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LoneWolf
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Agathon- You forgot to mention that we were on the wrong side in WW1 and WW2.
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LoneWolf
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AH: See Agathon, apparently we ARE the losers. Hmm...
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LoneWolf
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AH, the light-hearted banter among friends and "allies".
Well, I'm off to bed now, safe in the knowledge that the heros across the great water have our best interests at heart.
Toodles!
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Tripledoc
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quote:
Originally posted by Ted Striker
Let's go into the stories about women dying from lack of medical care because there was nobody available to treat them.
The Taliban were so brilliant that:
1) Most women were barred from having job (including doctors)
2) Women were mostly forbidden to be seen by male doctors.
So, no women doctors, and male doctors not allowed to see them, what a brilliant setup. |
It is clear that during the civil war raging in Afghanistan prior to the US invasion there were numerous massacres of civilians and other human rights abuses by both sides - that would be the Taliban, and the Northern Alliance, especially those under the command of general Dostum. However, it strikes me as odd that the US state dept. would only point to the abuses of the Taliban. And not through it's own findings, but by refering to amongst others Human Rights Watch. See here
Now, when the civil war was offcially over, and a new government had been implaced, there seemed no longer to be the same concern over the continuing human rights abuses, so much more incomprehensible because the full fury of conflict has subsided. The Pashtun were thus maltreated, robbed, sexually abused and killed by the warlord bands. That is, the 'allies' of the US, who actually did the fighting, while the US provided aircover.
See here
So it seems to me that the lopsidedness in pointing towards only Taliban crimes during the civil the war, and the silence on human rights abuses after the war and the defeat of the Taliban, shows that the US is rather choosy in deciding what private human rights reports it wants to refer to in justifying various foreign policy adventures.
No doubt the Taliban was repressive, yet that repression is perhaps more understandable since the country was in the grip of civil war. The present ongoing human rights abuses by the warlords is perhaps less understandable since the civil war is over.
Taking that unfortunate lesson to heart, competing nations, will of course have to reconsider the veracity of The US offical aim, when it states it seeks to bring democracy and stability to the regions that fall within its sphere of influence. And thus adjust their foreign policy, and move away from taking any idealist presumptions on behalf of the US seriously.
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Arrian
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Kneel before Grog!
Jul 2001
time: 00:35
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quote:
Sorry guys, AH is right. I've spoken to veterans of WWII, Korea, Vietnam and GW1 and all of them complained that US soldiers are trigger happy.
I don't know what it is that causes it, but you have been notorious for years for shooting first and thinking later. |
Whether or not it's true, the stereotype sure is common. I've never been anywhere near the military, so I've no way of knowing.
My father served in the British Merchant Marine in WWII. As far as I know, he never had occasion to actually SEE any American "trigger happiness." Yet he always talks about how Americans are trigger happy.
When I asked him whether it was possible that the "friendly fire" incidents and whatnot might be the inevitable result of having a ridiculous amount of firepower, he had no real answer.
I have to wonder if the perception of American troops as trigger happy morons comes from the original performance of American troops in WWII (IIRC, they were really green and did quite poorly at first - Kasserine Pass, for instance), coupled with today's abundant firepower & extensive use of airpower.
But, like I said, I've no way of actually knowing. I'd suspect the same holds true for most Apolyton posters.
-Arrian
p.s. The only "trigger happiness" I can remember from my father's stories of WWII directly involved HIM and an AA-gun. They managed to strafe the deck of one of their own cruisers while trying to shoot down a Stuka (they had removed the safety guard that prevented the gun from tranversing in a full arc). Blasted trigger happy Brits!
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Apolyton Time is 00:35. |
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14-04-2004 11:13
@ that Patton quote LW.
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