09-08-2002 19:35									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Kropotkin That just proves his point rah...

Exactly, it proves that we can build pyramids, and that we wouldnt build one thats useless. This one happens to be a beautiful hotel and casino.

	09-08-2002 19:36									#32
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Also, saying "I think..." does not a fact make.

	09-08-2002 19:38									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Kropotkin That just proves his point rah...

I posted that just to show that someone must have had some motivation.

RAH

	09-08-2002 19:39									#34
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quote: Originally posted by rah I posted that just to show that someone must have had some motivation. RAH

I was referring to someone having the motivation to build pyramids exactly the same as the ones in egypt.

	09-08-2002 19:40									#35
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Cali: Your opinions of what's beautiful should really led to you being taken to the back of a building and shoot in the head but I guess you can get away with it this time...

	09-08-2002 19:41									#36
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You guys don't really understand the point I make.
I'm not saying it's all true, all I try to say is that these guys were pretty smart.

You guys changed the subject to: How stupid is CyberShy.
That's fine, but don't lose the original "How smart were the builders of the pyramids".

I'll admit that I can't build a pyramid, thus I'm pretty dumb compared to them. Thanks for proving that point.

rah: That's not a pyramid like the ones in Egypt. Of course we can build 'modern' pyramids.

And indeed, I'm sure that 'everything' I find on the net won't be right.

Again: I don't take a position in this discussion. I just start it. Now stop the "I'm wiser and mightier and omnipontenter than CyberShy" crap, and talk about the pyramids.

thanks

	09-08-2002 19:44									#37
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy rah: That's not a pyramid like the ones in Egypt. Of course we can build 'modern' pyramids.

If we took this one back in time, I'm sure they'd be more impressed with ours than their's.

Back to the point. Yes these people knew what they were doing. (regardless of the outcome of the location debate)

	09-08-2002 19:44									#38
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Btw, this site ( http://www.virtual-egypt.com/newhtml/tableofevents.html ) has the Cheops pyramids being built around 2,600 BCE, 600 years after the earlier quoted source, but still 600 years before the Hebrews came to Egypt (and 500 years before the birth of Abraham). So, regardless, the fact remains that the Egyptians did NOT measure out the pyramids in "els".

	09-08-2002 19:45									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Kropotkin Cali: Your opinions of what's beautiful should really led to you being taken to the back of a building and shoot in the head but I guess you can get away with it this time...

Obviously you have a problem with the morality of a hotel/casino, but it doesnt change the fact that the structure is beautiful.

	09-08-2002 19:45									#40
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quote: Then it would have to be nearer to the equator.

You should say so indeed.
But pherhaps there's more distance from Sout-America to the south pole than from Scandinavia to the North pole.

quote: It passes over the Mediteranean so its wrong. If water counts then the Americas go farther north and farther south. If water stops the projection than its still wrong.

straight? I think South America is leaning more to the east than North America.

quote: And you believer EVERYTHING you see on the internet dodn't you?

Did I say I believed it?

quote: Uhg. Boy that makes no sense. Stonehenge is in England. The stones aren't perfect in anyway whatsoever.

that remark wasn't made about stonehenge.
And yes, it's in england (and in israel)
(Like the pyramids are in egypt, and in Sout America) (in a different form though)

that makes it even......... more mystrious

	09-08-2002 19:47									#41
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quote: So, regardless, the fact remains that the Egyptians did NOT measure out the pyramids in "els".

Are the hebrews the originators of the el?
I think it's more likely that the hebrews got it from the superior civilization in those days......

	09-08-2002 19:47									#42
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy Again: I don't take a position in this discussion. I just start it. Now stop the "I'm wiser and mightier and omnipontenter than CyberShy" crap, and talk about the pyramids.

You took the position that the builders of the pyramids must have been smarter than us, and asserted (without evidence) that we dont have the technical know-how to reproduce these structures.

In both cases youre wrong.

	09-08-2002 19:50									#43
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quote: what would be your center?

well, you're basing the idea that the pyramids are at the center on the notion that the international date line cleaves west and east.

could we just not make the same assumption with, say, the prime meridian? if that were so, the center of landmass would naturally be different.

or say we picked 45 west? again, the center of landmass would be different.

	09-08-2002 19:50									#44
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ok, that's right.

Pherhaps they mean, compared to the knowledge we have. Could we do it under the same circumstanses?
But in fact I don't even care if we could build it.

More important is, if they were that smart, why did they only build pyramids, why did we lose much of their inteligence / knowledge, and HOW smart were they actually?

	09-08-2002 19:53									#45
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quote: well, you're basing the notion that the pyramids are at the center on the notion that the international date line cleaves west and east.

Well, and since about everybody thinks that THAT's the best position for the date-line, I think everybody thinks that the location of the pyramids will be there as well.

We *could* have chosen another date-line, but we didn't. Seems like most people will agree. And indeed, of course in fact earth has no center. (oh well, it does, but not on the surface).

But if you have to pick a center, most people (except you) would chose THAT center.

Now you could claim of course that those egyptians were stupid for chosing that center. I think it's pretty smart for people that obviously didn't knew the shape of the entire world............

	09-08-2002 19:55									#46
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy More important is, if they were that smart, why did they only build pyramids, why did we lose much of their inteligence / knowledge, and HOW smart were they actually?

They were smart enough engineers and slavers to build them, but not smart enough to realise what a waste they were.

	09-08-2002 20:02									#47
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quote: They were smart enough engineers and slavers to build them, but not smart enough to realise what a waste they were.

in the long term, everything is waste.
Pherhaps they understood that better than we do.

	09-08-2002 20:03									#48
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Cybershy, what are you posting? You're posting a few humble facts about it. I have read really a lot about the Egypt, and know quite something about the Pyramids, too. It's clear that they were either built by Atlants, or by Egyptians taught by the Atlants.

Among the books I recommend on the subject: Graham Hancock, Robert Bauval. Keeper of Genesis.

	09-08-2002 20:03									#49
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy Again: I don't take a position in this discussion. I just start it. Now stop the "I'm wiser and mightier and omnipontenter than CyberShy" crap, and talk about the pyramids. thanks

Sure you took a position. You took the position that it wasn't obvious that the Egyptians did it. Indeed you clearly implied that they couldn't have. More like said outright.

	09-08-2002 20:05									#50
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quote: Well, and since about everybody thinks that THAT's the best position for the date-line, I think everybody thinks that the location of the pyramids will be there as well.

actually, it was chosen more or less without the consent of anybody outside of europe in the beginning...

quote: But if you have to pick a center, most people (except you) would chose THAT center. Now you could claim of course that those egyptians were stupid for chosing that center. I think it's pretty smart for people that obviously didn't knew the shape of the entire world............

why would i claim that? all i'm saying is that sure, that's pretty neat, but i think it's more a coincidence than anything, seeing as that the idl didn't come into existence until a few thousand years later... and would have ended up in the atlantic had the balance of power gone to asia rather than europe when all those things like that were being decided...

	09-08-2002 20:06									#51
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy in the long term, everything is waste. Pherhaps they understood that better than we do.

If they understood that better than we do, then why did they waste so much of their resources on the pyramids.

	09-08-2002 20:08									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Caligastia They were smart enough engineers and slavers to build them, but not smart enough to realise what a waste they were.

And once again (what is it that makes people unable to read nowadays?): the pyramids were NOT build by slaves

	09-08-2002 20:09									#53
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy straight? I think South America is leaning more to the east than North America.

No. Go look at a map. Tierra Del Fuego is most certainly directly south of parts of Canada and just the easternmost parts either.

quote: Did I say I believed it?

You didn't put a single qualifier in there.

quote: that remark wasn't made about stonehenge. And yes, it's in england (and in israel) (Like the pyramids are in egypt, and in Sout America) (in a different form though)

Nonsense. Stonehenge is on the Sudbury Plain. Its nowhere near Israel and neither anything even remotely similar. There are things that might be related elsewhere but not in Isreal and no other site of a remotely similar nature has such large stones on top other large stones. There are sites with more stones but not as large.

that makes it even......... more mystrious [/QUOTE]

	09-08-2002 20:12									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Hueij And once again (what is it that makes people unable to read nowadays?): the pyramids were NOT build by slaves

no?

	09-08-2002 20:15									#55
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quote: And once again (what is it that makes people unable to read nowadays?): the pyramids were NOT build by slaves

explain that to me......!

	09-08-2002 20:15									#56
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The reason why it's at the center of the "earth" (if you cleave the world at the International Dateline) is because the Egyptians happened to live there. If the center of the "earth" had been in Tunisia instead, the Egyptians wouldn't have been able to hitchhike on a spacecraft to get there, would they?

If you want to be nitpicking and say "the VERY EXACT" center of the "earth" is at the Pyramid of Cheops, then I disagree with you. How are Pacific Islands counted, together with Asia, or America? Where were all the ancient coastlines? (The Euphrates and Yangtze have both expanded their deltas significantly) Do you count lakes as "land" or "sea"? Do you count ice as "land" or "sea"? You can twiddle any of these to make the center fall anywhere in Egypt.

As for the thing about how no one today could have built the Pyramids: right... and we built the Eiffel Tower? and the Empire State Building? and CN Tower? And even then, no one today can design and build a large pile?

As for the N-E-W-S thing: doubtlessly, in ancient Egypt the sun, moon and stars rose from random directions.

And finally, the thing about the "el":
Unless the Hebrews kept an alloy "el" in a vacuum container, all ancient units of measurement were impossibly imprecise. The "foot" is, after all, based on the length of the foot. In another example, the Chinese "chi" rose from 10+ cm in Shang times to 33 cm today. The figure of "365.242" is ridiculous.

And finally, to CyberShy: what, exactly, is your point?

	09-08-2002 20:16									#57
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy We *could* have chosen another date-line, but we didn't. Seems like most people will agree. And indeed, of course in fact earth has no center. (oh well, it does, but not on the surface).

I have news for you. We did pick a different date line. The date-line is in the Pacific. Its not on the zero line either as that goes through The British Naval Observatory in Greenwhich England. The line you are talking about is ten degrees east of that. Goes right through Alexandria and NOT right through Cheops.

quote: But if you have to pick a center, most people (except you) would chose THAT center.

No one has ever chosen that as the center. Its near but not on the ten degree longitude line.

	09-08-2002 20:17									#58
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy quote: And once again (what is it that makes people unable to read nowadays?): the pyramids were NOT build by slaves explain that to me......!

did anyone play Pharaoh?

the designers painstakingly used a unique model to simulate both farming and pyramid-building.

Basically, farmers built the pyramids during the Inundation season.

	09-08-2002 20:20									#59
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Have you been reading those two nutcases, Robert Bauval and whatshisname?

	09-08-2002 20:20									#60
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quote: Originally posted by CyberShy quote: And once again (what is it that makes people unable to read nowadays?): the pyramids were NOT build by slaves explain that to me......!

Whats to explain? The pyramids weren't built by slaves. Thats pretty simple and true.

They were built by Egyptians. Many were profesionals and we have found the where the profesionals lived near Cheops. Its believed that the main moving was done during the period of the year that the Nile flooded the fields. The farmers had to wait till the flood went down. During that time they worked for the Pharoah. Think of it as taxes in the form of labor.