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quote: Originally posted by Kramerman Maybe in Greece, but in US prisons the only worries they have are getting raped by other prisoners, and occasionally being murdered by rival gangs. And most like the thrill of conflict to keep them entertained while slugging through their sentence.

Did you keep a straight face while you typed that out?

	07-08-2002 02:33									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Ron Jeremy Against. We killed far too many innocent or insufficiently culpable people when we had it, and I doubt Britain was/is the only country who did so.

Thats why people should only be put to death when the evidence shows that htey are guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt. Servalance camera tapes, multiple eyewitness account (which are notoriously inaccurate), hair and blood matches, dna matches, motive, written confession, etc, placing someone as murderer, is sufficient for me to put him to death. What is equally disturbing to me as people who ar innocent and punished (either sent to jail or death row) are those who are guilty and get away. Dont get me started on OJ Simpson. I dunno if any of yall outide America know about that load of horse sh1t...

Kman

	07-08-2002 02:34									#83
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P22, They don't get the DP in the US, that's reserved for the more violent crimes.

	07-08-2002 02:35									#84
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quote: Originally posted by Kramerman That is too true... such bastards are probably deserving of torture. Death is a cake walk compared to what I would do if put in a room with a sicko like that...

You are the kind of people this world needs to be protected from.

	07-08-2002 02:39									#85
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 Kramer, well we dont have these sort of violent crimes with little children here. one every decade or so. im talking about the criminal which robs etc besides life incarceration is more humbling to the mind than death, i bet those people think that.

In th US, only those who murder (and not just any murderr, but like in the 1st degree and premeditated and all that stuff), convicted of treason, and stuff like that are even allowed to be ellegable to be put to death. So even alot of murderers dont get it, and in some cases thats good. Like a wife who has been domestically abused all her life kills her husband, though not through self defense, would probably get life in prison with the possibilty of parole too.

Kman

	07-08-2002 02:40									#86
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara You are the kind of people this world needs to be protected from.

Why Che, because he is outraged that a man would kidnap, rape, and murder a 5 year old girl? What would you do? Give the rapist/pedophile/murderer a stern talking to and send him to his room without supper, only to give him a hug 5 minutes later and tell him that the workers still love him? Its time for you to get real, Che.

	07-08-2002 02:44									#87
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara You are the kind of people this world needs to be protected from.

OK. Very well. We will see if you have that opinion after your daugter gets raped and murdered. Im quite sure you would want to rough the guy up abit. If you dont have the desire to do so, then I would question your devotion to your child. Put yourself in her shoes for a moment, as a brute makes her feel helpless and lower than dirt as he has his way with her. And then once hes through, he kills her by whatever means. Think about that, though you probably wopuld never be able to understand.

	07-08-2002 02:45									#88
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quote: Originally posted by nationalist Why Che, because he is outraged that a man would kidnap, rape, and murder a 5 year old girl? What would you do? Give the rapist/pedophile/murderer a stern talking to and send him to his room without supper, only to give him a hug 5 minutes later and tell him that the workers still love him? Its time for you to get real, Che.

Thank you. My point exactly.

	07-08-2002 02:59									#89
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quote: Originally posted by Kramerman OK. Very well. We will see if you have that opinion after your daugter gets raped and murdered.

Why, was your little girl raped and murdered? How I might feel about a person who injured me directly, and about a person who has not affected my in any way are two different things.

The sad fact is, you are almost as disgusting a person, because you enjoy the thought of committing torture. You rationalize it away by claiming that these are unworthy people, but the fact is, if you can torture them, you can torture anyone. You're ****ing sick. The world needs to be protected from sick ****s like you.

	07-08-2002 03:03									#90
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I agree with che.

But I think that Kramer was just venting anger.