04-05-2003 19:43									#181
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Maybe this will not help anything, but in few PBEM games in which i am involved, there were two almost same kind of bugs, and they were fixed by replaying the turn and adjusting preferences during the turn, before saving, with CTRL-P to something totally different than what they were before.

Atleast trying it will not hurt anyone, even i have to admit that it sounds very strange.

	04-05-2003 22:27									#182
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DP

	04-05-2003 22:27									#183
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This is gonna end up like the scene from 'weird science'

	04-05-2003 23:33									#184
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber If our current attempt to fix the problem (returning to Lego's previous turn and retracing from there; I understand that RP has the save now) doesn't yield any positive results, perhaps we should try the same thing over again, except Lego would upgrade to 1.21 before playing their previous turn and sending it to GS. Perhaps there's something in the 1.21 patch that would solve the problem, and it only works if it is applied the turn previous to the one that crashes.

When I ran the game from 710, I used the 1.21 patch, still crashed.

	04-05-2003 23:46									#185
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we have replayed the save and sent it to Vox. Let's see how it goes...

--Togas

	05-05-2003 00:23									#186
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quote: Originally posted by asleepathewheel When I ran the game from 710, I used the 1.21 patch, still crashed.

Aww krap...
Could you try Conqueror's solution? Or have you already tried that?

	05-05-2003 00:34									#187
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Aww krap... Could you try Conqueror's solution? Or have you already tried that?

I tried that, still crashed for me

	05-05-2003 01:39									#188
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Replayed (on my old system just to be doubly sure - although I have no problems with other pbem games on my new install) and forwarded to Legos. Fingers crossed.

	05-05-2003 10:04									#189
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Even the fully replayed 570BC eound savegame I received from Beta this night crashes... exactly like all the other saves before (but I admit I am not surprised - I haven't expected it to work after what asleepatwheel found out... it seems the problem was introduced many turns ago - it just waited for "its moment").

I believe our last hope is nye's contact at Firaxis.

BTW, should we manage to get out of this mess, I would not ask for asleepatwheel withdrawing from the game completely. All I would ask for would be that he remains just an observing member of GS - not posting or voting, so that he cannot even subconsiously use the information gained by examining the faulty save. Having to leave the team altogether would seem too much to me, considering the context.

	05-05-2003 11:50									#190
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack Even the fully replayed 570BC eound savegame I received from Beta this night crashes... exactly like all the other saves before (but I admit I am not surprised - I haven't expected it to work after what asleepatwheel found out... it seems the problem was introduced many turns ago - it just waited for "its moment"). I believe our last hope is nye's contact at Firaxis.

A very strange bug. I wonder if we looked at a 4000BC save if we would find this game doomed from the start. Hopefully Firaxis can repair it or at least figure out what is wrong with it. It would be such a shame to lose a game that a hundred players have invested hours and hours (and thousands of posts ) in, very disheartening, especially when it was getting tense.

quote: Originally posted by vondrack BTW, should we manage to get out of this mess, I would not ask for asleepatwheel withdrawing from the game completely. All I would ask for would be that he remains just an observing member of GS - not posting or voting, so that he cannot even subconsiously use the information gained by examining the faulty save. Having to leave the team altogether would seem too much to me, considering the context.

I knew when I looked at the save what the consequences would be. That said, I would greatly appreciate watching the action on the GS forum as it unfolds when I can.

Of course, if Lego sold the world the map, then my "knowledge" would become outdated rather quickly j/k of course.

I just hope someone can fix this game....

	05-05-2003 13:02									#191
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I still say that an outside person can recreate the game in it's entirety by creating a scenario out of the current game. The map can be exported, using Gramphos's tool. The units, cities, improvements, buildings can all be placed according to in-game specifications, right up to the amount of culture a given city has. If Firaxis can't come up with a fix we should do this; wasting all that play time wouldn't make anyone happy.

It would take someone quite a bit of time to do this, but it can be done.

Else, we have the PTWDG II starting in about a month.

	05-05-2003 16:47									#192
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Do we have anyone at Firaxis we can contact about this. I would think this first PTW Demo game would be bad publicity for them if it was unplayable because of bugs in their programming.

	05-05-2003 16:48									#193
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb Do we have anyone at Firaxis we can contact about this.

Isn't that what NYE has done? Or did I misread something?

At the very least we need to get them to take a long hard look at the saves so they can fix the bug (whatever the f**k it is) in the next patch.

	05-05-2003 16:54									#194
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb I would think this first PTW Demo game would be bad publicity for them if it was unplayable because of bugs in their programming.

Good thinking. But ohh, that's nothing... imagine if the same happened in the ISDG! Then Firaxis would have 8 sites going after them!

	05-05-2003 18:13									#195
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Firaxis - help!

	05-05-2003 18:50									#196
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Good thinking. But ohh, that's nothing... imagine if the same happened in the ISDG! Then Firaxis would have 8 sites going after them!

Absolutely, we need to bring this situation to the attention of the entire ISDG and inform them there is a strong possibility we may not be able to finish the game as PTW appears to be fatally flawed.

Then see if Firaxis fixes it.

	05-05-2003 19:02									#197
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And then we'll all march down to Firaxis's headquarters with pitchforks and torches and demand that they fix our game!
Who is with me?

	05-05-2003 20:40									#198
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Question - as this is essentially the same as all the pbem games being played - has anyone else experienced or know about a similar issue with any of the pbem games out there.

Presumably some of them have gotten as far or farther than we have.

And a second question - if someone in this game did play the save using 1.21, does it necessarily crash with the next person to use 1.14, or can it last a number of turns. I always thought it would happen right away.

	05-05-2003 20:54									#199
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I think it would be a lot more diplomatic to give Firaxis a chance to deal with the matter quietly before bringing it up with the ISDG community.

	05-05-2003 20:57									#200
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quote: Originally posted by asleepathewheel When I ran the game from 710, I used the 1.21 patch, still crashed.

That's very not good...

From what I know about things like this, if that's really what happened, then there's nothing we can do... I fear that this game may be finished.

	05-05-2003 20:58									#201
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Of course, I was just joking around.
Besides, I don't have any pitchforks at home anyway.

Last edited by Shiber on 05-05-2003 at 21:07

	05-05-2003 21:40									#202
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Of course, I was just joking around. Besides, I don't have any pitchforks at home anyway.

Who wouldn't think you were joking around?


Sheesh



Firaxis get bad publicity for PTW? I think I've heard that one before....

	05-05-2003 21:42									#203
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quote: Originally posted by BetaHound And a second question - if someone in this game did play the save using 1.21, does it necessarily crash with the next person to use 1.14, or can it last a number of turns. I always thought it would happen right away.

I played from 710 using 1.21 and it crashed, so the bug might be unrelated to the patch differences.

	05-05-2003 22:10									#204
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Has anyone received any response from Firaxis? I emailed them a couple of days ago and haven't received a response (mind you it was the weekend) but considering how many people are involved with this game it might be nice for anyone who gets ANY response from Firaxis to post it in order to update the rest of the community.

Could we at least get a Newz article for Apolyton's main page stating that the PTW Demo game is on hold pending a discovery on how to keep PTW from crashing?

	05-05-2003 22:13									#205
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quote: Originally posted by BigFree I still say that an outside person can recreate the game in it's entirety by creating a scenario out of the current game. The map can be exported, using Gramphos's tool. The units, cities, improvements, buildings can all be placed according to in-game specifications, right up to the amount of culture a given city has. If Firaxis can't come up with a fix we should do this; wasting all that play time wouldn't make anyone happy. It would take someone quite a bit of time to do this, but it can be done. Else, we have the PTWDG II starting in about a month.

As a last ditch, this will work.

	05-05-2003 22:18									#206
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(I know I'm going to regret, this, but) I will reconstruct the map using Gramphos' editor. I believe that using all the features of the C3MT almost everything can be redone except fog-of-war, so all the teams can have fun exploring the map all over again.

	05-05-2003 22:22									#207
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quote: Could we at least get a Newz article for Apolyton's main page stating that the PTW Demo game is on hold pending a discovery on how to keep PTW from crashing?

I will write one up today and send it off to the powers-that-be.

	05-05-2003 22:27									#208
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quote: Originally posted by Trip (I know I'm going to regret, this, but) I will reconstruct the map using Gramphos' editor. I believe that using all the features of the C3MT almost everything can be redone except fog-of-war, so all the teams can have fun exploring the map all over again.

what about the islands that we haven't discovered, what are you going to do about that? there is a large amount of black space right now...

	05-05-2003 22:30									#209
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What would be the problem?

	05-05-2003 22:47									#210
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Also, AFAIK there's no way to set the city production levels is there? I mean, most cities on the map are building something...