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Thrumble
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I was in the chat room and Lux members are still talking as if they are researching Mysticism. It's also interesting to note that have never said they were researching Horseback Riding, they simply state they will "have it" in 10 turns.
What happens if they are getting it from GOW and GOW makes the same provisions we have made regarding Writing? That is that Lux cannot trade it to us.
If Lux is gearing for war with someone Horseback Riding is far more crucial than Writing. This might give the advantage to GOW in Lux diplomacy.
Last edited by Thrumble on 23-01-2003 at 22:40
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adaMada
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"The Iron" Stadium, Ubergorsk, Apolytonia (C3DG)
Mar 2000
time: 00:24
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Sorry this is so late -- it took a LONG time to write, and I had a really hard time with it. It's not very good, and if anyone has any better suggestions, please feel free to pass them along. I'm still proof-reading it, but I wanted to get it here as soon as is possible. Any thoughts are very welcome -- we should all be involved in this message, as it's very important in our communications with GoW.
-- adaMada
quote:
Panzer,
I apologize for the late reply. It has taken several days for my team to situate itself, and it has taken yet more time for me to compose this message; I apologize to your team for keeping you waiting.
quote:
adaMada,
I am finally officially replying to the PM about Roleplay's territorial claim. The Glory of War understands the reason Roleplay would want to claim their own territory to create room for their expansion. We also understand that small territorial claims are necessary, and completly within the spirit of the game. There are several things at this juncture that I think are needed to continue good relations between our two teams: |
Obviously, good relations between our two teams are most important to us. We want this behind us as much as you do -- any other deals are impossible while this hangs over our heads. As soon as this is behind us, we can begin to work together again. Partnership between our teams can only benefit, and strife can only harm. We must be understanding of each other now that we can reap the full benefits of cooperation.
quote:
1. We need to trade maps. We need to know exactly where we are located, and especially where your territorial claim is. We need this information because if we don't have it, there is no guarantee for us that we are moving our warrior out of your territory. We would like to move around your territory, and it would make it much easier for us to have directions. Also, on the flip side, it would be beneficial for your team to understand the geography of the northern part of the continent. We will supply our map in .jpg format if you do the same, with your territorial claim imposed on it. As a clause to this agreement, the .jpgs will not be shown to other teams. |
I'm afraid that my team has decided that .jpg trades (other than minimaps) are against the spirit of the game. Though I tried to convince them, they feel that minimap trades were agreed upon by all the teams as a way to speed the game up, and that the game is too close to mapmaking for full screen .jpg trades to be an acceptable alternative. I'm very sorry, but it's been put to a vote, and there's little I can do about it unless the team decides otherwise. As soon as we have mapmaking, we will happily trade maps using the in-game function then.
quote:
2. We need to develop trust for each other. Unfortunatly, this is impossible when the Roleplay team breaks previously agreed upon deals. This was the case when the roleplay team decided not to trade the Glory of War writing for horseback riding. Our team is dissapointed that this deal got cancelled by your team. Our dissapointment has evolved slowly into a general distrust of your team. We will be forever wary of the Roleplay team in the future, as they have not proven they can be trusted. I can do nothing now but warn you that the consequences could be very grave indeed if you decide to break an agreement with the Glory of War again. |
This has me slightly confused. Though I understand several members of our teams discussed such an agreement, I know that I personally never discussed it, and I don't believe it was ever truly agreed upon. This was clearly a lapse in communication -- on my part as much as anyone else's, and I apologize. Though we need to keep contact at all levels, we also need to ensure that all deals work their way through official channels, so that everyone's always clear on what is mere discussion and what is a binding agreement. Roleplay will honor any agreements it feels that is has made, but I cannot lie to my team – I can’t recall any message from myself agreeing to Writing-Horseback riding. Obviously, if one exists, you need merely to send it to me, or even to provide me with approximate dates, and you’ll have my fullest apologizes at the lapse in my memory. If a message between our diplomatic branches doesn’t exist on the issue, then we should clarify where the miscommunication occurred, and jointly decide what constitutes a binding agreement and what does not.
quote:
3. We need to acknowledge each other's territory. The Roleplay team has already told us of their territorial claim. With the trading of jpg maps, the Glory of War will be able to see the exact extent of this claim. I quote from adaMada's official response to my question "How large is Roleplay's territorial claim?": "At its widest points, it is about seven spaces wide and four deep". This would mean the territory is no larger than 56 tiles (4*7 twice). If this is true (and the .jpg map can prove this), the Glory of War will support your territorial claim and not enter this zone. As a reciprocal agreement, the Glory of War requests that you do not enter the zone to the north of Neu Demogyptica and Lux Invicta, where the Glory of War is located. I can mark this zone on the .jpg map when we trade also. On the other hand, and your territory is more than 56 tiles large, the Roleplay team has lied to the Glory of War yet again. All of the above in point #3 will be null and void. The Glory of War will not support any current territorial claim by Roleplay, and will be extremely wary of one made in the future. |
Indeed. As I have stated, Roleplay currently has a very small territorial claim. It is the only ideal territory for cities that is within striking distance of our capital. Obviously, there is other land we'd like to settle at a later time, but for now, that is the extent of our claims -- and as I've said, we are well on our way to having the area settled already. We will later move on to other territories, but I don't see our settlers meeting each other any time soon -- we've no desire to expand that far north.
To be honest, I don't see any reason why territory should be an issue between us. We have no reason to settle the upper parts of the continent, and any cities you found by us would be riddled with corruption. As far as my team is concerned, our teams have no conflict of interest in this matter -- we'd even be willing to sign an agreement in this regard.
quote:
Thank you for your time, adaMada. I hope you will take these points seriously. |
I, and my team, do take these points very seriously. As I've said before, it's in both of our best interests to move on from this. We stand to gain nothing through needless bickering, and loose valuable time while the other teams pull ahead.
Thanks again.
-- adaMada
Togas' Ambassador to Glory of War |
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dejon
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Good letter adaMada.
However, there is no mention of our desires with respect to their warriors in our land. Are we giving up this point and letting them fully explore the/our terrain, while we are politely not exploring theirs? That was the starting point of this most recent conflict - and it isn't addressed at all.
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dejon
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quote:
Originally posted by pikesfan
We can’t do anything about it anyway.  |
The only thing we can do is harass them - block/trap them with two or three units. Of course, I would rather not tie up units in such foolishness. I merely ask that we say something like:
"We wish to maintain peaceful relations with GoW. You should know, however, that some of our people are upset and insulted at the rude intrusion into our lands after our polite request. They insist the incident will not be forgotten. In their minds, the Chinese have demonstrated that they are arrogant hotheads, who overreact, misconstrue, and unfairly accuse all who they meet. I am afraid it will take quite some time to repair the damage done to repair your reputation here, though I am trying hard. I pray that those of this sentiment never rise to power, for then I fear our relations would not simply be under strain, they would break.
Maybe not quite so heavy, but you get the drift. 
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adaMada
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"The Iron" Stadium, Ubergorsk, Apolytonia (C3DG)
Mar 2000
time: 00:24
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Togas,
Sorry this took so long to get out -- it was hard to write. I'll try to do it faster in the future -- more than a day's wait is really bad while the game's moving so quickly. Sorry.
Here's the final message to Panzer. A lot of word changes and meaningless things cut out to get it to fit in one PM, but I managed to squeeze in the ideas behind the above suggestions. As for content, it's basically what I posted above, minus a lot of little things and plus a sentance or two addressing the above stuff.
-- adaMada
quote:
Panzer,
I apologize to you and your team for the late reply; it’s taken a day or two for me to sort everything out.
** NOTE: I've had to snip out all but the first few words of each paragraph of your message to make the PM within size limits, but each reply addresses the full text **
quote:
There are several things at this juncture that I think are needed to continue good relations between our two teams: |
Obviously, good relations between our two teams are most important to us. We want this behind us as much as you do – any other deals are impossible while this hangs over our heads. As soon as this is behind us – with both teams having a mutual understanding and your warrior safely away from our villages and children – we can begin to work together again. Partnership between our teams can only benefit, and strife can only harm. We must understand each other now so we can reap the full benefits of cooperation.
quote:
1. We need to trade maps. |
I'm afraid that my team has decided that .jpg trades (other than minimaps) are against the spirit of the game. Though I tried to convince them, they feel that minimap trades were agreed upon by all the teams as a way to speed the game up, and that the game is too close to mapmaking for full screen jpg trades to be an acceptable alternative. I'm very sorry, but it's been put to a vote, and there's little I can do about it unless the team decides otherwise. As soon as we have mapmaking, we will happily trade maps using the in-game function.
quote:
2. We need to develop trust for each other. |
This has me slightly confused. Though I understand several members of our teams discussed such an agreement, I know that I personally never discussed it, and I don't believe it was ever truly agreed upon. To be very honest, we don't even have writing at this time – something we've, to my knowledge, never been misleading about. This was clearly a lapse in communication – on my part as much as anyone else's, and I apologize. Though we need to keep contact at all levels, we also need to ensure that all deals work their way through official channels, so that everyone's always clear on what is mere discussion and what is a binding agreement. Roleplay will honor any agreements it feels that is has made, but I won’t lie to my team – I can’t recall any message from myself agreeing to Writing-Horseback riding. Obviously, if one exists, you should just tell me when it was sent, and you’ll have my fullest apologizes at the lapse in my memory. If a message between our diplomatic branches doesn’t exist on the issue, then we should clarify where the miscommunication occurred, and jointly decide what constitutes a binding agreement and what does not.
quote:
3. We need to acknowledge each other's territory. |
Indeed. As I've said, Roleplay currently has a very small territorial claim. It's the only ideal territory for cities that is within striking distance of our capital. Obviously, there is other land we'd like to settle at a later time, but for now, that is the extent of our claims – and as I've said, we are well on our way to having the area settled. We will later move on to other territories, but I don't see our settlers meeting each other any time soon – we've no desire to expand that far north.
To be honest, I don't see any reason why territory should be an issue between us. We have no reason to settle the upper parts of the continent, and any cities you found by us would be riddled with corruption. As far as my team is concerned, our teams have no conflict of interest in this matter – we'd even be willing to sign an agreement in this regard.
quote:
Thank you for your time, adaMada. I hope you will take these points seriously. |
We take these points very seriously. As I've said before, we stand to gain nothing through needless bickering except valuable time while the other teams pull ahead.
Thanks again,
adaMada |
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Thud
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Proud to be an American
Jul 2002
time: 00:24
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Smashing.
EDIT: Anything about us wanting them "OUT"? Maybe I missed it...
Last edited by Thud on 24-01-2003 at 07:32
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23-01-2003 08:17
) which is the best way to solve the problem.
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