14-11-2004 03:44									#211
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The numbers (with the cooperation of our number specialist, you know who )

Turns needed to discover Radio when the save arrives: 2 turns
Science rate needed for a 2 turns Radio: 50%
Gold at 50% = 120 gpt
2 turns of gold at 50% = 2 x 120 = 240

Gold at 0% science: 965 gpt
2 turns of gold at 0% = 2 x 965 = 1930

Splitting the difference with ND would mean:
(1930 - 240) / 2 = 845 for each of us

That would mean extra 845 gold for us in 2 turns, and the same amount of money for ND.

	14-11-2004 05:01									#212
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I very much like this idea. Let's hope ND accepts. (And hope that they have Computers coming to them as well. )

Edited by Tiberius: corrected the smiley

Last edited by Tiberius on 14-11-2004 at 05:08

	14-11-2004 13:26									#213
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I have just PMed Darekill with the proposal.

	17-11-2004 15:01									#214
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There goes the ND plan... we are alone-alone in this fight.

quote: Hello Vondrack, sorry it took quite a while for us to discuss your generous offer. To make a long story short. We can't take it. We have our reasons that you'll understand after the game endet. I'm sorry but for Lego the game will be over soon. That is what I and most of my team think. the best you can hope for is to put up a hard fight. The best we can do is to stay neutral and don't interfere. I'm going a long way to offer you the following and maybe it won't be possible at all but there is a chance that we will be able to offer you assylum if this will be needed. The information you gave us are interesting. We use them. We are prepared for the world after Lego and we are ready to face it. Maybe ND will fail and maybe it'll be GS and GoW who will fight for the victory but I belive that there will be more surprising events before that happens. Greetings Darekill

The info Darekill mentions was I told him both GS and GoW had mobilized.

As for me... we either win/survive this on our own or we die fighting. I'd not seek any assylum, should things go wrong.

On an interesting note... even ND knows that this is not a war to "cut Lego to size". Even they know GS & GoW mean to destroy us completely...

Oh, well... we better prepare for some dogged resistance.

	17-11-2004 19:27									#215
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Asylum

... and btw, fvck ND.

	17-11-2004 19:41									#216
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quote: Originally posted by Tiberius Asylum ... and btw, fvck ND.

Dido

	17-11-2004 21:24									#217
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I can't believe they actually said to us that they thought we'd lose.

	17-11-2004 21:26									#218
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quote: Maybe ND will fail and maybe it'll be GS and GoW who will fight for the victory but I belive that there will be more surprising events before that happens.

Well, the only thing I can think is that GoW has promised them that after Lego is gone, they'll team up to take out GS. I think that's a load of horse****, and ND is going to find itself on the wrong end of a tank rush.

Oh well, in the words of Legos the Wise: "We'll kick some ass even without those German b*****ds!"

	17-11-2004 22:06									#219
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Well, at least they did not give us any false hope. We would be trying to cultivate a relationship/deal that would never happen. We know where they stand....neutral (for now) and they are making no deals.

	17-11-2004 22:39									#220
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As much as I am disappointed myself that ND washed their hands, we can hardly blame ND for their decision. We did exactly (and I mean exactly) the same to RP in the Great Bobian War. ND owe us nothing and believe their best option is to let us go down - fine then, we will have to make do without their help. They were at least kind enough to tell us fair and square.

We are not dead yet. We are actually far from being dead ATM. To kill us won't be an easy task, even with all the power GS & GoW are bringing in. Just that surviving will hurt more than with ND helping us out a bit.

Quoting my favourite hero, King Theoden of Rohan: "...but we will meet them in battle nevertheless." ::determined_smiley_here::

	17-11-2004 23:29									#221
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack As for me... we either win/survive this on our own or we die fighting. I'd not seek any assylum, should things go wrong.

We need to talk to Vox, though; and see what they want to do. It's only a matter of time before we lose, so if they want to seek asylum with ND rather than go down with us, they need to start talking to them now. (Edit: Well, maybe now is premature. Let's see what things look like when we open our turn before Vox talks to ND, if they wish to do so.) I doubt GS & GoW will be looking on them favorably once we're out of the picture; maybe they'll let them be, but Vox shouldn't count on it.

quote: Originally posted by Lord Nuclear I can't believe they actually said to us that they thought we'd lose.

I think we're going to lose, after receiving this latest message. We can't fight off two major shield producers forever. We have a chance at beating back this wave, but it will hurt. I think we're going to end up abandoning some cities next turn.

	17-11-2004 23:43									#222
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I am less of a defeatist than Kloreep , but I am afraid he is probably right about having to abandon a city or two this coming turn... our enemies would have to do something wrong to let us keep everything.

	18-11-2004 01:07									#223
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I'm trying to stay positive, but the sinking feeling is that ND knows something that is semi-catastrophic; possibly something that is happening on this turn.

I am one of those poor souls who saw his mighty civilization turned into a doughnut...all in one turn. Of course, I did not have the brain power that we have, but I also was not facing two mighty armies. So I am prepared for the worse.

	18-11-2004 01:20									#224
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack As much as I am disappointed myself that ND washed their hands, we can hardly blame ND for their decision. We did exactly (and I mean exactly) the same to RP in the Great Bobian War.

Well, not quite exactly. We didn't want to help them militarily, because we were not able to. But we wanted to help them with other means, until the moment when GS interfered, at which moment we considered that GS was more dangereous than GoW + ND so we abandoned any help. Even so, we gave them a luxury free. One more thing: RP was always hard to deal with: arrogant, greedy, etc. We never were, we always offered cooperation and good treaties to ND.
So, fvck them!

quote: ND owe us nothing and believe their best option is to let us go down - fine then, we will have to make do without their help. They were at least kind enough to tell us fair and square.

While I appreciate that they were straight to tell us the truth, I think they are wrong. A word without us will be much unsafer for them than one with a maybe weaker Lego, but one that would be able to help them, be it militarily or just economically.

quote: We are not dead yet. We are actually far from being dead ATM. To kill us won't be an easy task, even with all the power GS & GoW are bringing in. Just that surviving will hurt more than with ND helping us out a bit. Quoting my favourite hero, King Theoden of Rohan: "...but we will meet them in battle nevertheless." ::determined_smiley_here::

AMEN.

Let's show them! Just because. ::determined_smiley_here:

PS Should we lose everything and remain with one city only, I suggest to rename it St.Petersburg and defend it till the bitter end Radek knows what I'm talking about

	18-11-2004 01:21									#225
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quote: Originally posted by lmtoops I'm trying to stay positive, but the sinking feeling is that ND knows something that is semi-catastrophic; possibly something that is happening on this turn. I am one of those poor souls who saw his mighty civilization turned into a doughnut...all in one turn. Of course, I did not have the brain power that we have, but I also was not facing two mighty armies. So I am prepared for the worse.

Have some faith Leo

	18-11-2004 01:55									#226
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quote: Originally posted by Tiberius Well, not quite exactly. We didn't want to help them militarily, because we were not able to. But we wanted to help them with other means, until the moment when GS interfered, at which moment we considered that GS was more dangereous than GoW + ND so we abandoned any help. Even so, we gave them a luxury free. One more thing: RP was always hard to deal with: arrogant, greedy, etc. We never were, we always offered cooperation and good treaties to ND. So, fvck them!

I meant it in a bit different way - we let RP go down because of the "grand scheme of things". Yes, they're difficult to deal with and all, but ultimately, it mattered little - it was the long-term strategy making us side with GoW/ND, effectively sealing RP's fate. It wasn't personal, at least not primarily, but we still let them fall - because they simply didn't fit well into our own plans. I believe it's the same with ND now. If it was personal, perhaps they'd help. But it is not - they are following their own goals, which are, at this moment, not compatible with ours. So they believe, that is.

quote: Originally posted by Tiberius While I appreciate that they were straight to tell us the truth, I think they are wrong. A world without us will be much unsafer for them than one with a maybe weaker Lego, but one that would be able to help them, be it militarily or just economically.

I tend to agree here... though only time will tell, whether it'd us or them being right.

quote: Originally posted by Tiberius PS Should we lose everything and remain with one city only, I suggest to rename it St.Petersburg and defend it till the bitter end Radek knows what I'm talking about

Of course I know what you are talking about... and Leo probably knows as well, since he had something to do with that city eventually, too...

I am not so desperate yet, though. Seeing some of our glorious cities abandoned will hurt, but if we are able to concentrate our defenses, things will get better.

And there's still your fine diplo GS plan... I believe what we need to do now is to prove that killing us off won't be as easy as everybody seems to believe. Once the balance of power shifts (in whatever direction), there will be new opportunities. GoW, GS, and ND feel safe at this moment, which makes them unreceptive to any new ideas - all of them believe things are going to happen as planned. Once we prove them wrong and any of them starts to feel unsafe, it will be our time...

We have 90+ infantry, almost 40 tanks, and 60+ arty pieces! This war is not yet over.

	18-11-2004 02:54									#227
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack And there's still your fine diplo GS plan... I believe what we need to do now is to prove that killing us off won't be as easy as everybody seems to believe. Once the balance of power shifts (in whatever direction), there will be new opportunities. GoW, GS, and ND feel safe at this moment, which makes them unreceptive to any new ideas - all of them believe things are going to happen as planned. Once we prove them wrong and any of them starts to feel unsafe, it will be our time... We have 90+ infantry, almost 40 tanks, and 60+ arty pieces! This war is not yet over.

Right now I'm a bit worried about my plan, as it seems that all the other teams except Vox are serious about completely eliminating us. But you are right: as the situation changes, there will be new opportunities and we will be able hopefully to shake their confidence a bit. Then they will be ready to talk

	18-11-2004 03:59									#228
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack We have 90+ infantry, almost 40 tanks, and 60+ arty pieces! This war is not yet over.

Oh, there is still fight left in me. I wish they would hurry up a bit. I'm getting very inpatient.

	18-11-2004 04:15									#229
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack quote: Originally posted by Tiberius While I appreciate that they were straight to tell us the truth, I think they are wrong. A word without us will be much unsafer for them than one with a maybe weaker Lego, but one that would be able to help them, be it militarily or just economically. I tend to agree here... though only time will tell, whether it'd us or them being right.

Their message seems to indicate to me that they think they have something up their sleeve. What that could possibly be, I don't know.