14-10-2004 11:11									#271
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I would go to one of our coastal citiesyand calculate how long a curragh will take to build. Then multiply the time by two for two curraghs and give them an answer.

The first answer should be OK fair enough let us figure it out. That will take a couple of days, then send them back the answer, that should be good for a few more days of delay.

By that time hopefully we will be on the brink of T-Turn.

	14-10-2004 15:32									#272
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Thanks con, am about to draft a vague email now.

	14-10-2004 16:10									#273
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I pulled this number out of the air:

quote: Well our current Curragh build will take another 9 turns, but I'm not sure whether we'll be adding any terrain improvements around that city in the meantime to speed that up. This may not be our last Curragh either - something else in discussions now. So I'm afraid I can't be any more specific than that right now Our Distinguished Sentiments, MrWhereItsAt Consul of Apolyton.

	14-10-2004 16:56									#274
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That will do it.

	25-10-2004 17:04									#275
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Ok, well I need to send a brief courtesy message to CDG telling them we are in Anarchy now going into a Republic, perhaps saying this is as a result of a binding poll started some time ago. Sound good?

Anything else I should add? To make the upcoming invasion easier, I was going to somehow suggest that they change Governments sometime too, but not too soon, as PAL leaders are under instructions to attack CDG as soon as they are in Anarchy, and IIRC we are not quite ready for this (plus we're in Anarchy another 4 turns too). Perhaps I can tell CDG that we will have the second wines connected in x turns and tell them that we would have them available to trade with them to help with happiness during any switch of Government. Is that too telling? Should I leave it as the first paragraph says and not risk it? I will be sending this message one way or another within 24 hours, and if I get no feedback I'm afraid it'll be all up to me.

	25-10-2004 19:15									#276
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MWIA? Why do you feel compelled to send a note to CDG? The last we talked to them it looked like we said 9 to 18 turns before we do a tech trade? Why cant we just let it ride a few more turns?

Is there something here Im missing in my Jet Lagged induced state?

Thanks

con

	26-10-2004 01:45									#277
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I just wanted to see if I could head off any suspicion they may feel that PAL and we are both in Anarchy at the same time. To make the war as easy as possible, or at least to prevent them building up now. Not necessary, perhaps, but an idea I think is worth considering.

	26-10-2004 02:53									#278
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OK cool.

Lemme think on this one but my first impression is we should keep the communication and sharing info at a minimal level.

Just enough to engage without giving much away

	26-10-2004 04:32									#279
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Note: CDG's letter to us:

quote: Greetings from the nation of Elucida. As a curteousy, we thought we would tell you of our future plans for regarding expansion towards you. We plan to build a city N-N-NW of Shaharazade within the next couple turns. Best wishes from your friends to the East. -- Micaelis Rex

That spot is the exact spot that our settler is curently at. Maybe we should give them the bad news.

--Togas

	26-10-2004 05:39									#280
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Ummmm, ya. Of course, they will discover that themselves next turn when they see a city there. Tell them to head north

	26-10-2004 09:17									#281
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Proposed reply:

quote: Micaelis Rex, Thanks for the head's up. I'm afriad, though, that we have a little bad news - an Apolytonian settler will build a new city in that exact spot next turn. We apoligize for in the inconvience. [ optional snippet ] And, as long as we've got your attention - we're still discussing the possibilities of a tech trade. We entered anarchy this turn (we expect to establish a republic in four turns). We'll hopefully have a reponse by then, since any new tech coming in during anarchy would be useless to us. [/ optional snippet ] Keep in touch, sender of message

Should we try to make them feel better about the prospects of a tech trade, so as to keep their suspicions low?

	26-10-2004 11:02									#282
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Naw, let's just let them know about the city, not propose a tech trade this late in the game. Let's not deceive them more than we have to.

--Togas

	26-10-2004 14:47									#283
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OK I have MREX"s email, Ill get the short and sweet version out later this morning (USA time)

Unless MWIA beats me to it

	27-10-2004 14:40									#284
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Er, did you do this, con? I'm about to anyway.

And sorry guys, I keep forgetting to bring the chat I had briefly with MRex home to post. WIll do so as soon as I can remember it. Remind me if you see me in chat.

	27-10-2004 14:46									#285
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To CDG belatedly responding to their last email:

quote: Micaelis Rex, Thanks for the head's up (about your settler). I'm afraid, though, that we have a little bad news - an Apolytonian settler will build a new city in that exact spot next turn (assuming this delay doesn't last long). We apologize for the inconvenience. Stay in touch, MrWhereItsAt Consul of Apolyton

	27-10-2004 15:27									#286
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Nope I fell asleep at 9:30PM local last night, right after I put the kids to bed, and about the time I can usually CIV for a couple of hours so thanks for getting this out.

It will take me a few more days to readjust. I just hope this going to sleep at 930 and waking up at 4:15 doesn't last too long

	28-11-2004 11:46									#287
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quote: To the Apolotonians: Over the past several decades, our two peoples have been in an active state of war. During this time, your armies have been very successful. In fact, you have succeeded in driving our people from this land. You are able to have access to our land, including our former fur luxuries. Congratulations. There is little reason to continue this war. We do not desire to make war against you, and there is no chance of any further "war actions" between our two nations. We therefore humbly ask for a peace treaty between the great Apolotonian Empire and our small Elucidian kingdom. Sincerely, President of Elucida Micaelis Rex

Posted this in the correspondance thread.

IIRC, Togas sent peace, accepted, to CDG last turn. How do we repond to this message, if at all? I'd just send a brief message informing them of accepted peace.

	28-11-2004 17:28									#288
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Thats sounds good OCT_X, and unless we find the galleys, this IS what we want because then step two is to establish a embassy as Togas suggested.

Send em out a short and sweet reply. Lemme know if you need me to do it.

	29-11-2004 09:10									#289
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On second thought, we may also want to add a sentence or two explaining the consequences should CDG decide to settle on our continent, or the nearby isles...

	29-11-2004 21:33									#290
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Quite sportsmanlike of them to propose this.

	29-11-2004 21:48									#291
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Also Im a little concerned about accepting peace from CDG at this time because we still have a chance to eliminate them, PAL seems to think they have two galleys and one settler and are playing games with the naming of the galleys.

Also because of this rule:

quote: 3.7 Accepting a Peace Treaty from a Civ then immediately declaring war Description: A team at war with another can accept the latter's Peace Treaty, then declare war afterward in order to eliminate War Weariness from that team. This results in a huge advantage if the peace-seeking team is not aware of the trick. Definition: This can result in a team’s properly acquired War Weariness being shut off and the possibility for the other team to suffer from it should they redeclare war. Purpose: To prevent unfairly using the games mechanics to negate or reverse the effects of War Weariness, Verdict: Do not accept peace if your intention is to behave in a war-like manner, unless a determination by the game staff to fall within the rules of this ruleset dictates so. Any method to break war weariness in any such manner is a direct violation of this rule. Punishment Level: Once – Orange (2-10 Turns), Repeat Offense - Red (5-Expulsion)

That combined with whats going on in this thread make me think we need to wait. My feeling is this willfull offer to make peace is connected to this somehow and something doesn't smell right.

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...threadid=126020

If we have any hope of getting rid of those galleys and the CDG settler (assuming only one and since we basically dont have an intell ministry, Im relying on PAL's here) we should probably remain at war and keep those curraghs moving towards the ruins of CDG capitol site.

	30-11-2004 04:21									#292
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We would not be accepting peace just to remove WW or whatnot, we would really be agreeing to peace.

Our 2 move curraghs are no where near CDG's 4 move galleys. We are not going to kill them anytime soon. PAL might, but we won't.

Our happiness situation is aweful, we can't grow past 4, and if any WW sets in our already stunted GA growth will be in the toilet.

Let's make peace. If we are lucky enough to find CDG later on, we kill them and deal with the consequences. But we OFFERED peace to them, they did not offer to us, and we are not accepting it just to declare war to the ON THE SAME TURN.

The rule stated above does not apply.

--Togas

edit: AND ... it would be helpful if one of us makes peace with CDG so that we can establish an embassy (asuming they escape) so that we can tell they other where they are.

	30-11-2004 05:43									#293
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I agree with Togas on this one. We will keep on hunting, but every turn that goes by makes the chance that much less that we will catch them.

	30-11-2004 16:48									#294
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I told PAL at the embassy.

I still think the curaghs need to keep heading in that direction.

Just in case.

	02-12-2004 14:16									#295
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Am about to play the turn now - I will accept any peace they offer. We can always stab them in the front if their Galley(s) are sighted after the peace is made, and if we spot a city, well, we can direct PAL perhaps. CDG has done their best to discredit us so far, and since, as we have to remember, we committed to PAL and against CDG in this, an ELIMINATION game, anything within the rules goes.

As long as we don't make any commitments to CDG on the length of the peace, then we are just playing the game, and not even attempting to deceive them any more than we did before the war.

	02-12-2004 19:18									#296
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Sounds good to me, and I still say our two curraghs need to keep heading towards CDG.

Its a long shot but they may help and if they dont, one of them can just keep going and complete mapping the coastline on the NE pennisula.

	25-02-2005 07:25									#297
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Bump.

	31-03-2005 09:04									#298
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quote: To the Rulers of the Great Kingdom of Apolyton: Many years have passed since our war long ago. Since that time, little contact has existed between our peoples. You have undoubtably done well since this time, profiting the most for the war. The people of Elucidia have fervently stressed that we are a peaceful nation with no desire for war. We will hold true to this belief until the end. What has happened in the past is done, and, although it cannot be undone, it does not need to affect the future. As you may know, war has resumed between the People's Army of the Ladder and ourselves. This is due to the persistant harassment by PAL ships of war. We have even fled our new homes once again and their horses graze on land that we once farmed. Even so, we did not resume this war until our very survival was at stake. We have sunk one of their war Galleys and more will fall as well if we have to defend ourselves. This message is not here to scorn you for old hostilities, or even to talk about the events of PAL and ourselves. It is to talk about the future. Although the war in the past might have involved both Apolyton and PAL, this war is not a war against Apolyton. We wish, if you desire, to be able to consider you a friend once more. We realize that attitudes will not change over night, but let me be the first to offer the olive branch. Let's look to the future to end old hostilities, not create new ones. Sincerely, Louis XXIV Foreign Minister of Elucidia

I say we shake hands with them, but be honest about it. We tell them that we wish to be friends, but that we are also friends with PAL. We will gladly welcome members of their team into our team for the next game. We regret any hard feelings, as it was never our intention of creating any. If, by some miricle, they do make it to the next game, we welcome the opportunity to play with them.

	31-03-2005 10:17									#299
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I'm not entirely sure that's a good idea. As much as I hate to say it, we should check with PAL. They may want or need us to help in the pursuit of CDG.

That said, I think a better friendship would be a good idea. CDG would eventually make some kind of statement about our settlment of differences in the public forum, and this makes us look better in the next round, however slightly

	31-03-2005 17:26									#300
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I agree with both of you

I think we should tell them we have no hard about the them etc. But this game we are stuck with PAL and we can't help them in this war.