13-07-2003 17:34									#31
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other than the multiclass rules (and some limitations on alignment), no

Jon Miller

	13-07-2003 18:08									#32
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Generally you have 32 points?

[edit] And more importantly... can I dual weild?

	13-07-2003 18:12									#33
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anyone can use two weapons

rangers get the dual weild feat for free on first level

other classes can take the two-weapon fighting and ambnidexterity feats

Jon Miller

	13-07-2003 18:22									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger What about multiclass characters? Lawful neutral monk/druid sounds like fun

actually, I was wrong, according to the DMG you can have both at apprentice level

at level 2 you would than get both at level 1 (the normal way to do it is to take 1 at one level and the other at the next)

Jon Miller

	13-07-2003 18:44									#35
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right now I am thinking of a Sun Elf Rogue/Wizard

8/15/12/20/8/10

Jon Miller

	13-07-2003 18:47									#36
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ok, i'll have my chars posted tonight.

sorry, couldn't make it online yesterday.

	13-07-2003 20:32									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller actually, I was wrong, according to the DMG you can have both at apprentice level at level 2 you would than get both at level 1 (the normal way to do it is to take 1 at one level and the other at the next) Jon Miller

Oh cool. How bad are apprentice levels?

	13-07-2003 20:48									#38
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can someone give me some help on how to create a character as i don't know how. i have an idea of who and what i want my character to be but no idea when it comes to dices rolls, skills feats and all the stuff.

	13-07-2003 20:57									#39
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What kind of help do you need?

	13-07-2003 21:30									#40
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i need help with

things like the values for strength charisma etc and what is important to have. and how to determine values for.

values for init, hp etc. basicall everthing that has a value

what possessions do i start with?
starting weapons?
What skills do i have? can i just decide what skills i have?
what is a feat?
do i decide what languages i speak?

	13-07-2003 21:32									#41
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I may help with mechanics of character creation, but i need to know what type of character do you need.
--
To MattH:

Do you want melee, archer or caster cleric? What alignment do you want? Pure cleric casting progression (i mean w/o caster progression loss)? Something else what you want to mention?
--
To Makeo:
Please post what kind of character do you want.
--
To Urban Ranger:
At Apprentice level you have full Hit Points/Base Attack Bonus (BAB), but only half of the class abilities.

More important is what you will be 1 level behind later. Generally it's bad for pure spellcasters.

	13-07-2003 21:34									#42
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How does multiclass work in 3rd edition anyway? When I played, it was just splitting XP among the various classes.

As to "class abilities," does it mean skills, feats, or both?

	13-07-2003 22:12									#43
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quote: As to "class abilities," does it mean skills, feats, or both?

I forgot details, so i can't tell for sure.

quote: How does multiclass work in 3rd edition anyway? When I played, it was just splitting XP among the various classes.

Multiclassing.
You have a Character level equal to a sum of your levels in various classes. Effective Character Level (ECL) = Character Level + level adjustment of your race.

Progression in table Table 3–2: Experience and Level-Dependent Benefits is for Effective Character Level (ECL).

So, Human Fighter 2/Cleric 2 has a Character Level 4 and Effective Character Level 4 (=4+0). To gain another level in any class you need to have 10.000 Exp (you have 6.000 Exp at ECL 4, so you need to gain only 4.000) - so you'll have Effective Character Level 5 - and you may become Human Fighter 3/Cleric 2 or Human Fighter 2/Cleric 3.

If you have a non-zero level adjustment race, say Aasimar (level adjustment +1) Fighter 2/Cleric 2 has Character Level 4 and Effective Character Level 5 (=4+1). Then to gain another level in any class you need to have 15.000 Exp (you have 10.000 Exp at ECL 5, so you need to gain only 5.000) - so you'll have Effective Character Level 6 - and you may become Aasimar Fighter 3/Cleric 2 or Aasimar Fighter 2/Cleric 3.

Effectively this means that you may be say a Fighter 10, Cleric 5/Fighter 5 or Aasimar Cleric 5/Fighter 4 - they are considered of equal ECL.

HP, BAB, skills, feats from different classes adds up.

	13-07-2003 22:22									#44
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Okay, here's my character. He's a halfling sorcerer from Silverymoon.

For a first level group, it is always good to have at least one "tripper" (Fighter tweaked for trip attacks). Is someone going to create one?

I tried to put explanatory bits in everywhere I could (in brackets) for the newbies. Please feel free to ask questions about anything you don't understand.

I used 120gp to start with - I believe someone said use the max. For the newbs: 1 gold piece=10 silver pieces=100 copper pieces

==========
NAME: Rags
RACE: Halfling
GENDER: Male
CLASS: Sorcerer
ALIGNMENT: Chaotic Neutral
LVL: 1

REGION: Silverymoon

SPEED: 20ft

ATTRIBUTES:

Attribute: Stat (point cost) [modifier]

STR: 10 (4) [ 0] (-2 racial bonus)
DEX: 16 (6) [+3] (+2 racial bonus)
CON: 14 (6) [+2]
INT: 14 (6) [+2]
WIS: 8 (0) [-1]
CHA: 16 (10)[+3]

HP: 6 (d4 + 2 Con)
AC: 14 (10 base + 3 Dex, + 1 Size)
INIT: +3 (DEX)

FORT: +3 (0 base, +2 con, +1 racial)
REF: +4 (0 base, +3 dex, +1 racial)
WILL: +2 (2 base, -1 wis, +1 racial)

FEATS: Smooth Talk (FRCS)

SKILLS:

Climb - 2 (racial bonus)
Concentration - 4 (4 ranks)
Diplomacy - 6 (4 ranks, Smooth Talk)
Gather Information - 4 (4 ranks)
Hide - 4 (racial bonus)
Jump - 2 (racial bonus)
Knowledge (Arcana) - 2 (2 ranks)
Listen - 2 (racial bonus)
Move Silently - 2 (racial bonus)
Sense Motive - 2 (Smooth Talk)
Spellcraft - 2 (2 ranks)

These skill scores do not include the ability modifiers. (i.e. Move Silenty is 5 after Dex bonus)

SPELLS:
Cantrips (0-level): Light, Mage Hand, Open/Close, Detect Magic
1st Level: Magic Missle, Change Self

Spells per day: 5 cantrips, 4 1st level
Spell DC: 13 + spell level

LANGUAGE:
Racial: Common, Halfling
Regional: Chondathan, Illuskan
Bonus: Elven, Dwarven

ATTACKS: Ranged +4 (DEX, size bonus); Melee +1 (size bonus)
WEAPONS: Crossbow, Light (1d8, 19-20/x2); Mace, Light (1d6, x2)

EQUIPMENT:

Explorer's Outfit (free) (2 lbs)
Spell Component Pouch (5 gp) ( 1 lb)
Crossbow, Light (35 gp) (6 lbs)
20 Bolts (2 gp) (2 lbs)
Mace, Light (5 gp) (6 lbs)
1 Cure Light Wounds Potion (50 gp)
Alchemist's fire (20 gp) (1 1/4 lb)
2 Flasks (6 cp)
Mug (2 cp) (1 lb)

2 gp, 9 sp, 2 cp

Total cost/weight: 117 gp, 8 cp / 20 lbs

Carrying Capacities:
Normal - 25 lbs
Medium - 50 lbs
Heavy - 75 lbs
==========

Edit: Mistake in Wisdom attribute fixed.

Last edited by dejon on 14-07-2003 at 02:46

	13-07-2003 22:23									#45
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i've never ever ever played.......

chaotic neutral human fighter. thinking about multiclassing with rogue but don't know if that is a good idea since i don't know what i'm doing and it might make it too complicated.

	13-07-2003 22:27									#46
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Matt: (insert reply here)

Drake: Yes

Faboba: And more importantly... can I dual weild? - Yes, but the standard penalties are ridiculously high. You need the: Ambidexterity and Two Weapon Fighting feats as well as for your off hand weapon to be light in order to minimize your penalties (from -6/-10 to -2/-2). Rangers get those two feats free as long as they are wearing light or no armor (i.e. anything as light as or lighter than a chain shirt.)

	13-07-2003 22:31									#47
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For those of you who don't have the books, this might help:

http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html

It gives info on most of the basic classes, feats, and races.

Matt, dwarves now get +2 con, -2 cha in 3rd edition.

For a cleric specifically:

Str - increases chance to hit and damage of melee weapon. Depending on how often you intend to use your melee weapon, this may or may not be very important. At low levels, when you don't have a lot of spells, this can help a lot more than later on.
Dex - increases your armor class. Though heavy armor will cap the maximum AC bonus you can get from dexterity. In the long term, if you see yourself wearing full plate, you can't get more than +1 to your AC from dex.
Con - is hitpoints and also the Concentration skill is con-based (i.e. you add your con modifier to your concentration rolls). Concentration is used for a variety of reasons when someone is trying to interrupt your spell-casting.

Int - Only gives you extra skills. Good, but not crucial.
WIS - THIS IS IMPORTANT. You can't cast any spells of level higher than (Wis - 10). While at level 1 you won't be casting any spells of level above 1, long term if your wisdom is only like 14, that's a bad thing. Wisdom grants bonus spells per day (at level 1 anything from 12-19 is just one extra level 1 spell). Your wisdom bonus is also added to the DC of the saves of spells you cast.
Cha - This is really not that useful for a cleric. It helps your ability to turn undead. Sure if you make it really, really high, I might throw more undead at you to turn, but aside from that and from social interaction, charisma isn't nearly as important as wisdom.

Of course, if you want to multiclass later on, not all of this may apply.

Last edited by Victor Galis on 13-07-2003 at 22:42

	13-07-2003 22:48									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Makeo i've never ever ever played....... chaotic neutral human fighter. thinking about multiclassing with rogue but don't know if that is a good idea since i don't know what i'm doing and it might make it too complicated.

Start with Victor's guide in the other thread - here.

If you find any explanation for any of the ackronyms and stats confusing, or missing, just ask for clarification.

I do see that Victor omitted Initiative. It comes into play during the start of combat, to determine in what order the characters will act. A higher Init will make it more likely that you'll be among the first to act, while a low Init may mean everyone will go before you. Your Init modifier is the sum of your Dexterity modifier, and any special Init modifiers you have from feats or spells. With everyone at first level, there is bound to be a bunch of tied Init scores and the order will end up being somewhat random. Don't worry about it too much.

If you've never played, keep it simple. CN human fighter is a good idea. Most important attribute is strength. Consider if you want to be a tank, or a more nimble warrior. That will drive other attribute decisions, as well as feat and skill choices.

	14-07-2003 00:11									#49
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This is all very confusing.

	14-07-2003 01:53									#50
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quote: Originally posted by FrustratedPoet This is all very confusing.

But also fun!
Let me know what you need help with.

	14-07-2003 02:05									#51
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did we decide how we get starting equipment? do we just put what we think is good and leave it up to the DM's descretion to allow what you say you have?

	14-07-2003 02:17									#52
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Are composite bows treated as different for proficientcy purposes as regular bows of the same size?

	14-07-2003 02:32									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Kramerman did we decide how we get starting equipment? do we just put what we think is good and leave it up to the DM's descretion to allow what you say you have?

Since we were told to use the max starting gold, I assumed we could specify our equipment. Of course, the DM can always reject something. Seeing as we're starting in Waterdeep, there's not much that wouldn't be available. Just keep it reasonable though, as 1st level characters likely wouldn't know about some magical or strange items.

	14-07-2003 02:38									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Felch Are composite bows treated as different for proficientcy purposes as regular bows of the same size?

Both are martial ranged weapons. So for a class that is proficient in martial weapons, they are proficient with both.

If you mean the Proficiency Feat, then no, each is a seperate specific weapon.

	14-07-2003 02:43									#55
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OK, I do have some stuff here, but I need some help, too. Sketch thus far:

Name: Dolor
Race: Elf
Class: Wizard (need help with specialization)

Stats, apparently

Stength: 13 (5 points used)
Dex: 10 + 2 racial (2 points)
Con: 10 - 2 racial (2 poins)
Int: 18 (16 pts)
Wis: 13 (5 points)
Cha: 10 (2 points)

Can someone please check if I got these correctly, with my race?


I also now need help to determine my HP and the rest.

Questions: should I alter it to give the Wizard a higher Wis ability? As for feat, I will chose one, I guess I'll also get around with skills somehow.

	14-07-2003 02:56									#56
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I can't do this. The more I look at what you all are saying, the more I bog down.
Sounds really cool. I'll do some reading, and maybe another time.

	14-07-2003 03:05									#57
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Hey Sloww, don't despair! I remember when I had my first touch on D&D stuff... well, I am almost at the same level now, but I understand what you feel... do some reading, and get in it .

	14-07-2003 03:10									#58
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I was going to go Ranger, after that I started wandering around behind the little animals.

	14-07-2003 03:11									#59
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i agree with solver. the first time, as it is with most things, was daughnting. its a lot of fun and you will get the hang of it in no time

	14-07-2003 03:17									#60
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Well Kramerman, in no time might be a lit of too reassuring .