03-04-2003 05:10									#271
	Re: Count me out. This time really. Enter the AD-FREE zone

Sorry to hear that, Vlad... and don't sweat the Xinning thing.

Drop in again if you get the chance (though I think this one will be over soon, and long before July...).

	03-04-2003 05:55									#272
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Vlad - Good luck with the history! Keep dropping in to say hello until you can play again.

------------------

SG(2)

	03-04-2003 22:35									#273
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

First Thoughts
It's good to come to a game and find a long ship chain in tact. Congratulations to Obiwan18 for this, which was reflected with his impressive record of research ... even though he forgot about Automobile

We are a warlike Republic The problem is we are at war with too many civs at the same time. As we depend upon long distance trading to maintain our gold/science rate the supply lines become endangered if taking on more than a couple of enemies at one time. The Celts seem to be well placed for trade so peace with them will allow freight storage in a fort on their continent, which prevents pirate frigates sinking full transports of goodies. I have seen the dreaded window "9 Units Lost" but I wish to avoid the rehabilitation course at The Institute for careless Admirals.

Change build orders for Temples in remote regions to Courthouses. With all the happy wonders instant temples are not required. Courthouses halve the corruption and makes bribing less attractive.

I note that two sets of five engineers are railroading two squares. Only two engineers can contribute work at any given time. The secret is to move them onto the tile in rotation. After starting the first pair move the third one on and cancel the order given to the first one - setting the third one to work, then move the fourth engineer in and cancel the order of the second one etc. The order is important or Xin's trick won't work!

1760 Wood Lake captured 78 plundered;
Peace with Celts for Metallurgy - they have a navy which threatens our floating freights
Peace with the Persians after bribing Gordium
Bribe Zulu Caravan blocking rail network
Food Freight solves Arkwright's immediate hunger problem.
Gold to Arkwright 86; Silk to Kells 756;

1762 Conscription ... Automobile not offered so Tactics.
Supermarket in Arkwright to regain food surplus.
Dead Buffalo captured 177 plundered
Port Booth founded
Lister founded
Peace with Sioux
Hides/Salt to Cardiff 182/148; Beads to Rhondda 78; Wine to Iona 297; Salt/Hides/Hides/Beads/Gems/Hides to Kells 182/210/270/348/264/270;
Barb Leader 150;
Decided to continue the war with Spain as they are away from the main trading corridor. The distance of Spanish cities from our home patch will be useful when Flight reduces trade bonuses. After the construction of a few Airports airlifted freight should be worthwhile.

1764 Tactics
Beads/Gold/Gems x 2/Spice/Hides to Kells 210/224/210/270/298/332/
Silver to Cardiff 285; Silk to Kells 564;
Tyre bribed for a base in the Celtic trading area
Cordoue bribed for 1045 - 236 plundered

1766 Automobile
Salt x 3/Cloth/Gems/Wine/Copper x2 to Kells 200/182/296/348/256/332/300/120
Coal to Cardiff 145;
Widespread Superhighway construction started.

1768 Machine Tools
Superhighways in Arkwright, Crompton, Trevithick, Newcomen, Lion, Iron Duke.
Silk/Oil/Gold/Gems/Wine x 2 to Kells 438/184/298/186/192/226
Silver to Cardiff 760;

1770 Genetic Engineering
Madrid captured 391 plundered
Seville bribed for 1144 - 337 plundered
Arebela (Spanish) bribed for 727 - 186 plundered
Harvey Advanced Tribe
Hides/Dye/Oil/Gold/Gems/Oil/Beads/Salt to Kells 585/456/202/201/270/208/310/184

1772 Miniaturusation
Cure for Cancer
Sneak attack by Persians and Celts (sinking a transport)
Hides x 3/Oil/Wine/Cloth to Kells 603/220/220/256/498/492 Salt/Cloth to Hargreaves 153/183 (Unblocking)
Point of Rocks bribed for 1206 - 133 plundered

1774 Mass Production
Celts go Commie; Germans back to Monarchy.
Silk x 3 to Kells 522/456/294
Gold to Carmarthen 342
Oil to Newcomen (unblocking) 271
Silver to Caernaffon 1117
Pasargadae bribed for 969 - 245 plundered

Notes for next player: Arkwright has a repeating Hides supply. To make the most of this situation spies were rushed every turn and disbanded so a freight could be built each turn. They are worth about 500+ a time. There are some freights stacked in two forts on the Celtic continent - they don't usually kill them unless they can be blasted from the sea! I didn't give any techs to the Sioux as trade kept on producing the advances so long as a full transport of rushed freights could leave port each year. Xinning was minimal throughout.

Computers will be in next turn.
Treasury 4283
At 70% Tax - 30% Lux Income = 1863 less 213 overheads. Several cities are still growing.
Population = 31.8m
Arkwright = Size 33 and has enough food to reach 36.

-------------------------------

SG(2)

Attachment: ne_a1774.zip
This has been downloaded 7 time(s).

Last edited by Scouse Gits on 03-04-2003 at 22:44

	03-04-2003 22:49									#274
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

WoW!!
Outstanding abuse of trade privileges, Admiral!

	03-04-2003 23:11									#275
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Well done SG(2)!!

A note on one turn freight rushing. This works if barracks are still available on the list. Rush a barracks, switch to dip/spy, rush the spy. (160+25=185...cheaper than rushing a spy=210)...then proceed to engineer/rifle, then freight.

The rushing of high paying freights is a great strat, IMHO. Especially where science is zero. Even where it is not quite breakeven, the beaker bonus makes it worthwhile. I mention this for the benifit of anyone who might not understand why SG(2) recommends this.

Monk

	04-04-2003 02:27									#276
	Suffering from ads?

SG(2)

Well done
I was having trouble keeping up with the tech/turn pace, mostly because I built 4 wonders during my turns as well.

The city of Kells must be stuffed to the brim with our goods. They have probably earned us - 10K gold this game.

We should bribe the city after we have launched, and rename the city "cash-cow."

With computers, we may be close to 1 tech/turn without trade, and massive xinning.

12 techs remaining. Have the Zulus completed Atomic Theory yet?

	04-04-2003 03:14									#277
	Get a bigger avatar today!

I will not be able to play until I return from the Aussie group dinner which is in Sydney over the weekend so if The Rabbit Man wants to jump in over the weekend to keep things moving , I will play on Monday after I return.

Thankyou

	04-04-2003 04:01									#278
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Good turns (2)!

Jrabbit is up.... Hydey will then follow.

Play list updated...

1. obiwan18
2. SG(2)
3. Jrabbit (switched with Hydey)
4. Hydey (switched with Jrabbit)
5. SCG
6. STYOM
7. SG[1]
8. Bloody Monk
9. La Fayette

Play 8 turns, pls.

	04-04-2003 04:28									#279
	(Gulp) Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Hmm. And I had just been telling myself how tough it would be to follow the last couple turnsets....


Downloaded, emailing to the iMac shortly.

Looks like this Advanced Republic will take some study. Will do my Luddist best...

	04-04-2003 05:13									#280
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I have a feeling that (2) seems to have very nicely recovered from the wedding

(let us hope this also happens to [1] later on )

	04-04-2003 19:03									#281
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Took a quick look around. 51 cities, 31 MM population. Supremely spotless. Not bad!!!

At war with 3 civs, churning out about 30 vans/turn, shipchain to Celts, convertible to Sioiux. Very cool idea to fortress freights on delivery continent. Why have I never thought of that??
(Oh, yeah, I've never managed to set up nearly this extensive a trade empire...)

Looks like our job is to keep delivering freights (as many as possible before Flight), whittle down the foreign civs as permissible while remaining spotless (though reputation was not a rules condition ), and continue amassing the (12) techs still needed for the stars.

The only potential fly in the ointment would be for a foreign civ to buy up the last WoW, which would cripple our SS build. (This happened to me recently... )

It's work today, FNSGS at Ming's tonight. Hope to play Saturday.

	05-04-2003 02:38									#282
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by -Jrabbit The only potential fly in the ointment would be for a foreign civ to buy up the last WoW, which would cripple our SS build. (This happened to me recently... )

It's not a huge fly. Build Spies instead, disband them into a city and then rushbuild the SS part in question. Sure, it's not as effective as using Freight (wastes 15 shields), but we should be swimming in by the end game, and it won't matter much.

Besides, we're far ahead of the AI technology wise. It's unlikely they'd get the last wonder (Manhattan). The only way that could happen, as I see it, is if we get sloppy and let the AI steal a lot of techs. So be vigilant for bourgeois spies! (Sorry, lapsed into Red Front character there )

Oh, and spotless, schmotless. They're all attacking us anyway. Teach 'em some respect!

	05-04-2003 23:03									#283
	Support Apolyton

With these things in mind, I'm off to see the wizard...

Hoping the missus permits me the luxury of doing this in one session...

	07-04-2003 03:39									#284
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by -Jrabbit Hoping the missus permits me the luxury of doing this in one session...

Show her who wears the pants in your household.........


Then again perhaps just beg

	07-04-2003 12:47									#285
	Got spare money?

-jrabbit wears the pants in his house..... his wife told him so

	07-04-2003 16:53									#286
	Postage... Suffering from ads?

Well, as it turns out, slinking down into the the basement for the weekend is not exactly consistent with being the boss. Expecially when there are plenty of scheduled activities on the calendar. Still, I got nearly 8 turns done, and here they are.

Turnlog later today (which is meeting-intensive).

-Jrabbit

Attachment: ne_a1788.zip
This has been downloaded 3 time(s).

	07-04-2003 16:55									#287
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Same zipfile, but not renamed to PC-friendly title.

Attachment: consul ned ludd 1788 a.d.zip
This has been downloaded 2 time(s).

	07-04-2003 19:15									#288
	Increase Your PM Length

Sorry, _Jrabbit, both types refuse to open. Missing bits.

Can you remember the solution you used for Minnie??

If your family lets you "slink away" to play a computer game on a busy weekend, then, I think you are a Lucky rabbit, indeed.

Monk

	07-04-2003 20:55									#289
	Remove this text

I actually have one more turn to play, but was feeling guilty for not getting it all in this weekend. (Over 50 cities, lots of micromanagement -- very time-consuming.) I believe we need 5 more techs, then build and launch.

So, should I press on to my 8th turn tonight, or let the rest of the group finish?

I'll let the group weigh in on that while in Meeting Hell today.

BTW -- Things went quite well (except for the attacks that broke the shipchain in - iirc - 1786).

	07-04-2003 21:18									#290
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

By all means, play on.

Monk

	08-04-2003 02:49									#291
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

OK, I finish tonight.

	08-04-2003 03:05									#292
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Play list updated...

1. obiwan18
2. SG(2)
3. Jrabbit (switched with Hydey)
4. Hydey (switched with Jrabbit)
5. SCG
6. STYOM
7. SG[1]
8. Bloody Monk
9. La Fayette

Play 8 turns, pls.

Last edited by Six Thousand Year Old Man on 09-04-2003 at 02:52

	08-04-2003 03:06									#293
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Yes, play all of your turns little bunny.

	08-04-2003 08:38									#294
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

I think that I fixed your earlier Zip JRabbit.

File name should be ne_1788.sav

Attachment: ne_1786.sav
This has been downloaded 18 time(s).

	08-04-2003 09:16									#295
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Sorry, obi, no joy.

This opens with, "This is not a save file."

@_Jrabbit,

Send it from your work pc, please. That worked with mi_a1740, recently. I continue to believe something has gone wrong with your compression program, since it used to be workable.

Monk

	08-04-2003 11:01									#296
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Actually, I believe you may be right and I'm contacting the maker.

Planning to send from the work PC this after sleeping. But in the meantime, here's the zipped save, again attempting U/L from the Mac...

Attachment: ne_a1790.zip
This has been downloaded 4 time(s).

	08-04-2003 21:02									#297
	Rabbitlog Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

1774 and Consul -Jrabbit Ludd takes the helm. Our might Republic boasts 51 cities and 31 MM ppl, with several still celbrating under a 70-0-30 regimen. 12 total techs needed to reach our goals of Space Flight, Superconductor, and Laser. Well-equipped shipchain leaves no choice but a goal of one tech per turn through trade bonuses.

Make some minor adjustments, rushbuy a bunch of white goods and freights, and press ENTER...

1776 -- Population 34,370,000
Barbs galore. Germans now a monarchy.
Computers --> Atomic Theory.
Bribe German musket. Bribe Leipzig for about 1200, 123 GP returned.
Senate supports "peacekeeping" efforts vs. Germans.
Freight deliveries: Caernarfon Hides, 198. Cardiff Gold 150, Hides 513. Carmarthen Spice 204. Kells silver 210, hides 624, oil 384, Armagh silver 245.

1778 -- Population 35,660,000
Much tickling. TOO MANY CITIES! This will take awhile...
Germans bribe Leipzig back, take Consription.
Atomic Theory is ours, no choice but to take Flight next.
Battleship kills ironclad, makes Vet.
Our spy visits Leipzig, talks lovingly of our glorious Republic, donates 651 GP to local political action group. Leipzigians revolt (3rd time in 2 turns ), return 69gp on our investment.
deliveries: Spice to Carmarthen, 1152 , wine 318 and gems 160 to Kells, coal170 to antioch, Oil 70 to Tarsus, beads 423 to Cardiff.
Zulus chat -- they are now allied with Celts, at peace with us.

1780 -- Population 37,250,000
Celts go to Republic, start naval activity that threatens the Holy Shipchain.
Flight is ours, Radio is next.
Bribe German oil caravan near Hamburg.
Deliveries -- Hides to Kells x2 (114, 171), Cardiff 390. Oil to Kells 131. coal to Caernarfon 130. Wine to Caernarfon 48. Cloth to Cardiff 110. Oh, and some good ones -- Gems to Caernarfon972, Wool to Cardiff 596.
Subvert Slim Buttes, maintaining our Spotless rep at a cost of 2330, less 207 plunder.

1782 -- Poulation 39,550,000
Random blackclicks reveal cities at 67,17 and 38,30.
Celebration list continues to grow.
Many engineers at work on rail nets, double irrigation, and some minor exploration.
Radio discovered. Advanced Flight next.
Kill 2 Celtic Frigates with total of 3 on board.
Bribe another German camel -- since the German trade area is so remote, these will be used to help finance hardware for the propose carpet-bombing of Berlin.
Troops take Persian city of Susa and 347 plunder.
Verona founde on 2 whale spot. (But why????)
Another Persian city, Tarsus, revolts for 744, returns 279 for our investment.
Deliveries -- Cardiff salt 170, silver 830, hides 390. Caernarfon coal 177, Kells dye 628, hides 152. Intombe silk 100.
Subvert friendly Zulu village of Intombe. Cost over 2K but Rourkes Drift now has a companion city...
Go on a white goods spending spree, bringing us down to 72 GP in treasury. But we're getting supermarkets, banks, aqueducts, sewer systems, and courthouses throughout the realm.

1784 -- Population 42,610,000
Many celebrations ending.
Advanced Flight :evilgrinurs. Choices are amphibious warfare, mobile warfare, and recycling. Opt for Armored Mobile Tanks, baby!!
Salamis founded. We are probably too close to the stars to waste time with new cities, but old habits dies hard...
Hut nets 100gp.
first pollution appears near Arkwright.
Deliveries -- Caernarfon gems 156, Cardiff hides 128, Armagh silver 680. Insatiable Kells accepts Dye 360, oil 155, copper 764, hides 402.

1786 -- Population 44,050,000
Zulus learn Atomic Theory.
We start building bombers to control the German Menace.
WLTCD returns in force, adjusting only workers, not our sliders, which remain parked at 30-0-70.
Mobile Warfare is ours. Back on track with Rocketry next.
shipchain broken, requiring repairs. But my predessessor provided enough materials to do this without missing a delivery!!
Deliveries -- Reveers shipchain begins, carrying goods from sioux lands and Rourke's Drift back to the homeland. Salt to Bessemer 66, to Hargreaves 114. Gold to Tyre 176. dye to Carmarthen 208, Kells x2 620, 88. Silver to Cardiff 264. Hides to Kells 402. Beads to Cardiff 294.

1788 -- Population 45,770,000
Apollo Food Storage Facility in Newcomen now has 7 freights a-waiting.
Rocketry is in the fold, with Nuclear Fission to come.
Rumors of spanish presence confirmed by discovery of Barcelona (8).
Sioux city of Cedar Creek revolts, 1417 - 225 cost, netting Copernicus.
Bribe Sioux city of Killen 112 - 15 and resulting in PEACE!
Hut contains Advanced Tribe of Lisbon (2).
Blitzkrieg of Berlin begins -- 2 dead riflemen, 2 vet bombers.
Deliveries -- Carmerthen hides 156/147/382, gems 139, Salt 179, dye 796. Oil to Arkwright 231. Wool to Cardiff 568. Sent something to Berenice, too, got 52.

1790 -- Population 48,470,000
Celts, Zulus now have Atomic Theory.
whereas we have Nuclear Fission!! Space flight not offered so now it's Nuclear Power.
white goods focus shifts to shield production. Several factories now in production to this end.
Find/bribe Valencia (5) @ 400 - 150gp.
Find Saragossa (6).
City of Rabbit's Folly is founded.
Clever spy bribes isolated city of Barcelona (8) for 470 - 197.
Battleship emties Sardis, spy bribes local cannon to enter city, netting 132 plunder.
Persians sue for peace and we reluctantly accept.
Deliveries -- all to Kells. Perhaps we should rename as "Old Reliable" or "Insatiable." Copper 764, dye x4 = 278, 278, 328, 358. Beads 147, gems 342, hides 180, and silver 354.

Closing notes --
1. There are 3 westbound freights on transport outside of Bee for home continent delivery next turn.
2. All we need to reach the stars = Space Flight (should be offered next, Laser/Plastics --> Superconductor, and Nuclear Power.
3. Planning the Apollo build in Newcomen. You'll find a bunch of food freights waiting there (a few more needed, I believe).
4. The Germans really annoyed me, so I built a fleet of 3 bombers to empty Berlin. Troops are poised to march in.
5. Don't know why I founded any new cities when there are so many nice ones ripe for the taking. Planning to take a refresher course at The Institute.
6. Xinned only enough to keep the tech rate at 1x (book rate generally about 8 turns, sometimes 9x or 10x).
7. Micromanagement is time-consuming but actually kinda fun in a sick way.
8. I think we've learned that a HUGE Republic is not only possible but actually a strong force by the endgame. Zero science, and we're so far ahead of the AI civs it's ridiculous.

This will be the earliest landing, and the biggest civ, I've ever been associated with.
Kudos to my predecessors!

Attachment: ne_a1790.zip
This has been downloaded 5 time(s).

	09-04-2003 00:10									#298
	Experiment -- Please HELP Suffering from ads?

OK, so I'm trying to determine if my zipfile problem is based on
(a) faulty upload facility (either on my home iMac or perhaps related to the interaction of the Mac with Poly,
or
(b) corrupted ZipIt utility (a Mac shareware pgm that has previously worked just fine).

--The file I posted last night was my standard ZipIt, which in the past was easily opened by WinZip or any other "normal" PC decompressor.

--The file immediately north of this (in the turnlog post) is that same file, emailed to work and delivered to Poly via my PC there.

--The file attached to this post is the original Mac save, emailed to the work PC, compressed via WinZip and delivered herein.

If anyone has a bit of free time, I'd appreciate a report on results obtained in trying to open all 3 of these files. Any relevant info (software, OS used, "little tricks" needed to wheedle an attachment into opening appreciated.

Meanwhile, I've emailed my shareware maker and awit his response.

Thanx.................

Attachment: ludd1790.zip
This has been downloaded 5 time(s).

	09-04-2003 02:47									#299
	Re: Experiment -- Please HELP Increase the size of your Attachments

_Jrabbit,

I believe your ZipIt util is broken.

--The first one sent from home, does not open. "not a valid zip file"
--The second and third both open, but not as .sav files. They are fine if the ".sav" extension is added.

Opening with WinZip on XPHome.

Suggest this means the Poly angle is not the problem. Hopefully, the shareware guys will give you a new (ie, uncorrupted) file to work with. I seem to remember that your uploads have always needed the addition of the ".sav" extention, but that, you used to be able to successfully send from home. I know this is rattling your "cage" and I hope it all gets cleared up soon.

Hope this helps....

Monk

	09-04-2003 03:22									#300
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Thanks, Monk. Hoping your take on this is correct, cuz if it's not ZipIt, then it's the iMac.