20-03-2004 23:20									#1
	Do you believe the Islamist terrorists' goal is to conquer the world? Got spare money?

Some people here seem to think that the Islamists are bent on conquering the whole world and won't stop until this goal is achieved, while others believe that we should appease/negotiate with radical Islamists. What do you think?

	20-03-2004 23:23									#2
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I believe Finland pwns all.

	20-03-2004 23:23									#3
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quote: Current goal is to establish a pan-Islamic Caliphate throughout the world by working with allied Islamic extremist groups to overthrow regimes it deems “non-Islamic” and expelling Westerners and non-Muslims from Muslim countries–particularly Saudi Arabia. Issued statement under banner of “the World Islamic Front for Jihad Against the Jews and Crusaders” in February 1998, saying it was the duty of all Muslims to kill US citizens—civilian or military—and their allies everywhere.

	20-03-2004 23:26									#4
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You cannot negotiate or appease a group whose goal is your extermination.

	21-03-2004 02:26									#5
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Yes, that is their goal

They will make excuses like getting USA out of the middle east and also the Israel Palestine thing but those are just excuses for them to take the political high ground

	21-03-2004 02:35									#6
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quote: Originally posted by PLATO

Why did you turn off reley with quote. How do you know the terrorist goal and do you believe than man who have commitee prejury once in the past. They donot have than world conquest goal at all. There are people in the America government who want to conquest the world like our vice-presidend and all the neocom in america.

	21-03-2004 02:49									#7
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No.

World conquest and world domination are completely different things. For exmaple, the UK had global domination during the middle of the 19th century, and the US has global domination today. Neither ever even contemplated world conquest.

Saying that Muslims want to re-establish the Caliphate would mean the creation of one huge empire, but EVEN if we then "re-add" sections of the world once under direct Muslim control, most of the world remains free. I see no huge attempts by Muslim extermists to conquer China or the Americas (attacking the US and wanting to conquer the US are too very very different things).

The fact is the claim someone seeks world conquest is very farfectched but common hyperbole. Hell, Nazi Germany didn;t want world conquest-neither did Stalin at his height.

	21-03-2004 03:09									#8
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No, because world conquest is impossible

Their most successful goal is disruption.

Of course, short term goals include those things like "getting USA out of Palestine," "getting Jews out of Palestine," that stuff, which is more regular. Their biggest long-term priority, however, is disruption: not DESTROYING our way of life, but making it awful.

	21-03-2004 04:11									#9
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Its Armageddon man, good against evil

	21-03-2004 05:19									#10
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I don't think that they want to conquer the world. I also don't see anything wrong with a Caliphate of nations that are predominantly Muslim or Arab and a vote by their people to join such a government. Democracy at work. I also think that once this government is formed the Muslims can work on rebuilding their society vs destrioying ourselves so they can rebuild in peace.

	21-03-2004 05:21									#11
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The terrorist groups have never been the least bit hesitant about the fact that their goal is to establish a global Islamic state.

	21-03-2004 05:26									#12
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb The terrorist groups have never been the least bit hesitant about the fact that their goal is to establish a global Islamic state.

Let them have the world for I claim the stars.

	21-03-2004 05:43									#13
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Some of them do. But their plans don't match their capabilities. There's no way that they could ever succeed.

	21-03-2004 05:48									#14
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quote: Originally posted by GhengisFarb The terrorist groups have never been the least bit hesitant about the fact that their goal is to establish a global Islamic state.

Like when? Haven't seen much action on their part trying to get Tahiti to convert...or trying to turn Alaska into a Muslim heaven...or....

	21-03-2004 05:50									#15
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That's cause they want "their turf" back first.

	21-03-2004 05:55									#16
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Just because the Islamic terrorists have not attacked everywhere doesn't mean that they wouldn't later. I do think that they intend to at least dominate the world if not conquer it outright. Right now, they are focused on the United States because we're the biggest player on the world stage at the moment.

	21-03-2004 05:56									#17
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Would they want that? Well, yes, it's kind of inherent to their belief system. Their militant system of Islam does not accept the existance of non-Islamic governments as something that should be accepted long term, and that if a foreign people refuse to convert to Islam and set up Islamic governments, then war is an appropriate means to spread Islam.

Of course, they are kind of far from that goal right now and they know it, so they have to work in steps. What they would like to do right now as a precursor to that is set up Taliban like Islamic states in countries with a population that is already Moslem. They see the West as a major impediment to that currently, which is why to hope to through means of terrorism intimidate the west into cease trying to influence the region so they can persue their immediate goals in the Islamic Worl.

But have no doubt that the spreading of Islam by force all over the world is their goal, and that they are willing to butcher innocents to achieve their goal.

	21-03-2004 08:15									#18
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No offense, but Christianity sought global conversion too but and only achieved it partially as did the Muslims in their heyday. But the extremists lose virtually all their support once they expand their goals beyond the immediate concerns of the bulk of their supporters. Let's not forget that Al Qaeda is more at war with their own governments and the US got caught up in a Muslim civil war. US support for various ME governments are the issue and why AQ has support.

	21-03-2004 08:46									#19
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So would it be fair to say that Al Qaeda wants foreign troops out of Saudi Arabia (and the rest of the middle east) not for religious reasons, but for military reasons?

Since any attempt at a coup-d'etat would risk foreign troops getting involved on the side of the current government.

	21-03-2004 09:20									#20
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If your family had been in the WTC when it came down, or the Spanish train when it blew up, or involved in any of the many other terrorist acts against western countries, you wouldn't give a crap what the enemy wanted.

	21-03-2004 09:23									#21
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Absolutely not. They are out to destroy the entire western world.

	21-03-2004 09:32									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer If your family had been in the WTC when it came down, or the Spanish train when it blew up, or involved in any of the many other terrorist acts against western countries, you wouldn't give a crap what the enemy wanted.

On the flip side if your family had been a victim of any peacekeeping ops you would feel the same about the west. That's why the need to talk is so urgent.

	21-03-2004 09:35									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Pax Africanus That's why the need to talk is so urgent.

Talk with terrorists? No. The US doesn't do that.

	21-03-2004 09:40									#24
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Ya, you going to have a nice chat with good ol Binny? Do you recall western peacekeeping ops that targeted civilians?

	21-03-2004 09:40									#25
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quote: In an al-Qaeda house in Afghanistan, New York Times reporters found a brief statement of the “Goals and Objectives of Jihad”: 1.) Establishing the rule of God on earth 2.) Attaining martyrdom in the cause of God 3.) Purification of the ranks of Islam from the elements of depravity In 1998, several al-Qaeda leaders issued a declaration calling on Muslims to kill Americans—including civilians—as well as “those who are allied with them from among the helpers of Satan.”

From the Council of Foriegn Relations

http://cfrterrorism.org/groups/alqaeda2.html

I am pretty sure that #1 doesn't include Christianity or Judiasm. Those of you that say that their goal is not world domination just aren't reading the facts. Perhaps they do wish to start with Muslim countries...getting them straightened out, but there can be no doubt that the rest of the world would be next if it was within their power.

For those of you think that it is okay to even let them dominate the muslim world then I refer you to the opression of the Taliban regime in Afghanistan.

Simply put...Neither of these can be allowed to happen.

	21-03-2004 09:41									#26
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quote: Originally posted by Pax Africanus That's why the need to talk is so urgent.

The leadership of Al Qaeda is more than welcome to walk up to the gate of the nearest Army base to arrange a meeting.

	21-03-2004 09:42									#27
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc The leadership of Al Qaeda is more than welcome to walk up to the gate of the nearest Army base to arrange a meeting.

Does that include 5.56MM rounds discharged at them?

	21-03-2004 09:43									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Pax Africanus On the flip side if your family had been a victim of any peacekeeping ops you would feel the same about the west. That's why the need to talk is so urgent.

This is an incredibly ill informed (to put it more than mildly) statement

	21-03-2004 09:45									#29
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quote: Originally posted by Berzerker Let's not forget that Al Qaeda is more at war with their own governments and the US got caught up in a Muslim civil war. US support for various ME governments are the issue and why AQ has support.

This is very true.

Many of the Muslim governments are overwhelmingly friendly to the USA. But their own populations hate us.

The House of Saud for example is Enemy #4 to them. Israel being #1, USA #2, and now UK #3.

Yay it's good to be in the Top 5.

	21-03-2004 09:47									#30
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quote: Originally posted by GePap Like when? Haven't seen much action on their part trying to get Tahiti to convert...or trying to turn Alaska into a Muslim heaven...or....

Start reading the evidence of al-Qaeda that has been found and then start reading what the terrorist are saying. Those are facts. This one doesn't fit into your "let's all be at peace and if we are not then it's the US fault" standard argument.