31-12-2002 09:43									#1
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I have been thinking about this subject alot with all the talk with NK and Iraq. I was thinking that Nueclear weapons with all the bad they can do have had some part in stoping WWIII form breaking out. Just think if nukes were never invented, I think that a war between Soviet Union and US would have happened if it were not for nukes. What do you all think?

	31-12-2002 10:03									#2
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Not so sure about that. Nuclear weapons could have said to deter a lot more conflicts.

	31-12-2002 10:23									#3
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Unfortunately they also make conflicts far more catstrophic when they DO break out.

	31-12-2002 10:58									#4
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Well If you where in the USSR postion, would you have the guts to declare war on US, know full well that nuclear weapons would be used? Many country think again when nuclear weapons are invloved. No one wins in a nuclear war. Even a country like NK knows if they ever launch a nuke that they would be wiped off the face of the earth. Personally I think they may just be doing it to prevent war, not start one.

They only way I could see some nation using nukes first is if their leader is crazy and wants to destroy the entire world.

	31-12-2002 11:07									#5
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...?

Are you disputing that nukes take war to a new level of horror, misunderstanding my point, or talking to someone else?

	31-12-2002 11:09									#6
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Of course they do. If US or Russia used nukes, we could just say good bye to the earth. All I am saying is that the only way I see nukes being used is if a insane person wanted to wipe all life off the face of earth came to power ifn Russia or US and launch nukes, or if an the person made it look like Russia or US launched nukes on the other power. Or an acciendental Launch of nukes.

	31-12-2002 11:09									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Jack_www Well If you where in the USSR postion, would you have the guts to declare war on US, know full well that nuclear weapons would be used?

Wrong question, it should be:
The USA din't have the guts to declare war on USSR even when SU didn't have a single nuke. Would USA have the guts to declare war on USSR after 1949 when Soviets have nukes?
It sounds much better now. (and please no bs about peace loving nation, just didn't have balls for this)

quote: They only way I could see some nation using nukes first is if their leader is crazy and wants to destroy the entire world.

Sure!!! *cough* Trouman*cough* (hmm... sp?)

Thank you for your time and have a nice day.

	31-12-2002 11:11									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Jack_www of course they do. If US or Russia used nukes, we could just say good bye to the earth.

Not at all.
...only few survived the devastaion in large underground vaults...
Fallout.

	31-12-2002 11:14									#9
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quote: Sure!!! *cough* Trouman*cough* (hmm... sp?) Thank you for your time and have a nice day.

Truman didn't use nukes against a nation which also had them. he used them against a nation which was already defeated and on the brink of surrender (rather ironically, the Americans decided to grant the Japanese request that the Emerpor receive immunity to prosecution for war crimes AFTER the bomb was dropped, when they had been willing to agree to that before).

	31-12-2002 11:15									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Serb Wrong question, it should be: The USA din't have the guts to declare war on USSR even when SU didn't have a single nuke. Would USA have the guts to declare war on USSR after 1949 when Soviets have nukes? It sounds much better now. (and please no bs about peace loving nation, just didn't have balls for this) Sure!!! *cough* Trouman*cough* (hmm... sp?) Thank you for your time and have a nice day.

Or USA. USA did not war with USSR etheir. I they both new one wrong move and its all over. Neither country is peace loving, if that were the case there would have been no cold war or nuclear arms race.


I never said US or Russia were better then other, just trying to say I think nukes stoped a World War between USSR and USA.

Actually I think Patton watened to go to war with USSR. BUt most did not want to go through anther World War, basicly tiered of war. Most AMericans wanted the people in army back home and did not want a war. I bet most Russian felt the same way, I am talking about every day people in Russia.

	31-12-2002 11:17									#11
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quote: Originally posted by GeneralTacticus Truman didn't use nukes against a nation which also had them. he used them against a nation which was already defeated and on the brink of surrender (rather ironically, the Americans decided to grant the Japanese request that the Emerpor receive immunity to prosecution for war crimes AFTER the bomb was dropped, when they had been willing to agree to that before).

He said that: "They only way I could see some nation using nukes first is if their leader is crazy and wants to destroy the entire world."
I just agreed with him and pointed that one of their leaders already did it twice.

	31-12-2002 11:21									#12
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Well in World War II Serb the only nation to have them was US. So no way for Japan to strike back. Today if anyone uses them, there is some one there to stirke back.

THis is something Truman did not have to face in WWII.

	31-12-2002 11:22									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Jack_www I never said US or Russia were better then other, just trying to say I think nukes stoped a World War between USSR and USA.

I still prefer if they would never be invented. It's like genie in the bottle, you can't hold it there forever. Sooner or later it will break out and will ends human civilization.

	31-12-2002 11:25									#14
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hmm... anyone went to ground zero yet? I went there last december... I could imagine thats what new york would look if someone droped a nuke. Trust me it ain't a pretty site... I don't even wanna imagine what hiroshima looked like after the A-bomb... as for crazy leaders the US and USSR both have had thier fair share of them... personally I think Nixon was a nutcase or he could have just been like bush, with a severe coke problem and well the USSR... do I need to name stalin?

Further I think NK is a threat but I think Pakistan and india are far more dangerous in terms of using those nukes...

	31-12-2002 11:26									#15
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Well the though of that with in 30 min one can blow away most life on the earth does not make me feel good etheir. I would like to see them gone. I am just trying to say they brought some good to the world, and bad at the same time.

	31-12-2002 11:29									#16
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Good? as in the form of nuclear reactors for energy?
I don't see what good they brought in terms of war... more reasons plz

	31-12-2002 11:31									#17
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quote: Originally posted by Jack_www Well in World War II Serb the only nation to have them was US. So no way for Japan to strike back. Today if anyone uses them, there is some one there to stirke back. THis is something Truman did not have to face in WWII.

Absolutely unnecessary.
I read somewhere that when Pentagon was planing an invasion in Afghanistan it didn't deny opportunity to use tactical nukes vs. Taliban in case if invasion goes bad.
I don't think this could cause an adequate retaliation.
Nixon wanted to nuke those "red as$ VK" during Vietnam war, well in this case retaliation could happened.
So, no much changed since Hirosima- if USA wants to nuke somebody who don't have nukes or strong ally (who have nukes ), it could. Why not?

	31-12-2002 11:32									#18
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They stop a world war from Breaking out, and even force Japan in giving up, when almost everyone was willing to fight to the last man so to speak. How many have acutally died at the hands of nukes? Not even a million people. Of course like I said I dont want them arround. Sooner or latter someone will walk into New York CIty, LA or someother highly populated area and blow it up with a nuke. OR some insane manic will launch them off.

	31-12-2002 11:36									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Lord_Davinator hmm... anyone went to ground zero yet? I went there last december...

I thought you are living in Nepal.

	31-12-2002 11:37									#20
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Nuking Japan was completely unnecessary in making japan give in, Further I don't see how Hiroshima was a military target...

ya but for someone to walk into a city with it, someone has to make it... who do you think would sell em?

	31-12-2002 11:37									#21
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quote: They stop a world war from Breaking out, and even force Japan in giving up, when almost everyone was willing to fight to the last man so to speak.

they were willing to fight to the last man to protect the Emperor - if the US had agreed to give him immunity, they would have given up without the nukes, and they got what they wanted anyway.

quote: How many have acutally died at the hands of nukes? Not even a million people.

But how many may die because of them? Almost everyone.

quote: Of course like I said I dont want them arround. Sooner or latter someone will walk into New York CIty, LA or someother highly populated area and blow it up with a nuke. OR some insane manic will launch them off.

Or the US will. Remember that list of countries the Pentagon drew up that they said they were willing to launch a first strike against?

	31-12-2002 11:37									#22
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Only twice have nukes been used in the fifty years they have been around. Nukes are used as detrent, never as a way to win a war. I am not trying to defend USA, all I am saying that they have stoped world war III from breaking out.

I strongly doubt any country will want to be the first to use nukes, including USA or Russia.

	31-12-2002 11:39									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Serb I thought you are living in Nepal.

I do but I go to college here... got here a week before 9/11 which made it all the more freaker...

	31-12-2002 11:40									#24
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Country no, terrorist yes... terrorist bad... need killin...

	31-12-2002 11:41									#25
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I know, some crazy guy could come to power in USA and launch them off. People like having nukes around, they like the power they respresent. Hardly any of them would want to use them. Even NK i think.

I never said nukes are all good. Man just trying to look on the bright side. Allthough I know that they can end all life on the face of the earth.

No country in world is crazy enough to do a first strike, if they were we would all be dead by now, of course that could changed in the future.

	31-12-2002 11:41									#26
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quote: Country no, terrorist yes... terrorist bad... need killin...

*AHEM*

quote: Or the US will. Remember that list of countries the Pentagon drew up that they said they were willing to launch a first strike against?

	31-12-2002 11:43									#27
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quote: Originally posted by Jack_www I never said nukes are all good. Man just trying to look on the bright side. Allthough I know that they can end all life on the face of the earth.

I get your point, but I don't agree with your initial claim that nukes prevent wars...

	31-12-2002 11:44									#28
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quote: I know, some crazy guy could come to power in USA and launch them off.

I don't think it would need a new government in the US to launch, just the right circumstances, i.e. an expensive stalemate with someone, and public support for launching.

quote: People like having nukes around, they like the power they respresent. Hardly any of them would want to use them. Not if NK i think.

I don't know if NK is even after them for the power, I think they want them so they have something to deter the US with.

	31-12-2002 11:45									#29
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Well in the past they did, With USSR and USA. Nukes made them think twice, even Stalin.

	31-12-2002 11:45									#30
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quote: Originally posted by Jack_www I know, some crazy guy could come to power in USA

Could come? Are you absolutely sure that he isn't in office already?

quote: No country in world is crazy enough to do a first strike, if they were we would all be dead by now,

Of course.

quote: of course that could changed in the future.

I doubt.