07-12-2002 23:16									#1
	Saddam APOLOGIZES for invading Kuwait?! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm..._declaration_26

quote: BAGHDAD, Iraq (AP) - Iraq, denying it has weapons of mass destruction, delivered to the United Nations (news - web sites) on Saturday its long-awaited declaration detailing its nuclear, chemical and biological programs. President Saddam Hussein (news - web sites), meanwhile, apologized to the people of Kuwait for his 1990 invasion. A vehicle with the Iraqi documents arrived at the U.N. office at the edge of the capital shortly after 8 p.m. The filing of the more than 12,000 pages of technical detail, meeting a U.N. deadline, now shifts the crisis into a new stage, as Washington and Baghdad move step by step toward a crossroads between war and peace. The declaration "will answer all the questions which have been addressed during the last months and years," Lt. Gen. Hossam Mohammed Amin, who oversaw the declaration's preparation, said earlier. Amin also said it would name companies and countries that helped Iraq develop weapons of mass destruction in the past, information that could help in prosecutions under other nations' export-control laws. "I reiterate here Iraq has no weapons of mass destruction," he told reporters. "I think if the United States has the minimum level of fairness and braveness, it should accept the report and say this is the truth." Saddam said he was not apologizing to the Kuwaitis out of weakness but a desire to set the record straight. In a speech read on national television by the Iraqi information minister, Saddam outlined the events that led to the invasion and said: "We apologize to God about any act that has angered him in the past and that was held against us, and we apologize to you (the Kuwaitis) on the same basis." In his weekly radio address Saturday, President Bush (news - web sites) made plain his skepticism about Iraq's weapons inventory. "Thus far we are not seeing the fundamental shift in practice and attitude that the world is demanding," Bush said in remarks taped Friday. Iraqi officials displayed the declaration — more than 12,000 pages — to the international media before it was handed over to U.N. officials in Baghdad. It will be delivered Sunday to U.N. headquarters in New York and the International Atomic Energy Agency in Vienna. On a table in a government office, reporters viewed copies of volumes devoted separately to nuclear, chemical, biological and missile activities, titled "Currently Accurate, Full and Complete Declarations." The mass of paper, in red and blue covers, was spread on a table accompanied by computer disks, presumably with added information. Under the Security Council resolution calling for the report, teams from the U.N. Monitoring, Verification and Inspection Commission and the U.N. nuclear watchdog resumed inspections Nov. 27 after a four-year interruption. On Saturday, the inspectors visited two sites south of Baghdad previously inspected in the 1990s — an industrial plant that in the 1980s helped make medium-range missiles now forbidden to Iraq by the United Nations, and a site associated with Iraq's major nuclear research center. As usual, the U.N. inspection agency offered no immediate information about the visits. Iraq's report on past weapons programs and industrial activity will take U.N. experts weeks to analyze and inspectors months to verify inside Iraq. And U.N. officials said weeding out data that might help others produce chemical, biological or nuclear weapons will further delay handover of material to the Security Council's 15 member nations. "No member will get it on Monday," chief U.N. weapons inspector Hans Blix told reporters in New York on Friday. The Bush administration says it's sure Iraq still harbors banned arms, despite its repeated denials — including the one in the declaration. If Iraq doesn't disarm, U.S. officials say, they will seek Security Council sanction for military action against Iraq. Failing that, they say, Washington would initiate an attack. U.S. officials have not presented conclusive evidence Iraq has banned weapons. The White House said Thursday that "solid evidence" would be turned over to U.N. inspectors. The United States on Friday offered to protect Iraqi scientists who cooperate with international weapons inspectors searching for hidden arms. The Security Council resolution under which weapons inspectors are working allows them to solicit information from Iraqi scientists without Iraqi officials being present. The Security Council resolution adopted Nov. 8 required Iraq to file by Sunday an "accurate, full, and complete declaration" of all weapons programs. Iraq also was required to report on "all other chemical, biological, and nuclear programs," even if not weapon-related. In the 1990s, after Iraq's defeat in the Gulf War (news - web sites), U.N. inspectors destroyed many tons of Iraq's weapons of mass destruction and dismantled its program to try to build nuclear bombs. But the monitoring collapsed amid U.N.-Iraqi disputes, and the inspectors suspect they may have missed some chemical and biological weapons. The inspectors hope the Iraqis at least will help them answer open questions by, for example, supplying convincing documentation on the fate of 550 artillery shells filled with poisonous mustard gas. Iraqi and U.N. accounts contain many such discrepancies from the 1990s. The U.N. resolution provides that "false statements or omissions" in Iraq's declaration would constitute a "material breach," that is, a potential cause for military action, but only if coupled with Iraqi noncooperation. That would seem to exempt inaccuracies shown to be inadvertent. If Iraq eventually is found to have cooperated fully with the inspectors, U.N. resolutions call for the Security Council to consider lifting economic sanctions imposed on Iraq after it invaded Kuwait in 1990.

Rather stunning, IMO...

	07-12-2002 23:29									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Saddam:

Yes, we apologize. We thought Allah was telling us to invade Kuwait, steal all their material possessions, beat and torture their civilians and burn their oil fields. Turns out, Allah just wanted some chicken. Sorry.

	07-12-2002 23:36									#3
	Increase the size of your Attachments

USA: he says he's sorry, for god's sake show some mercy and leave the poor man alone

	07-12-2002 23:39									#4
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: beat and torture their civilians

wasn't a lot of that just made up by some american public relations agency

	07-12-2002 23:41									#5
	Full PM-box? Change here!

" he says he's sorry"

I can imagine seeing saddam caught by US troops in one of his palaces or something.

Saddam: "I am sorry, I am sorry"
* US Soldier Kicks saddam *

	07-12-2002 23:41									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Kuwait didn't need help beating and torturing their civilians, anyway...they do a fine job of that on their own.

	07-12-2002 23:56									#7
	Tired of ads?

Saddam's forces dealt with Kuwaiti civilians in a brutal, barbaric way, executing people on the street and beating any who tried to stop them. Unfortunately, the Kuwaiti government is less than democratic, but I challenge you to say that they do the same to their people.

	08-12-2002 00:00									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by finkian Saddam's forces dealt with Kuwaiti civilians in a brutal, barbaric way, executing people on the street and beating any who tried to stop them. Unfortunately, the Kuwaiti government is less than democratic, but I challenge you to say that they do the same to their people.

They do the same to their own people. In the days following the liberation, a news team stubled across Kuwaiti forces torturing people, with US personal present. There were also retributions against those who were seen to be collaborators.

Kontki, Iraq is an officially atheist country. They didn't think God told them anything.

	08-12-2002 00:03									#9
	Suffering from ads?

This is like the US formally apologizing to the Japanese internment camp victims. After the fact, it's always good PR to apologize -- never hurts. I'm sure Germany apologized to the Jews too...

	08-12-2002 00:03									#10
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Perhaps I'm stupid, then.

	08-12-2002 00:03									#11
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

which god were they apologizing to, allah?

	08-12-2002 00:04									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

yes, that's why Saddam is portrayed as mohammad in oh so many pics. he plays that card, just as he played the 'socialist' card before that.

	08-12-2002 00:05									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

The Kuwatis exacted some brutal revenge from Palestinian guest workers who had collaberaded with the Iraqi invader/occupiers. Much the same as the more enlightened Dutch and French did in liberated areas in WW2.

	08-12-2002 00:07									#14
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Kepler This is like the US formally apologizing to the Japanese internment camp victims. After the fact, it's always good PR to apologize -- never hurts. I'm sure Germany apologized to the Jews too...

Germany has done a lot in terms of apologies, reparations, etc. I don't think you can compare that to a callous apology like the U.S. gave to the Issei or that Saddam is giving now.

	08-12-2002 00:12									#15
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

"Kontki, Iraq is an officially atheist country. They didn't think God told them anything."

Maybe in theory, but lately Saddam has been using plenty of Islamic rhetoric

	08-12-2002 00:14									#16
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara They do the same to their own people. In the days following the liberation, a news team stubled across Kuwaiti forces torturing people, with US personal present. There were also retributions against those who were seen to be collaborators. Kontki, Iraq is an officially atheist country. They didn't think God told them anything.

Then you don't remember the rather comical bit about Saddam at prayer in the mosques. The Iraqi government is officially secular, but that's far from atheistic, especially in the ME.

	08-12-2002 00:16									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Azazel yes, that's why Saddam is portrayed as mohammad in oh so many pics. he plays that card, just as he played the 'socialist' card before that.

Yes, he plays the card, like any "good" dictator. But claiming he's Moslem is just silly.

	08-12-2002 01:02									#18
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola The Kuwatis exacted some brutal revenge from Palestinian guest workers who had collaberaded with the Iraqi invader/occupiers. Much the same as the more enlightened Dutch and French did in liberated areas in WW2.

I can assure you NO palestinians were subject to revenge in liberated Holland after WW2.

	08-12-2002 01:11									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

oh, certainly, much like the Assads in Syria, who are members of a rather small sect-tribe, but present themselves as part of a homgenous arab-muslim world. ( and they do ).

also, the fact that he's not muslim doesn't mean he cannot join forces with the likes of bin-laden. It's the good ol' "the enemy of my enemy is my friend".

	08-12-2002 01:13									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Saddam also said that the American troops in Kuwait were "occupiers," called for the Kuwaiti's to resist and asked that the Kuwaiti's not participate in any attack on Iraq.

Now, does this make Saddam's apology more "understandable?"

	08-12-2002 01:13									#21
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

It's a PR stunt. I don't see that it will do much. Kuwait is already ambivalent to an atatck on Iraq, though they know they wil give the US anyting it asks of them.

The rest of the article is far more important.

(And what's with avatars and Santa Hats? I doubt Trotsky celebrated Christmas...)

	08-12-2002 01:17									#22
	Got spare money?

pure fun, GePap. I am sure Mr. Twain would approve.

	08-12-2002 01:19									#23
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Azazel also, the fact that he's not muslim doesn't mean he cannot join forces with the likes of bin-laden. It's the good ol' "the enemy of my enemy is my friend".

True, but the fact that bin Laden is helping anti-Saddam forces might dampen that relationship a little bit.

	08-12-2002 01:19									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by GePap (And what's with avatars and Santa Hats? I doubt Trotsky celebrated Christmas...)

Especially since he was Jewish.

	08-12-2002 01:19									#25
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Okay... if he is sorry will he start to apologize for these crimes:

quote: Documented Iraqi Use of Chemical Weapons Date Area Used Type of Agent Approximate Casualties Target Population Aug 1983 Hajj Umran Mustard fewer than 100 Iranians/Kurds Oct-Nov 1983 Panjwin Mustard 3,000 Iranian/Kurds Feb-Mar 1984 Majnoon Island Mustard 2,500 Iranians Mar 1984 al-Basrah Tabun 50 to 100 Iranians Mar 1985 Hawizah Marsh Mustard/Tabun 3,000 Iranians Feb 1986 al-Faw Mustard/Tabun 8,000 to 10,000 Iranians Dec 1986 Umm ar Rasas Mustard thousands Iranians Apr 1987 al-Basrah Mustard/Tabun 5,000 Iranians Oct 1987 Sumar/Mehran Mustard/nerve agents 3,000 Iranians Mar 1988 Halabjah Mustard/nerve agents hundreds Iranians/Kurds

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications...Oct_2002.htm#05

Do me a favor and don't believe a single word that man says. He is a liar and will always be a liar.

quote: "Kontki, Iraq is an officially atheist country. They didn't think God told them anything." Maybe in theory, but lately Saddam has been using plenty of Islamic rhetoric

Saddam's mother of all battles speech in 1990 (or 91?) had a bunch of Islamic rhetoric.

Also too bad the Kuwaiti people were not listening... Saddam's speech didn't show on their new stations. So they would have to be tuning into CNN to watch it.

	08-12-2002 01:22									#26
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

any proof? What I've heard that he helps the forces fighting the current kurdish government in northen iraq.

( note I don't say that "UBL+Saddam=Love" is a fact. I say that the possibility of them joining forces on some objectives may be possible. )

	08-12-2002 01:24									#27
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Awww, the evil little dictator has killed people! Bad Saddam, Bad! Didn't you know you can only kill communists?

BUt its nice to see that finally, the CIA's heart has grown twelve sizes too large....

Azazel: Question: do you think Mr. Twain is my avatar?
(I do like Mr. Twai a lot: PBS ijust ran a wonderful thing on his life)

	08-12-2002 01:25									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

How about returning the 600+ missing Kuwaitis, Saddam?

That is, if any are still alive.

	08-12-2002 01:26									#29
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I wonder what the families of the mustard gassed kurds would say to you, gepap.

	08-12-2002 01:27									#30
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Edan How about returning the 600+ missing Kuwaitis, Saddam? That is, if any are still alive.

They probably are dead. I mean 600+ is nothing compared to the 20,000 Saddam had murdered with mustard gas. He probably didn't hestiate doing so either.