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Togas
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California
Jun 2002
time: 21:35
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Brief Chat with F-P and Phan from PAL tonight:
quote:
Friedrich> heya Togas, please tell me you guys haven't played the save yet
Togas> nope
Togas> you need it back?
Friedrich> no
Friedrich> there's some "Current turn" stuff we need to chat about though
Togas> you free to begin chat now?
Friedrich> still roping others in
Friedrich> okay....
Friedrich> ::massages his temples::
Friedrich> Is there any chance we could get you guys to hold the save until tomorrow night?
Friedrich> and postpone the chat until then too?
Friedrich> Semi-off-the-record-but-I-don't-much-care
Friedrich> We just had a pretty significant falling out over here
Friedrich> we had our first chat with CDG (nothing to worry about for you guys) but people got pretty angry about how it went
Togas> what's the scoop?
Friedrich> what, with CDG?
Togas> and why hold onto the save?
Friedrich> untrained new diplomat really flailed
Friedrich> well
Friedrich> I suppose I could just ask tonight
Friedrich> we need writing this turn for sure
Friedrich> we can explain it away if CDG catches on though
Togas> we can send it to you. But can you tell us why you need it?
Friedrich> we're about to pop a hut and CDG's curragh can see it
Nuclear_Master> Don't huts give the cheapest techs?
Friedrich> we got bronze on turn 2 from a hut
Friedrich> so no. 
Friedrich> we're possibly researching maps or lit next, still debating
Friedrich> it would also make a few members a bit more comfortable, which would allow me to do something weird like sleep at night.
Togas> I was going to propose that we both get into some long term tech deals with CDG in order to give the impression of peaceful coexistance
Friedrich> You're already in one.
Togas> WE are.
* Phan has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
Phan> muahahaha
Friedrich> The strong and growing sentiment over at PAL is that we...hello Phan
Phan> bout time I got on
Phan> I can't reiterate how much I HATE mirc
Friedrich> ...we don't want to enter into any agreement with CDG that we would later reneg on
Togas> But if you want to settle tensions with CDG, one of the best ways to do it is to make big future tech exchanges
Friedrich> go figure, our honorable group is winning out in the debate
Friedrich> It sounds like - though the vote isn't complete yet, part of the reason I wanted to delay - that we're leaning towards "No agreements righ tnow, we just want to stay away from politicing" towards CDG
Nuclear_Master> Well, what if it was just a short agreement?
Nuclear_Master> That would be completed before the war?
Friedrich> the problem is they're not researching anything we'll benefit from
Friedrich> we're getting the techs from you they're doing now, and you'll have everything we give you
Friedrich> CDG is going to be tech-obsolete after the Republic deal concludes
Togas> In reality, yes
Friedrich> Code is their last useful contribution
Togas> However, CDG doesn't need to know that.
Friedrich> So we're going to just give CDG techs, then?
Togas> They need to think that they have a longterm future with PAL. Future tech deals and future exchanges to be made
Friedrich> there was some discussion as to whether or not to sign a NAP with them set to expire in 50 turns
Friedrich> but there's no tech agreement we can enter into with them that they can fulfill, really.
Friedrich> and to strike prior to the completion of that agreement makes us look bad, which apparently IS important to a large section of our populace.
Friedrich> though that vote isn't complete yet; hence the desire tto wait until tomorrow. heh
Togas> They can trade you writing and Mapmaking, but would you have something to give? AND would you really want to give them anything?
Friedrich> Exactly - we don't want to give them anything
Togas> I was just assuming that you guys would never give them the tech
Friedrich> the only techs we could give them would assist their defenses.
Togas> but that would require a certain amount of "dishonor"
Friedrich> Masonry, The Wheel
Friedrich> and I strongly suspect we're going to want to chase Maps next over here, though that's just my hunch
Togas> You can always promise to give Poly and Mysticism
Friedrich> ::Muse::
Togas> but work other techs in the mean time
Togas> Ultimately, it depends on what diplomatic FACE you want to give CDG. What you want to show to them during the next 40+ turns
Friedrich> as I said, vote ongoing.
Phan> Big dispute on that
Friedrich> huge, nasty, screaming, bloody dispute.
Friedrich> Some want to go with the route you're proposing "The tech treaty that never completes"
Phan> :raises hand:
Friedrich> Some want to pull a George Washington, and "remain clear of all politics"
Friedrich> ....and some want to scare the holy crap out of them and make them turtle into 2 cities.
Friedrich> ::massages his head::
Friedrich> Yes, I know how you feel about the last one.
Togas> In my experience, staying clear generally leads to people assuming the worst.
Phan> I'm very set against the last one
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* ChanServ sets mode: +o Octavian_X
Togas> the last one sound somewhat untenable
Friedrich> This is why I'd really like to step things back for a night and wait for some things to resolve.
Friedrich> But I must be honest with you, T...
Friedrich> The writing thing; it has been suggested that you're witholding it because APO is worried we might go after Philo ourselves.
Friedrich> We would certainly not do so, if that's a concern.
Togas> That's not our concern at all
Togas> On the writing thing, you can blame me for withholding it.
Friedrich> People are having a hard time buying that diplomatic concern about CDG is that important, I think.
Since we can explain it away a dozen ways, not the least of which is "we researched it ourselves."
Togas> My team is in a holy terror thinking that PAL hates us, and wants to give you guys Writing NOW 
Friedrich> ... honestly, there are some people a little grouchy, as you saw in that thread.
Friedrich> We DO NOT hate you.
Togas> I know
Friedrich> No one over here is planning on going off to CDG next week. :P
Friedrich> or any weird crap
Friedrich> We're just cranky - as Ladderites are wont to be - and so I'm being honest about it rather than letting it fester
Phan> The Interests of our Nation are with our Apolyton friends
Togas> But just to let you know, I had to beg and plead and scream at them to hold back on writing until I got a chance to convince you of my CDG deception idea
Friedrich> : :
Friedrich> Tell you what, this seems a fair exchange of concerns.
Phan> I like this Togas guy
Friedrich> Let's get back together tomorrow night; the poll will be over.
Friedrich> If it goes "Deceive CDG with longterm tech deal"
Togas> Cool. I'll watch my basketball game and we'll hang onto the save a bit longer
Friedrich> then yeah, we'll look into getting it from them, etc.
Togas> let me know. If you guys don't go for the deception, we'll send it this turn
Friedrich> If it goes "We want to stay clear of that for now" you lob us writing so I don't get another bloodbath
Friedrich> Good stuff.
* Togas nods
Friedrich> I feel a lot better now, and I think others will too.
Friedrich> alright, go catch yer game, and I'm gonna go do something weird like play Civ
Togas> LOL
Togas> nothing stranger than that
Friedrich> ::tips his hat::
Togas> tomorrow, same time?
Friedrich> uh
Friedrich> lil' earlier good or no?
Togas> I'll be on as soon as I get off work
Togas> which is generally around 5:30 Pacific
Phan> Speaking of work.... I gotta get going
Friedrich> eh, screw it
Friedrich> same time tomorr
Friedrich> 9 EST
Friedrich> really this time
Friedrich> hehe
Togas> good. see ya then
Friedrich> cool
Friedrich> oh, one other thing I forgot
Friedrich> the barbs to the NE are gone
Nuclear_Master> Did you battle them?
Friedrich> and Anthea is going to see a lot of PAL workers if you move north onto that mountain
Friedrich> We have one less set of unused manacles.
Friedrich> and a promoted Jav Thrower.
Friedrich> the way is clear...if a bit mucky for quite some ways
Friedrich> anyhow, just thought I'd throw that out. night.
Nuclear_Master> Night
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Togas
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California
Jun 2002
time: 21:35
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Chat with F-P and Phan in #c3c_isdg_embassy
quote:
Friedrich> Alright then..
Friedrich> The vote on behavior towards CDG is close enough to over to call it
Friedrich> 3/4 majority wishes to remain aloof from any tying deails with CDG
Togas> gotcha
Friedrich> sec
Lord_Phan> I lead the sane group but we're in the minority
Friedrich> Short version: No NDA, no tech treaty
Friedrich> but we will deal cordially/standoffish with them
Friedrich> basically hiding behind the "We're new to diplomacy so we're being careful so as to avoid getting screwed" defense
Togas> If asked by CDG, where did you get writing?
Friedrich> Two possibilities
Friedrich> 1) If when we pop the hut, it doesn't go barb
Friedrich> we say from the hut
Friedrich> 2) If the hut goes barb, we just researched it
Friedrich> We've already told CDG that we're "keeping our distance" from you all as well
Togas> gotcha, and we'll deny giving it to you
Friedrich> definitely
Friedrich> You guys are getting the same standoffish isolationism from us
Togas> we'll also feign ignorance about PAL diplomacy
Togas> exactly. Tell them that you guys are standoffish
Friedrich> "bunch of stupid MP bastards, just leave em alone and they'll leave us alone"
Friedrich> hehe
Togas> ok, in the future, when each of us gets a new tech, how should we handle it?
Lord_Phan> we're gonna be percieved as being erratic by CDG me thinks
Friedrich> ::is doing some mental math::
Friedrich> Okay, horseback is complete next turn for us
Friedrich> how long to math for you guys?
Togas> I'll find out ...
Friedrich> I'm wondering how many times we'll have to "hide" it
Togas> firing up civ now
Friedrich> before CDG completes their trade to you
Friedrich> and we can care less. heh
Friedrich> Do you think CDG will be sharp enough to catch the tech prices dropping?
Togas> I don't think they'll catch that
Togas> but they'd catch the fact that they can't trade techs when they get new ones
Friedrich> well, at some point they're going to figure it out
Friedrich> I figure as long as we get the Republic trade done in time
Togas> right now we're 15 turns to math, but that will go down with growth and the new city
Friedrich> that's probably part for the course
Friedrich> any idea on the eta to Code by them?
Lord_Phan> heh, two cities does not a tech master make
Togas> they'll get code sometime after we get math
Togas> that we know. But no projection on when.
Friedrich> ::Muse::
Friedrich> At some point, they're going to figure it out. That's a given.
Togas> will you guys want republic before the war?
Friedrich> Absolutely. Remember, we're lux-deprived up here.
Lord_Phan> Yes
Togas> they'll know for certain we gave you rep. we'll just have to tell them we made a sweet tech deal with you
Friedrich> Well, that's probably the point at which we can stop caring what they think as much
Togas> but that is what we do naturally...
Friedrich> honestly, I think they may already smell a rat or being playing like they smell one
Friedrich> there's a *VET* spear in Minnesota now.
Friedrich> they have a barracks built
Friedrich> they're already thinking defensive - they're worried about you.
Togas> perhaps. And they have 1/2 price barracks
Friedrich> ::Nod::
Togas> so it makes sense to toss 'em in early
Friedrich> There's no reason to scare them silly ahead of time, definitely
Togas> we're doing the same thing, just not for 1/2 price
Friedrich> But I think they already see the only way out is through you.
Friedrich> oh
Togas> good luck to them.
Togas> no iron vs hoplites?
Friedrich> We told you they know where we are, right?
Togas> yeah. they have a curraugh
Friedrich> well
Togas> in fact, they may have 2
Friedrich> ::cringe::
Friedrich> I sure hope not.
Friedrich> anyhow
Togas> we saw one on our west coast
Friedrich> yeah
Togas> where's the one you see
Togas> ?
Friedrich> west coast
Lord_Phan> same one
Togas> ah
Friedrich> just past your warrior actually
Friedrich> in the last 2-3 turns
Friedrich> It doesn't take a strategic genius on CDG
Friedrich> to look at the map and be very very worried
Friedrich> I think they may start turtling pretty hard quite soon
Togas> there's shallows and land to the east, is that an island or does your land curve down there?
Friedrich> checking map
Friedrich> we're sending two warriors down there
Friedrich> we don't know how far it goes
Togas> peninsula?
Friedrich> and it's quite mucky
Friedrich> yeah or subcontinent
Friedrich> depends on how far it goes
Togas> we're going to send a curraugh that way in 2 turns
Friedrich> through CDG's land?
Togas> give us a total picture of cdg's land
Togas> counter-clockwise around the continent
Lord_Phan> good good
Friedrich> that's going to make them leery too, I imagine
Togas> it'll pass on through and they'll forget it in 10 turns
Lord_Phan> Rules on map trading would that prohibit a verbal description that could be used by our cartographers to create a map?
Togas> I don't think so
Friedrich> okay
Friedrich> I realize this idea has a snowball's chance in hell
Friedrich> but I wanna run it by you
Friedrich> and ask you to ask your masses
Friedrich> even though it will undoubtedly get shot down.
Friedrich> Right now, we're finishing horseback in 1.
Friedrich> When we get writing from you...
Friedrich> it looks - very preliminarily - like we're heading for maps
Togas> good
Friedrich> we COULD step in and go for Code, and get that a lot sooner than CDG
Friedrich> you see our score - it's not inflated, we have that much research power.
Friedrich> We cut them out now and get Republic much sooner
Friedrich> they'll know what's going on, but they're already suspicious
Friedrich> the curragh won't help either, and it's only a difference of 15 turns before they see us with Republic and get panicky
Friedrich> I realize that's a treatybreak.
Togas> I'll propose it to my team and see what they think
Friedrich> But respectfully, you guys WERE suggesting we treatybreak.
Friedrich> I know APO will probably cringe at it
Togas> what I'm wondering is, what benefit would it give us?
Friedrich> but I think we could get Code quite fast, get Republic, and take a major tech lead
Friedrich> well, it gets us into Republic noticeably sooner
Friedrich> faster research, etc thereafter
Lord_Phan> faster to chivalry
Friedrich> let's face it - CDG can't touch you
Lord_Phan> and we may be facing a 2vs2 war after we finish CDG
Friedrich> and when we hit them, it doesn't matter what they do
Friedrich> they're dead.
Togas> here's what I'm thinking:
Friedrich> We need them gone ASAP to concentrate on getting ready for the other continent.
Togas> Right now, we can essentially use the 3 of us to research 3 different tech trees
Togas> and just not give CDG one of those trees
Togas> as a group, we move faster than GWT and BAT, assuming they cooperate
Lord_Phan> I like that plan, but it may not fly in PAL
Togas> I want to use CDG as much as possible and then utterly surprise and remove them neatly
Friedrich> thing is, we also have our GA staring us in the face
Togas> no prolonged war or seige
Friedrich> we don't want to spend it building troops
Friedrich> when the pyramids complete, we're not about to delay it.
Togas> how long until that completes?
Friedrich> approx 45 turns, give/take
Friedrich> hence our original 50 turn timetable
Lord_Phan> Agreed Togas, I have been an advocate of that, but our people assume we'll be presumed guilty of backstabbing if we are friendly to CDG and then suddenly switch to all out war
Friedrich> yes
Friedrich> that's the result of the vote today
Togas> you guys don't need to backstab at all
Lord_Phan> IF you have an idea as to how to do it without hurting our reputation....
Togas> you guys just stay distant, built up an army, and we secretly funnel you research
Lord_Phan> I see... so you do it all
Togas> and then we both hit with our stacks of doom and crush them in 5 turns
Lord_Phan> won't they be wiser to us though?
Togas> how so?
Friedrich> I think our estimates for total ETA of war are 6-7 turns depending on casualty rates, actually.
Friedrich> I suppose it's true that we won't backstab if we have no NAP and only trade techs.
Lord_Phan> If we are distant they could assume we're going after them, since Apolyton is distant to all who are not allied your tech deal may not relieve their fears
Friedrich> but the prevailing opinion at PAL is that it will be perceived that we are doing so.
Lord_Phan> What Fried said
Togas> ultimately, you guys will have to decide how you want to handle them.
Togas> but WE definately do not want to clue them in to our intentions
Lord_Phan> agreed
Friedrich> You really think you can pull off the deception even after the Republic trade?
Togas> and starting up a cold war before we have amassed our army is going to lead to more casualties on our side
Lord_Phan> If they are clued in I estimate they could go masonry build walls and line with archer/Spear combo, not a pleasant attacking proposition
Togas> I think it'll be hard to pull off a deception after republic
Friedrich> ::
Friedrich> ::muse::
Lord_Phan> We can strike at Republic...
Togas> we may just have to say "Hey, they offered us some tech and future tech and we did research it, so why not get some profit out of it?"
Lord_Phan> and NOT give it to them....
Togas> frankly, I think them being in republic helps us
Togas> so long as they continue their trend of slow growth and few cities
Friedrich> agreed.
Friedrich> Here's a final wrinkle.
Lord_Phan> 6 cities max I would think is Ideal
Lord_Phan> for them to have for a quick war
Friedrich> We figure we ought to tell you this so your head doesn't snap around when you see it
Friedrich> You have the game open, see the map?
Togas> yes
Friedrich> see those two ivory, that hill?
Friedrich> just north of them?
Togas> yes
Friedrich> you're going to see an escorted settler heading south soon
Friedrich> that's his destination
Togas> hmmm
Togas> why there?
Friedrich> couple reasons
Lord_Phan> snatch the ivory before they do, help you get zeus, and we get a lux
Friedrich> First- strategic
Togas> you guys will give us that city in the future?
Friedrich> yeah, that was the plan
Togas> ok
Friedrich> we plan on gathering horsemen there
Friedrich> and using it for lux purposes in the meantime
Friedrich> we plan on selling it as a trading link to CDG
Togas> a "trading link"
Togas>
Friedrich> bulldrek, obviously, but we think we can sell it
Friedrich> we want to have something to trade them.
Friedrich> but yes. tentatively, I suggested we give you that city and no one's *****ed
Friedrich> It IS beyond meeting mountain
Friedrich> and we realize that.
Friedrich> Hence the need to warn you. If you guys are really agitated, we can reconsider the move
Friedrich> we just want a place to base our military at
Togas> if we get it later on, we don't care
Friedrich> and something besides fur bikinis to keep the masses happy
Togas> we have no plans to build there any time until after the cdg war
Friedrich> do we still get the lux when we give it to you?
Friedrich> hehe
Togas> yeah
Friedrich> I don't imagine that'll be an issue
Togas> you guys will get the ivor
Togas> ivory
Friedrich> We respect the meeting mountain line for sure
Friedrich> so you guys still chasing Zeus?
Togas> cool. Just to let you know, we may come back to you to ask for reconsideration of the boundaries after we've done some mapping 
Friedrich> That's entirely fair.
Togas> my team still likes zeus a lot.
Friedrich> ::scratches his head::
Friedrich> Okee.
Lord_Phan> eta on zues?
Lord_Phan> zeus
Togas> keeps us safe and gives us free sheilds to disband once we don't need i
Togas> it anymore
Friedrich> betting they haven't started it yet.
Friedrich> if I know the APO mindset
Friedrich> : laces his money and makes his bet::
Togas> haven't started yet, still building the foundations
Friedrich> ZING!
Lord_Phan> heh
* Friedrich struts around a bit.
Lord_Phan> :hands over his $20 to Fried:
Friedrich> need a few more cities first
Friedrich> then one with some spiffy bonus tiles, maybe some hills
Friedrich> okay
Togas> a city we can set aside and ignore for 50 turns
Friedrich> Gee
Friedrich> Where have I said that before...
Friedrich> ::glances at his own boards::
Friedrich> hehe
Friedrich> okay, so you fire off writing to us, we'll send horseback right back, and then *probably* maps
Togas> maps is good
Friedrich> hey, where are you guys in land area?
Friedrich> we had a little surprise this turn
Togas> right now we're #4
Friedrich> hmm
Togas> but we do our tight-poly build style
Friedrich> Houston, we may have a problem...
Friedrich> and it surely ain't CDG.
Togas> ??
Friedrich> ::Cringe::
Lord_Phan> zie germans and french
Friedrich> yeah, no ****
Friedrich> one of them is exploding
Friedrich> it flickered once before
Friedrich> but we took it back that same turn
Togas> germans have 2nd highest score
Friedrich> Still, we've been solidly, totally #1 in everything else all along
Friedrich> I think whoever it is, they're building superwide
Friedrich> there's just no way they could be keeping up in genuine infrastructure growth
Togas> maybe the french. They're not as good as the germans
Friedrich> and they have a civ that lends itself to hyperexpansion quite nicely
Friedrich> I'd give my left ball to know how relations are between them
Friedrich> if there are any at all
Friedrich> okay, maybe the right one
Togas> we may not find out until the middle ages
but anyhow
Friedrich> yeah.
Friedrich> or maybe just pre-industrial, if the ocean is wide
Friedrich> ::grimace::
Togas> yuck
Friedrich> alright. I think our agenda is done... you guys got anything?
Togas> that's it for us
Friedrich> questions, comments, concerns, obersvations, pickup lines?
Togas> I'm going to get going on the save
Friedrich> k
Friedrich> ideally...
Togas> just drop email (or drop in) whenever you'd like to chat
Friedrich> we get writing from you, start maps, and send you mysticism in 2 turns.
Friedrich> ideally.
Friedrich> but I think we blew out all our hut luck early on. heh
Togas> cool. we're doing math then philosophy
Friedrich> ::Nod::
Friedrich> any idea on the 50 turn estimate?
Friedrich> and we should probably lock down that schedule soon, too
Togas> we need to
Friedrich> I'm guessing we're sub 50 to both of us in Republic now
Togas> just give us a turn and we'll be ready for it
Togas> we can get a sizeable force in less than 50, no problem
Friedrich> okay, cool
Togas> the more time, the more we build, that's all
Friedrich> eeesh. that's a thought.
Friedrich> ::Muse::
Friedrich> We're probably going to have some 20 turns in Republic, aren't we?
Friedrich> CDG is going to get prep time on a 50 turn timetable for sure.
Friedrich> Oh well. That's something for the diplomats to try and wave magic at, I suppose.
Togas> at this point, we should be talking about 40 turns
Friedrich> ::
Friedrich> Our MoI will cry
Friedrich> but that's alright
Lord_Phan> I gots to talk with our MoI then
Friedrich> I shouldn't be terribly surprised if we pull back on the Elephant City. Total complete conjecture, but possible.
Friedrich> anyhow. I must be off. Under 1 hour chat, amazing
Togas> we're all business here
Friedrich> heh
Friedrich> until next time, suh
Togas> catch you later
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Octavian X
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Probably buried under piles of Literature, Biology, or Government homework
Jan 2002
time: 23:35
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To CDG's MRex via CDG PM:
quote:
Micaelis Rex,
Strange as it may be, it would appear that Ambassador Vander has disappeared. So as not to disrupt our current need to talk while waiting for him, I'll go ahead and attempt to schedule something.
How does, say, 10PM US EDT work for you guys this week? I'd prefer a later day (Wed. or Thurs.) myself, but someone should be availabe from our side around that time all week. Our venue can be at our server, #c3c_isdg_embassy.
Until later,
~Octavian X
Consul of Apolytonia |
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Kloreep
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of the pillow
Jun 2002
time: 00:35
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Chatted with Micaelis Rex briefly.
quote:
[22:36] * Now talking in #c3c_isdg_embassy
[22:36] * Topic is 'The International Embassy of Apolyton'
[22:36] * Set by Octavian_X on Wed Apr 28 22:01:22
[22:37] [Kloreep] #apolyton?
[22:37] [E_T] Hmmm, he's in the other room.... was here
[22:37] [E_T] [23:38] * MRex has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[22:37] [E_T] [23:38] * MRex has left #c3c_isdg_embassy
[22:37] [E_T] [23:39] [E_T] Hi, I just got back home
[22:37] [E_T] [23:42] * Kloreep has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[22:37] [E_T] [23:43] [Kloreep] #apolyton?
[22:37] [E_T] isdgfamtalks
[22:38] [Kloreep] Ah
[22:38] [Kloreep] I need to set this channel on my perform
[22:41] [E_T] type /join #isdgfamtalks |
So I went to the other channel... (it's for the PTW ISDG)
quote:
[22:42] * Now talking in #isdgfamtalks
[22:42] [E_T] [23:43] [Kloreep] #apolyton?
[22:42] [Kloreep] Hi
[22:42] [MRex] hi
[22:43] [WhiteBandit] woohoo! real people to take over... enough bragging about my current living situation 
[22:43] * MasterZen has joined #isdgfamtalks
[22:43] * ChanServ sets mode: +o MasterZen
[22:43] [E_T] I leave you in their capable hands
[22:43] [MRex] 4 people here now, hopefully one of you won't forget to post the message
[22:44] [Kloreep] #c3c_isdg_embassy is the channel for the C3C ISDG, BTW
[22:44] [MRex] almost get the feeling you're avoiding us on purpose
[22:44] [MRex] i can go there, one sec
[22:44] [Kloreep] This one is PTW ISDG
[22:47] [E_T] he was there
[22:48] [MRex] yeah, i just usually come to this one because i'm more likely to find an active team member online here |
And the meat of the chat:
quote:
[22:44] * MRex has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[22:44] [MRex] ok
[22:45] [Kloreep] I'm finishing up a MZO DG save at the moment, but I'm chatting here too
[22:45] [Kloreep] Be done in a sec anyway
[22:46] [Kloreep] How's CDG doing?
[22:46] [MRex] as a said before you arrived, i chatted with Oct_X on tuesday to set up a CDG/Poly chat. he said he would post on your forum and get back to us. well, 6 days have gone by, and nothing. i come back here, and find out that nothing was posted after all...
[22:46] [MRex] other than that, we're doing well
[22:47] [Kloreep] Nothing?
[22:47] [Kloreep] I recall OctX sent you guys a message
[22:47] [Kloreep] Maybe it didn't get through
[22:47] [Kloreep] Let me check the correspondance thread
[22:47] [MRex] we haven't received anything
[22:48] [E_T] [23:50] [MRex] almost get the feeling you're avoiding us on purpose
[22:48] [Kloreep] He said he sent this to you via CDG PM:
[22:48] [Kloreep] Micaelis Rex,
[22:48] [Kloreep] Strange as it may be, it would appear that Ambassador Vander has disappeared. So as not to disrupt our current need to talk while waiting for him, I'll go ahead and attempt to schedule something.
[22:48] [Kloreep] How does, say, 10PM US EDT work for you guys this week? I'd prefer a later day (Wed. or Thurs.) myself, but someone should be availabe from our side around that time all week. Our venue can be at our server, #c3c_isdg_embassy.
[22:48] [Kloreep] Until later,
[22:48] [Kloreep] ~Octavian X
[22:48] [Kloreep] Consul of Apolytonia
[22:48] [E_T] shoot, it IS memorial day weekend....
[22:48] [Kloreep] Speaking of which, Vander does indeed seem to have disappeared
[22:48] [Kloreep] 
[22:49] [Kloreep] So if you sent him any messages in the past week or two, please doublecheck to see if we've gotten them
[22:49] [MRex] no, we stopped sending him stuff as soon as you stopped receiving from him whatever we were sending
[22:50] [Kloreep] So you didn't get that PM?
[22:51] [MRex] the message from oct never got to us, but i'll report it now on the forum. we can probably do tue or wed.
[22:51] [E_T] I've always said, in the other game, to send both PM's and E-mail, that way your more certain of getting the message to them
[22:52] [MRex] yeah, thats the main reason i come to the chatroom here every so often just to make sure everything is getting through
[22:53] [MRex] btw, who did donegal replace as consul?
[22:53] [Kloreep] He replaced con
[22:53] [Kloreep] (conmcb25)
[22:53] [E_T] Con is in Romania, hunting Vampires
[22:54] [E_T] actually on business, but that's what he says when he's able to get internet and post
[22:54] [MRex] heh, sounds better than going to the family gathering tomorrow
[22:56] [MRex] we'll send you a message tomorrow with a day and time for a chat. who exactly are we sending it to though?
[22:57] [Kloreep] Beta and the Consuls (Togas, OctavianX, Donegeal)
[22:58] [MRex] what are their email addresses?
[22:58] [MRex] or would PM work better for you?
[22:58] [Kloreep] I'm not sure if I have them all on hand...
[22:59] [Kloreep] PMs would probably all be best
[22:59] [MRex] ok, we'll PM over the poly boards to those 4 tomorrow sometime
[22:59] [MRex] i gotta run, nice talking
[22:59] [Kloreep] Though poly flood control will have earned itself your hatred by the time you send the same message to 4 people
[22:59] [MRex] lol
[22:59] [Kloreep] cya
[22:59] * MRex has left #c3c_isdg_embassy |
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Kloreep
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of the pillow
Jun 2002
time: 00:35
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Chat with CDG.
We were tripping over ourselves at certain points, but I think it went okay.
quote:
[17:44] * MRex has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[17:44] [MRex] hello everyone
[17:45] * MRex is now known as MRex|brb
[17:46] * MRex|brb is now known as MRex
[17:46] * Kloreep|away is now known as Kloreep
[17:46] [Kloreep] Hi
[17:47] [Nuclear_Master] Hello
[17:48] [MRex] We still got 9 minutes by my clock, not sure if anyone else on CDG is coming though.
[17:48] [Nuclear_Master] You want to wait then?
[17:48] [MRex] Sure, just in case
[17:49] [MRex] Got a big report due tomorrow, this will be a nice break.
[17:50] [MRex] So, how are you guys doing?
[17:52] [Nuclear_Master] We are doing great
[17:52] [Nuclear_Master] At least, I am
[17:53] [Kloreep] Poor Uber got hit in the chest by a barbarian
[17:53] [Kloreep] But I think he's feeling better now
[17:53] [Kloreep] He even went for a walk yesterday
[17:54] [Nuclear_Master] Damn those barbarians!
[17:54] [MRex] the nerve
[17:54] * Nuclear_Master shakes his fist
[17:55] [MRex] there's nothing like having a good day, and this is nothing like having a good day
[17:55] [MRex] almost done though, the end of the year stress is just climaxing right now
[17:56] [MRex] anyway, it's 7:00 now. let's begin
[17:57] [MRex] If you don't know me, I'm Micaelis Rex, the current President of Elucida. Dictator is probably more fitting, seeing as how people have this tendency to never post turn orders before the turn gets to us.
[17:59] [Kloreep] heh
[17:59] [Nuclear_Master]
[17:59] [MRex] First, how far away is Poly from Philosophy? You have to make sure that you don't get it before we can gift you CoL.
[18:00] [Kloreep] I'm not sure exactly...
[18:01] [Nuclear_Master] Neither am I
[18:01] [Nuclear_Master] I guess we will get back to you on that
[18:02] [Nuclear_Master] We are finding out now
[18:02] [Kloreep] I can get the save up in a minute
[18:02] [Kloreep] Forgot we had upgraded to 1.22...
[18:03] [MRex] OK
[18:03] [MRex] Yeah, it was about time we upgraded.
[18:03] [Nuclear_Master] I don't even have C3C. Stupid Mac
[18:03] [Kloreep] 26 turns currently, but we're at a low ebb in pop
[18:03] [MRex] Yep, next time get a PC.
[18:03] [Kloreep] That's sure to go up
[18:04] [Nuclear_Master] I am going to buy one soon
[18:04] [MRex] OK, looks like we'll be fine then.
[18:04] [MRex] As you know, the civ we play as is the Vikings (Scandinavians). As such, we have the seafaring trait, which allows our boats to move one square farther and not sink as often.
[18:04] [Kloreep] Yep
[18:04] [Nuclear_Master] Yes
[18:05] [MRex] Since neither you nor PAL posses this trait, we are the most likely civ to be able to reach the other continent.
[18:05] [Nuclear_Master] That may be true
[18:06] [MRex] We are considering enhancing our chances of this further by building the Great Lighthouse - we'd have 5 move galleys that don't sink often.
[18:06] [Nuclear_Master] And?
[18:07] [Kloreep] I'm not sure if there is an and
[18:08] [Kloreep] Or is there?
[18:08] [MRex] The question is, if we chose this route, would Apolyton consider working with us to get the Lighthouse? By this I mean not trying to build it yourselves.
[18:08] * Octavian_X has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[18:08] * ChanServ sets mode: +o Octavian_X
[18:09] [Kloreep] Hi OCt
[18:09] [Kloreep] CDG is thinking of building the Great Lighthouse
[18:09] [Kloreep] To complement their seafaring trait
[18:10] [Octavian_X] That doesn't sound like a bad idea.
[18:10] [MRex] Basically, if you look furthur down the road, we'll have our UU and super fast boats. We'll be able to quite easily launch an invasion across the seas. If APO helps us now, we will help you when we get this powerful combination later in the game.
[18:10] [Nuclear_Master] How long will it take you to build it?
[18:11] [Kloreep] There'll likely be competition...
[18:11] [MRex] If PAL comes on board with this, we can even consider launching a 3 way attack onto the other continent to claim a decisive victory.
[18:12] [MRex] Yes, competition is unavoidable from the other continent. But if we are assured we have your backing on this, we can pour more of our resources into it and get it before anyone else.
[18:14] [Nuclear_Master] Have you already talked to PAL about this?
[18:14] [MRex] Dedicating one city to a great wonder this early in the game is very risky, considering we'd have to give up all that production that could otherwise be spent on infrastructure/military/etc.
[18:14] [MRex] That is why your support is necessary
[18:15] [MRex] No, we have not proposed this plan to PAL yet.
[18:16] * godking has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[18:16] [godking] hello
[18:16] [Kloreep] Hi
[18:16] [Nuclear_Master] That sounds good to me, but I would still have to check with the rest of the 'Poly team
[18:16] [MRex] That's fine
[18:16] [godking] what up? I am downloading the 1.22 patch and it will still take an hour or so.
[18:17] [Kloreep] Ouch
[18:17] [godking] dial up
[18:17] [Kloreep] CDG is thinking of building the Great Lighthouse
[18:17] [MRex] yeah, get a cable modem
[18:17] [Octavian_X] I've got about three hours left on my patch download...
[18:17] [godking] I am buying a new house, and will be moving in 3 weeks....
[18:17] [MRex] It took me about 30 seconds
[18:18] [Nuclear_Master] I have ADSL
[18:18] [MRex] Anyway, I'll move on now if there aren't anymore questions...
[18:18] [Kloreep] Don't lord it over them, MRex
[18:18] [godking]
[18:18] [Octavian_X] heh
[18:19] * E_T raises his hand
[18:19] [Kloreep] Remember, they may be poor of bandwidth, but they have much in spirit!
[18:19] [Nuclear_Master] They do
[18:19] [MRex] Next, we have the issue of the current treaty. It states that you will gift us an additional tech if you have time to research one before going for Philo
[18:19] [E_T] MRex, let me ask you a hypothetical question, dealing with the Great Lighthouse
[18:19] [MRex] OK
[18:20] [E_T] Seeing as you figure that the only way to find the other 2 civ, is via Suicide or GL
[18:20] [E_T] and you go for the GL
[18:21] [E_T] because we have no contact with the others, what are you going to do, if they are already building it and beat you to it
[18:22] [MRex] First, they can't already be building it. Map Making is just too expensive of a tech, and if you've been following F11, you'll see that no one is generating that much research.
[18:23] [MRex] They would need Alpha, Writ, and then MM. And if they got Alpha and Writ so fast (which is impossible AFAIK) they would've gone for Philo
[18:23] [E_T] maybe they figure it's the only way they can find us
[18:23] [Nuclear_Master] Exactly. They may have the same thinking patterns
[18:24] [E_T] and they do a prebuild while researching it
[18:24] [MRex] Second, if we are assured that you are behind us on this, we can start prebuilding it before we get MM. By the time we get MM, we'll be able to switch to it, and pour enough of our resources into it to get it fairly quickly.
[18:25] [MRex] When it comes down to it, it is always possible that with an early prebuild someone will beat us. Likely? No. But possible? Yes. I think it is a risk worth taking.
[18:25] [E_T] so, what kind of time frame are we looking at?
[18:26] [Nuclear_Master] As I said, I think it's a good idea, but we still have to check with our team.
[18:26] [MRex] I'm sure you guys analyze the demographics more extensively that we do, can you shed some light on the production capabilities of the other two nations?
[18:26] [E_T] Sorry, I spend too much of my time in PTW ISDG...
[18:27] [Kloreep] Sorry, I don't think it's all that possible to estimate wonder-building capability...
[18:27] [Kloreep] You'd have to sort out individual city SPTs
[18:27] [Kloreep] Not really possible from the stats
[18:28] [MRex] Time frames are very hard to draw right now, but I'd say we can have MM in less than 40 turns, at which point we could have been working on something else for a while. Not sure exactly how long yet though.
[18:28] [E_T] all you can get is just some very fuzzy estimates, if even that
[18:29] [Kloreep] I'm not sure how you would get even fuzzy estimates... it's guessing cities and pops in the end
[18:29] [Kloreep] Anyway
[18:29] [MRex] Like I said before, alot of the timeframe depends on you.
[18:30] [Nuclear_Master] What's your next question?
[18:30] [E_T] well, it sounds good to me
[18:31] [MRex] OK. As I said somewhere above, there is the issue of our treaty and compensation for the extra work that we've done towards it.
[18:31] [MRex] Has Apolyton research any other techs that have not been gifted to CDG in order to stall for CoL?
[18:32] [Kloreep] Yeah, CB, which we should have sent you a while ago...
[18:32] [Kloreep] I noticed that slipped through the cracks
[18:32] [MRex] OK, I was wondering what happened.
[18:33] [MRex] So you can send that to us?
[18:33] [Kloreep] We should be sending it on this turn
[18:33] [MRex] Good
[18:33] [MRex] The final thing, we would like to propose a new trade deal
[18:33] [Nuclear_Master] Okay
[18:33] [Nuclear_Master] What is it?
[18:35] [MRex] As you know, we will need Map Making in order for the Lighthouse. We are seriously considering researching that following Code of Laws. After that we can research Liturature, the final tech in the middle bracket of the tech tree. In exchange for those two technologies, we would ask you to give us Mysticism, Horseback Riding, and Polytheism. In short, we give you the middle branch of the tech tree, you give us the bottom branch of th
[18:36] [MRex] You come out ahead on beakers 22-21 in case you were counting.
[18:38] [godking] just catching up.... interesting deal.
[18:39] [Kloreep] Sorry, some initial discussion in our channel about it.
[18:39] [MRex] NP, I hope it is positive chat.
[18:40] [Kloreep] Can't answer for the team of course, but it looks good to me at first glance; nice beaker balance
[18:41] [MRex] Glad you like it.
[18:42] [Kloreep] And I say that meaning the evenness, though it doesn't hurt the slant is toward us
[18:42] [godking] Sounds like a good deal. We will of course need to discuss things on a team basis.
[18:42] [MRex] Maybe one day you'll make up for it
[18:43] [godking]
[18:43] [MRex] Next thing, have you made any tech or any other kind of treaty with PAL?
[18:43] [Nuclear_Master] Limited trading as far as I know
[18:45] [MRex] I can say that we don't have anything with them yet, on the other hand, they did kick us off "their land" threatning to attack us if we didn't leave.
[18:46] [godking] Your kidding? Just what are they saying is "Their Land"?
[18:47] [Kloreep] Such friendly people
[18:47] [MRex] Their land is anything north of that chokepoint mountain
[18:47] [MRex] City borders are no where in sight
[18:47] [Nuclear_Master] Chokepoint mountain?
[18:48] [MRex] Not really sure how far you've explored yet
[18:48] [Nuclear_Master] I have a mac, remember?
[18:48] [godking] There has been some talk on our end about getting an agreement of borders, but it is early to talk formally. Your team have any interest in such a talk ?
[18:49] [MRex] Sure, we could talk about it. We don't have anything planned yet, it would take a couple days at the earliest to get some sort of proposal in order
[18:49] [Kloreep] I'm not sure we could get a proposal in order at this stage...
[18:49] [Kloreep] There's all that black out there
[18:50] [godking] OH. There is lots of time. It is just early talk now. Wanted to see if you were interested in discussing it is all at this time.
[18:50] * E_T is now known as E_T_AFK
[18:50] [Nuclear_Master] It was mostly unofficial
[18:50] [Nuclear_Master] As in, just discussion
[18:50] [MRex] Sure, discussion never hurt anyone
[18:52] [godking] Cool. Gotta go. Later.
[18:52] * godking has left #c3c_isdg_embassy
[18:52] [Nuclear_Master] Bye GK
[18:53] [MRex] we actually aren't even sure what all your terrain looks like
[18:55] [Nuclear_Master] Grassland, some plains, and desert at the end of our continent.
[18:56] [MRex] has poly talked at all about resource trading?
[18:57] [MRex] for example, we noticed you have wines (not sure how many though). we could trade you perhaps another lux for wines if you have extra
[18:57] [Nuclear_Master] I don't think we have
[18:58] [MRex] well ok. thought i'd throw that out there just in case
[18:58] [Nuclear_Master] We have some extra wines though
[18:59] [Nuclear_Master] What luxuries do you have?
[18:59] [MRex] well i'm sure you aren't in need of ivory
[18:59] [MRex] we have furs
[19:00] [Kloreep] Luxes are good...
[19:01] * Kloreep isn't used to playing on Emperor
[19:01] [Kloreep] Unhappiness is bad
[19:01] [Nuclear_Master] I'll post about it on 'Poly
[19:01] [MRex] yep, they keep the plebes happy
[19:01] [Nuclear_Master]
[19:01] [Nuclear_Master] Stupid civilians
[19:02] [Kloreep] Now now, NM
[19:02] [Kloreep] Treat them with love and care, and they can build some amazing little cities
[19:02] [MRex] thing is we would need a connecting road. not sure how long until we will be able to spare the labor for that.
[19:02] [Kloreep] That's what it said on the Civilian Farm packet we got, remember?
[19:02] [Nuclear_Master] Any rough estimate?
[19:03] [MRex] sorry, don't have any. i'd imagine sometime around when our cities borders meet
[19:03] [MRex] a few turns before that rather
[19:05] [MRex] btw, how far east do you plan to expand? it seems you're headed right towards us right now
[19:05] [Nuclear_Master] I'm not quite sure
[19:05] [Nuclear_Master] Klo, do you have any idea?
[19:06] [Kloreep] Next city is going even a little further east, I think
[19:06] [Kloreep] After that I have no idea
[19:06] [Kloreep] But I'll be sending some heads rolling if we don't get some irrigation up so we can settle more to the west
[19:06] [Kloreep] But I'm an anti-corruption freak
[19:07] [Octavian_X] hehe
[19:07] * Octavian_X has quit IRC (Quit: Octavian's presence brought to you by NoNameScript v 3.8.
http://www.nnscript.de/)
[19:08] [Nuclear_Master] Anything else?
[19:09] [MRex] no, i don't have anything. just get back to us when your team has decided about those couple things
[19:09] [Nuclear_Master] GL and tech deal?
[19:09] [MRex] yep, that's all for now
[19:09] [MRex] we can talk about the resource thing again at our next meeting
[19:09] [MRex] as well as borders
[19:10] [MRex] anyway, i'll get going then. nice talking to you all
[19:10] [MRex] oh, before i go, can someone send me a log?
[19:10] [MRex] you can email it to idg@cdgroup.org
[19:10] [Kloreep] Sure
[19:10] [MRex] thanks
[19:11] [Nuclear_Master] Bye
[19:11] [MRex] ok, i'll be going now. talk to you all later
[19:11] * MRex has left #c3c_isdg_embassy
[19:11] * Nuclear_Master has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving) |
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Inverse Icarus
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flying too low to the ground
May 2001
time: 00:35
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tell them to set their username as "apolyton". works for me
Please only post correspondence in the thread.
Last edited by Lord Nuclear on 21-06-2004 at 08:25
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Togas
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California
Jun 2002
time: 21:35
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chat at Gamespy
quote:
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> I am our current MoFR
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Alski is our Mow
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> :-P
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> you know hero correct?
[Togas> Not sure if I do
[Heroic_at_work> the MoI
[Togas> gotcha
[Heroic_at_work> been here at the other meetings just usually quite unless asked for something
[Heroic_at_work> er quiet that is
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Max is our MoIntelligense
[Togas> Nice
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> he needs to work on me cause i can't type
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> fried cant make it today - he has been held up
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> how long for your MoW to get finished?
[Heroic_at_work> he said he might be late but not to count on him
[Togas> no idea, I'm trying to help him get it figured out in another chat window
[Togas> he's on IRC right now, so I can ask him questions
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well here's is our current agenda for the evening :
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Current agenda:
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Estimated Apolyton Force capability @ turn 91, 96 and 101.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Estimated Pal Force capability @ turn 91, 96 and 101.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Estimated CDG Force Capabilty @ turn 91, 96 and 101
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Strategic Stikes- ie. They go in first and tear up some infrastructure as well as divert CDG defenses away from Minnesota. Also Possible come through their land and try to hit a non prepared city.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well there's some more but we'll get to that later
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> First of all have you guys been able to get an estimate of your forces you can have by turn 86?
[Togas> My MOI guy has given me some estimates, but he gave them for turn 90
[Heroic_at_work> we have esimtates fo our forces from 76-101 at 5 turn intervals
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok that's cool we can work with that
[Togas> I'm going to go check it out
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok
[Togas> but a major part of our problem is the distance to iron
[Togas> so most of our heavy forces arrive late or are upgrades
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well we were thinking about that
[Togas> our early forces are mostly 20sheild units, interchangable
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> It would be possible for us to also save you some money for your upgrades so that you will have more swords for the ready
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> thta will have to be discussed later naturally but is an option
[Togas> possible, yes. But don't sweat it. Upgrades are 60g each.
[Togas> We're going to try to upgrade @3
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> alright
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well roughly speakin Hero has made the calculations that at turn 86 cdg could have 16 spears defending 6 cities
[Togas> between turn 86 - 90 we have 4 sword builds
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> do you have horses accesable?
[Togas> yes
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> nice
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> how good of a map do you have of CDG's lands?
[Togas> we have most of their land mapped out
[Togas> just some areas to the east of their capital aren't mapped
[Togas> so we can keep track of their expansion
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok do you know how far east their coast goes?
[Togas> however, our curragh should finish mapping for us in 10 turns
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> nice
[Togas> if our estimates are right, not far at all
[Togas> we expect to have complete maps in @10 turns
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> if we wait til turn 90 or so to attack we will have roughly 30 horses ready to strike
[Togas> we'll have a mixed bag of units. Not quite 30. Probably 20ish
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> plus roughly that # 15 turns after the first strike
[Togas> however, we'll have enough heavy hitters to mow down a fortified position
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> so roughly then we'll be attackin with a combined force of 50 units on their 27
[Togas> it's highly doubtful they'll have anywhere near 27
[Togas> they recently asked us in chat if we'd agree not to compete with them for the Great Lighthouse
[Togas> we agreed to let them build it
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> very nice
[Togas> that will suck up the production of one city
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> less profuction into defense
[Heroic_at_work> :hmmmmmm:
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> hopeully capital ;-p
[[GC]Maxfin> only change to build it is their cap
[[GC]Maxfin> or do they have third city in south?
[Togas> at this point, yes, but they may found a new city and try to build it there
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok... well at this point... with you having a better view of their area how would you propse a coordinated assulat?
[Togas> to my knowlege, no new city, but I'm going to check the save right now to verify
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> we are leaning towards a combined hit after they recieve republic if and when they go into anarchy.
[Togas> ok, just checked the save. We only show 2 cities for CDG
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> ;-O
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> can you tell as of now do they have any resources hoooked up?
[Togas> we show that they have not roaded their horse
[Togas> and they have no iron
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> plus they can't see their horses correct
[[GC]Maxfin> how close they got their horse?
[Togas> in fact they have no knowledge of the wheel
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> k good
[Togas> the horse is 1-1-2 from minnesota
[[GC]Maxfin> thx
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> so not in their borders yet?
[Togas> not at all
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> nice
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> back to a previous question
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok... well at this point... with you having a better view of their area how would you propse a coordinated assulat?
[Togas> We'll propose one. However, I'd like to propose it more formally about 10-15 turns before we attack
[Togas> at that point the cities will all be lined up
[Togas> however, I can tell you this:
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> are you guys plannin on building to their borders?
[Togas> CDG also asked us about exchanging luxuries, and we volunteered to build the road
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> ;-P
[[GC]Maxfin> :P
[Togas> so we will most likely advance our SoD along that road to attack them
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> hehe
[Heroic_at_work> :-)
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> nice - easy fast route in
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well concerning resources
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we have found that we have 2 silks within reach
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> the sooner that we can connect our civs the soner that we can both enjoy the extra lux's
[Togas> we have 2 wine resources, 1 ivory, and CDG has a fur we'll steal
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> nice
[Togas> we'll exchange wines for silks, but not immediately. It'll depend on our faux trade deal with CDG and the road we plan to eventually build
[Heroic_at_work> with the cities being close and the trade road...is it likely that APO will be able to attack CDG without CDG even having a single turn to see em coming?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok noted
[Togas> they'll get 1 turn warning, most likely
[Heroic_at_work> k
[Togas> the turn we enter borders
[Godking_Rich> hello
[Heroic_at_work> :-)
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> hello
[Togas> GK = Domestic Guru
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well at this point we were thinkin at least a distraction from one side or the other would be wise
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Hello Godking
[Togas> You guys may want to rush inside their lines and go straight for their capital
[Godking_Rich> (drunk domestic dude - golf is good. golf is better when it is raining and you never leave the clubhouse)
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> lol
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> you think it will be feasible for us to get there without takin much damage to our army of horses?
[Togas> will depend on where they road
[Togas> we'll have to rexamine it before the attack
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> is their captial just se of minnesota?
[Togas> it is
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> actually that may be possible then
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we'll have to se about that
[Togas> for us, any attack after turn 90 is no problem at all
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we were thinking that it may also be wise for you to take your hops in there and tear up their infrastructure
[Togas> we're going to keep churning out units
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> spears don't move so well without roads
[Godking_Rich> We hope to take as much infrastructure as possible intact, so we don't have to rebuild it. Of course, resource tiles (horses) are likely pillage targets.
[Togas> we don't plan so much on a seige. My vision of this is that we catch them with their pants down and absolutely obliterate them with sheer force.
[[GC]Maxfin> so your plan is to do swordarmy not horseman army?
[Togas> right now it is. You'll have the horsearmy, we'll focus more on power (swords), which is why we have a delay ... need to link up iron
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> eta on iron hooked up?
[Togas> around turn 80
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> also
[Godking_Rich> roading now, and using a colony on the actual iron tile, turn 82
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> how many cities space does CDG have?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> room for 8 cities?
[Heroic_at_work> we project they could have up to 8 cities by turn 90
[Heroic_at_work> worried that if they dont have room it could mean mor resistance
[Heroic_at_work> if we wait til 90
[Togas> their current growth rate is pathetic
[Heroic_at_work> Pessimistic Estimate of CDG forces:
[Heroic_at_work> Turn
[Heroic_at_work> 76-----9+2+1 = 12 spears, 2 central cities, 3 border cities
[Heroic_at_work> (2.66 units per border city)
[Heroic_at_work> 81-----10+3+2+1 = 16 spears, 3 central cities 3 border cities
[[GC]Maxfin> do you know size of minnesota?
[Godking_Rich> 2 iirc
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> and their cap?
[[GC]Maxfin> so they got settler out
[[GC]Maxfin> lol cob
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS>
[Togas> Minn is 4 this past turn
[Togas> I have the save open.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> i guess i coulda fiigured that out no :P
[[GC]Maxfin> oh lol
[[GC]Maxfin> ok
[Togas> their cap is also size 4 last turn
[[GC]Maxfin> hmm can't be
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok well tehy had a warrior headed notrth we asked them to return south and they obliged.. so they have a very limited idea of what is north of them
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> if they just made a settler is is most likely headed your direction
[Heroic_at_work> SW or west at you
[Togas> wait a sec
[Togas> their capital is size 3 last turn
[Togas> I had a typo. sorry
[Heroic_at_work> no roads n of minnesota
[Godking_Rich> My guesss is that they are going for the horse area as their next city.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> but they don't know they have horses
[Togas> agreed. they have a road due west of their capital, right next to the horses
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok so let's start wrapping this up
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> atack scheduled for turn 90?
[Togas> let's say 92
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok
[Togas> give us 2 turns to set up
[Togas> GK, how does that sound?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> hopefully also while they are in anarchy
[Godking_Rich> Anarchy for us also.
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> although if theyhave a few pathetic cities will they reallychange to repub?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> maybe give them the idea of doin it early to get it out of the way
[Togas> we'll see. They're not the best civ players around
[Heroic_at_work> lol
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> if..
[Godking_Rich> once we gain republic, we trade to you. We wait 3-5 turns and we give to them? then when they are in archey we strike?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we see them go into anarchy before the 92 mark we may head in first
[Heroic_at_work> when do you predict that to be?
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> dont give it to them until ready?
[[GC]Maxfin> well it's in APO's hands when they will get rep
[Togas> we can delay a bit, but probably not too long
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> what was the projection on gaining republic for you guys?
[Togas> we'll have to see when we get it and what we can do to stall
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> what turn
[Godking_Rich> won't they see us go into anarchy? I forget how pbem works with the foreign ministers?
[Heroic_at_work> yes they will
[[GC]Maxfin> yeah they know if we change our gov
[Heroic_at_work> if they check
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> yeah f3 will show them if they are watching
[[GC]Maxfin> if' their intelligence check it out
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> so maybe you go into anarchy first and 'lead' them ;-p
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> i think it may be wise for us to not go into republic til they are dead
[Togas> mostly depends on GA factors.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> or until we know that we have enough units to use to finish them off with
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> we may also be in GA if we build pyramids about that time.
[Godking_Rich> we will be going into our GA with the hoplites. We don't want despotism, or anarchy, for our GA.
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> also would it be wise for you to enter anarchy if you may also get GA
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> ;-P
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> yeah this is true
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> i think alski made a valid point
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> you go into republic and lad them into it as well
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> lead
[Togas> right now we're trying to figure out when to enter Rep ... anarchy would throw back our plans several turns
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> ideally we would want it after the war - only way for you is to not send hoplites?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we are goin to have a window of oportunity here... we need to make sure that we don't miss it though
[Togas> let us know when you predict you'll finish the pyramids
[Togas> hopefully not before turn 92
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> aproxiately that time indeed
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> about turn 90 - but we can drag out to 101 i think?
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> heroic has the details ;-p
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> can you give us an estimate of when you will be gettin Republic?
[Godking_Rich> our plan calls for abandoning most of our normal internal growth to do the war. We are planning on using our GA to catch up.
[Togas> and having hoplites ... well, we're going to use them
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> yea
[Togas> they're too good not to
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> problem is two things here
[Kloreep> Finally got Arcade to work
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> you guys don't want to lose the beneifit of your ga natuarally and both of us don't want to lose this window for a clean kill
[Kloreep> Hi
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> hello Kloreep
[Heroic_at_work> You'll be ok espeically with so many of CDG's cities as spoils of war to be given to Apolyton.
[Togas> Kloreep = Deputy Consul
[Godking_Rich> We are researching at max right now. Math in 10 turns or so (growth factors not being counted). Then philosophy in about 20 (we will not research at our max so we can do upgrading). With philo comes republic free.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok so roughly another 30 turns?
[Heroic_at_work> wow that is soon
[Togas> so we're looking at rep around turn 80
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok that may work
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we'll crunch #'s on that
[Heroic_at_work> we should be prepared to attack as soon as CDg has repub in their hands
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> one other thing to address real quick
[Heroic_at_work> anarchy means no reinforcement of pop rushes
[Godking_Rich> we are happy to slow down a bit so we can do more upgrading
[Togas> the thing is, we cannot slow it down TOO much
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we have plans on you guys takin all of the cities down there that we take from cdg... we would also like to come down that isthmus to the elephants will that cause a rpboelm?
[Togas> we may miss philosophy and lose rep entirely
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> don't slow down your techs
[Heroic_at_work> how so?
[Togas> we have no problem with you guys building a temp city down there by the ivory, but it would only be a temp city ... not sure if it's worth it to you.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> one other thing to ask you
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we have maps shortly.. so will you we could get philosophy in 8 turns after that
[Godking_Rich> one thing we wanted to ask you - will you sell us one of our barb slaves so we can use him as our iron colony?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> so roughly it would be only 20 turns for us to get it
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> im sure we could accomodate that
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we'll "sell" it to you for 1 gold :P
[Togas> you could get it, but you wouldn't get republic until CDG finished Code of Laws
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> how long for that?
[Togas> and if you got it and we got it early, then cDG would get it early
[Godking_Rich> If we went all out on philo now, we can probably do it in about 10 turns. We want some cash though. Also, the idea is to make sure that CoL was researched first.
[Heroic_at_work> any estimates on CoL>?
[Togas> no estimate
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> little vague no?
[Godking_Rich> 20 turns. They are not being specific.
[Heroic_at_work>
[Godking_Rich> we have not pushed them about it either.
[Togas> we don't want it too soon anyhow
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> actually maybe pressin them on it would hinder their military somewhat as well though
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> dont want other continent to beat us to philo though ;-(
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> and the other continent is growing rapidly
[Togas> it's a risk we'll have to take, I suppose
[Togas> however, we can rush to philo and get it sooner than turn 80
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> can you press cdg on rushing CoL?
[Togas> sure
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> just think the faster we get you and us out of despo.. the faster we will be able to finsih them
[Godking_Rich> Do you think the other teams are going to try for philo? Use and CDG are the only two that start with alpha? It would be a hell of a gamble if they did try.
[Togas> our production won't be affected that much if we switch to rep early
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well
[Togas> in fact, we may not have the commerce base to afford a large army :/
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> considering there are two civs on a continent possibly rivaling our own they could very easily find enough tecsh to catch them up and work on philo before we expected
[Togas> we'll want to switch to it before GA, but not much sooner than that.
[Godking_Rich> What we gain in our ablity to use in the bonus tiles we loose by our loss of MP and our military upkeep costs.
[Togas> and we have few bonus tiles that are suffereing from the despotic penalty
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> well then gettin to your gov switch as early as possible will benefit you
[Togas> anyhow, I'm missing my basketball game ;(
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ya togas
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> ok well. i think we made some good grounds here
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> im missing my bed ;-p
[Togas> I think if we plan for turn 92, we'll be on track together
[Godking_Rich> why togas? Want to see the lakers loose again?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> Roughly speakin we're lookin for the 92 mark then
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> until the next time ;-p
[Togas> I'm looking forward to seeing them spank Detroit in their own house :P
[[[NoD]]Alski[UK]> goodnight
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> we'll see
[Godking_Rich> detroit 19. LA 14.
[Togas> :X
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> anyways was a pleasure meetin you guys. Look forward to future cahts
[Togas> anyhow ... gotta go watch it!
[{KC}CrudeDirk> have fun guys
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> talk to you later guys
[Togas> np. Perhaps we can lure you over to IRC next time, my mil guy wasn't able to get on tonight
[{B2C}House[PAL]_GS> later guys
[Togas> I'm going to idle and try to log the chat during commercials
[Togas> LATER!
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Togas
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California
Jun 2002
time: 21:35
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part 3
quote:
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> something is whacked with gs right now
[Kloreep> [20:50] [UberKruX> the room is loading
[Kloreep> [20:50] [UberKruX> i dont know why a room has to load
[Kloreep> [20:50] [UberKruX> but it is
[Kloreep> [20:50] [Octavian_X> restarting gamespy for the fifth time...
[Godking_Rich> sure. What do you want to know?
[[GC]Maxfin> does he got latest version?
[{KC}CrudeDirk> maybe a bad install
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> currently i am synchronizing this user room for the last 5 minutes
[Godking_Rich> we know everything. (or is that the alcohol?)
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> something is definitely amiss
[[GC]Maxfin> you see minnesotas pop all the time? right?
[Godking_Rich> ya.
[[GC]Maxfin> what kind of popgrowth it has had?
[[GC]Maxfin> any settlers out yet? we know their cap can't be their settlerfactory
[Kloreep> I don't think it's popped settlers yet
[Kloreep> I bet it's been on a granary
[[GC]Maxfin> yeah that has been my thoughts also
[Godking_Rich> decent. They have a cow avaiable IIRC. No settlers yet unless it is in this latest save.
[Kloreep> I don't recall exactly how fast it grows, but it does have a grass cattle that I believe they've already irrigated
[[GC]Maxfin> hmm
[[GC]Maxfin> 4 food for that city
[Kloreep> [20:53] [UberKruX> wtf, it loaded some "HOT STUFF" screen, and not the room
[[GC]Maxfin> lol
[[GC]Maxfin> is he clicking link for this userroom?
[Kloreep> Yeah, he clicked on my invite to here
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> good thing i just saveed that conversation before i got booted
[Kloreep> [20:54] [Kloreep> See if there's an X button on the side somewhere to close it
[Kloreep> [20:55] [UberKruX> there is no X
[Kloreep> [20:55] [UberKruX> your link led back to the gamespy page, i think
[[GC]Maxfin> does he have even option for userrooms?
[Kloreep> Can you guys send us a log?
[Godking_Rich> guys, we forgot to turn on the log. Can you email us one?
[Togas> I have log
[[GC]Maxfin> could you guys inform us with the save when minnesota's pop will sink or when they build cities? this would help us littlebit?
[[GC]Maxfin> we only see borders of it and city itself but not the popcount
[Godking_Rich> sure. Can do. We will also let you know if they get another city.
[Kloreep> [20:57] [UberKruX> yes. I'm browsing user rooms now
[[GC]Maxfin> thx
[Heroic_at_work> we have reason to beleive that CDG is going to try to place northern sentinels
[Heroic_at_work> it could help a lot if APO offered to place sentinels up there
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> instead of cdg
[Heroic_at_work> to help our horses slip by
[Heroic_at_work> unnoticed
[Kloreep> [20:59] [UberKruX> gamespy died on me
[Kloreep> [20:59] [UberKruX> fun stuff.
[Kloreep> [20:59] [UberKruX> loading again
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> lol
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> sounds like he's having a good time
[Kloreep> QUITE an earful ;p
[Heroic_at_work> perhpas the 2 warriors you have near us could be claimed as the sentinels
[Kloreep> Hmm
[Heroic_at_work> what is important is that CDSG has no knowlege of the road coming at them
[Heroic_at_work> or about the horses when they move into position
[Heroic_at_work> that will make for a powerful strike
[Kloreep> TBH, my first thought on that is they may want an official deal for screenshots or such
[Godking_Rich> Sure. One thing we are thinking is that if we warned them you were going after them just prior to the start of war, they will come to us begging for help and start moving their forces towards you. Then we can hit their underbelly. It is just an idea, one among many being discussed.
[Heroic_at_work> they cant can they by the rules? screenshots?
[Kloreep> True
[Kloreep> An official deal is my main concern
[Heroic_at_work> interesting
[Kloreep> As Poly's stance is not to break deals
[Heroic_at_work> not a big deal on the sentinels....just would be nice
[Godking_Rich> we can also send some of our own scouts in the area of your road, to hide that. We will discuss. Do you have the location of the road decided?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> meetin mountain
[Heroic_at_work> pretty much
[Kloreep> [21:02] [UberKruX> looks to be crashing again
[Heroic_at_work> heads right at the mountain and elephants
[Godking_Rich> OK. Lets us figure out what we can do.
[Heroic_at_work> we will have the mountain by the hill raoded in 3-4 turns
[Heroic_at_work> and will be curing on south
[Heroic_at_work> er sruising that is
[Heroic_at_work> doh....pardon the spelling
[Heroic_at_work> cruising
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> just don't go gettin yourselves in any deal with them that will compromise the assault
[Godking_Rich> no problem.
[Heroic_at_work> anyway tehse guys can give the details
[Heroic_at_work> i gotta get my brother from the airport
[Heroic_at_work> :-)
[Kloreep> [21:02] [UberKruX> must not have liked it when i clicked that star
[Kloreep> [21:03] [OctavianX> (it doesn't like it when you click anything)
[Kloreep> [21:03] [UberKruX> why the hell is it synching room data? i didn't tell it to do that
[Heroic_at_work> nice seeing you all
[Kloreep> See you
Heroic_at_work has exited GameSpy Arcade.
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> can he get into gs ?
[[ZIP]_Cobra-GS> into the conquest chat area?
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Kloreep
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of the pillow
Jun 2002
time: 00:35
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quote:
[22:23] * MRex has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[22:23] [MRex] hi
[22:27] [Kloreep] What's up?
[22:28] [MRex] it seems that poly has broken off relations with cdg again
[22:28] [Kloreep] I'm not a very FAM-oriented person...
[22:28] [Kloreep] I recall our last chat
[22:29] [Kloreep] We needed to get back to you on the GL?
[22:29] [MRex] from the chat that was held on or about june 1, we proposed a couple of things that poly was going to talk over and get back to us on. well, that was almost 3 weeks ago
[22:29] [MRex] yeah, that and the tech deal
[22:31] [Kloreep] Gak
[22:31] * Kloreep throws a granary at his team
[22:31] [MRex] this is like the 3rd time this has happened where a message didn't get through or nothing got back to us. to be honest, i'm really starting to wonder if it's intentional
[22:31] [Kloreep] TBH, we just have a horrible FAM department :/
[22:32] [MRex] was anything decided?
[22:33] [Kloreep] No, because no one brought up sending a message or chatting. 
[22:33] [Kloreep] There was some discussion, though
[22:33] [Kloreep] Favorable on the GL, tech trade, etc.
[22:33] [MRex] so what needs to be done before you're on board with us?
[22:34] [Kloreep] I think I just need to re-start the discussion and get polls going
[22:34] [MRex] every day you wait to decide is a day we can't start building a wonder...
[22:34] [Kloreep] I don't see why we'd have a problem with either, they both sound good
[22:37] [MRex] ok, please do whatever necessary to come to a decision soon.
[22:37] [MRex] how far away from philo are you now?
[22:38] [Kloreep] Let me get the save up
[22:39] [Kloreep] Assuming current research rate stands, which it should over time, 16 turns
[22:39] [Kloreep] What's your ETA on CoL?
[22:40] [MRex] somewhere in the vincinity of 15 turns. works out pretty well
[22:43] [MRex] the other thing that concerns cdg is how far east you have come with your cities
[22:44] [Kloreep] Hmm, 15 turns...
[22:44] [Kloreep] We may speed up, BTW
[22:44] [MRex] can we rest assured in knowing that you will not build any cities further east in the future?
[22:44] [Kloreep] I have no idea where exactly our commerce figure is headed
[22:44] [MRex] we may as well
[22:45] [Kloreep] So we'll need to coordinate that to make sure we don't get philo before you get CoL (let's hope poly's diplos do better on that than previous stuff )
[22:45] [MRex] let's hope
[22:46] [Kloreep] On the eastern settlement:
[22:46] [Kloreep] We're going for the ivory north and a little east of Aphrodite
[22:47] [MRex] where exactly do you intend to build?
[22:47] [Kloreep] After that we'll stop settling so far east and turn back north and west
[22:48] [Kloreep] I'm not sure on the exact spot...
[22:48] [Kloreep] Let me see if I can find something on taht
[22:50] [Kloreep] I can't find any decision on the exact site
[22:50] [Kloreep] settler's still in production
[22:50] [Kloreep] We'd like to have a flood plain or two in its radius for some extra food, but no exact site yet
[22:51] [MRex] we'll have to have a chat on borders sometime. but for now, I have to go. ttyl
[22:51] * MRex has left #c3c_isdg_embassy |
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Kloreep
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of the pillow
Jun 2002
time: 00:35
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The log. I suggest we pretend we're over or have been over our unit limit recently, driving up maintenance and forcing a reduction in research. Only way I can think of to explain it, and we are strong to CDG now.
quote:
[12:11] * MRex has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[12:11] [MRex] hi
[12:11] [Kloreep] Hi
[12:13] [MRex] i'm wondering, do you have an agreement to sell philo to PAL?
[12:13] [Kloreep] I don't think we have a tech sale with them
[12:14] [MRex] and did you trade them writing?
[12:14] [Kloreep] I don't think so
[12:15] [Kloreep] Let me check...
[12:15] [MRex] ok
[12:19] [Kloreep] I'm not finding anything about a writing trade
[12:20] [Kloreep] So it looks like we indeed didn't
[12:20] [MRex] hmm
[12:21] [MRex] somehow PAL got writing. if you didn't trade it i guess they researched it, as finding it in
a hut is a very low chance
[12:22] [Kloreep] Yeah, more expensive techs are fairly unlikely
[12:30] [MRex] PAL claims they are researching Philo
[12:30] [MRex] We just have to make sure we get it before they do
[12:30] [Kloreep] Yikes
[12:31] [Kloreep] Yeah, full speed ahead
[12:31] [MRex] To your knowledge, what is PALs GNP?
[12:32] [Kloreep] I'm not sure
[12:32] [Kloreep] TBH, we haven't been running any rigorous demographics analyses (sp?)
[12:33] [Kloreep] And if they were above us, which is where we'd need to worry, we might not be able to
find their GNP anyway
[12:34] [MRex] i'm looking back through the saves now to see what turn they got writing
[12:36] [MRex] they got writing in 1950BC
[12:37] [MRex] 7 turns ago
[12:37] * Krill has joined #c3c_isdg_embassy
[12:38] [MRex] is krill on poly?
[12:38] [Kloreep] Yep
[12:38] [MRex] ok
[12:39] [MRex] what do you think the chance is that they will beat us to it then?
[12:39] [Kloreep] I'm not sure...
[12:40] [MRex] if you maximized science, how long would it take you to get it?
[12:40] [Kloreep] I think our science is pretty much maximized
[12:41] [Kloreep] We're running a slight deficit, which is okay because barb camps have upped our treasury
[12:41] [MRex] so 16 turns?
[12:41] [Kloreep] Yeah, I think that's about right
[12:41] [Kloreep] But we are continuing to grow, so that should go down
[12:42] [MRex] what is your gnp? 16 turns sounds like an awful lot for a 6 cost tech...
[12:43] [MRex] i just realized that if we started it now it wouldn't take that long...
[12:46] [Kloreep] I'm not sure what our GNP is, I don't have the save up
[12:48] [MRex] i guess there isn't much point in optimizing on our end to get CoL a couple turns faster?
[12:49] [Kloreep] I'm not sure
[12:50] [Kloreep] We might be able to speed up, but I'll need to check on that
[12:50] [Kloreep] This does look bad...
[12:51] [MRex] can you post something in your forum and come up with a proposal for a solution?
[12:53] [MRex] cdg will hold on to the turn for a while until we can meet again to discuss this further.
[12:53] [Kloreep] Yeah, I'm going to post this
[12:54] [MRex] i've got a RL meeting to head off to, i'll drop in later tonight to see if anything has
changed. until then, ttyl
[12:54] [Kloreep] I need to go soon too anyway
[12:54] [Kloreep] Bye
[12:54] * MRex has left #c3c_isdg_embassy |
I am left with one question: Why the heck did PAL tell CDG they were going for Philo? What purpose does that serve?
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Togas
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California
Jun 2002
time: 21:35
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quote:
MRex> no problem. cdg is holding the isdg save right now, waiting to see how soon you can get philo so we can adjust accordingly
Togas> get code of laws ASAP
Togas> we're going to shift to 90 or 100 once we get the save
Togas> just need to see how much gold we have and hope for another barb camp or two
MRex> we may be able to tweek enough stuff to get CoL in 7-8 turns. can you adjust accordingly?
Togas> I can't say. I'm no good at making such projections.
Togas> All i know is that we're going to max it out
Togas> the most important thing is you guys getting CoL before we get PHilo
MRex> ok, we'll max it out and see what happens. what i'm wondering is how in hell did pal get ahold of writing
Togas> I dunno. What sucks is that I haven't been checking the diplo screen with PAL, either
Togas> so I'm not sure when they got it
MRex> yeah, i haven't either. loading up old saves, i see now they got it 7 turns ago
Togas> I'm going to ask Con to talk to them immediately
Togas> and tell them that we're already doing Philo and ask them to do something else
Togas> maybe we can work out a trade with them
MRex> if they researched writing, that means they're 7 turns into it, and could easily already have it or be getting it soon. i hope they found it in a hut and didn't start on philo immediatly
Togas> we'll try to find out
MRex> the other thing, if we find out they are getting it before we can, we should think about bringing them into the republic deal so we don't lose out. not sure if they'll go for it, but worth a try
Togas> perhaps
MRex> anyway, i gotta run. good luck with pal - i hope for the best for both our sakes
Togas> so do I
MRex> ttyl
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Togas
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California
Jun 2002
time: 21:35
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From FP:
quote:
Okay, I found out what happened.... ::Sigh::
The problem is we don't like hurting anyone's feelings around here, even if they're incomptent. Please keep this not "off the record" with your folks, but make sure it doesn't come back. It won't be posted in our message logs here.
Our Former Minister of Foreign Relations - The Dohr - is now the Ambassador to CDG. He was, frankly, a terrible minster who said too much rubbish off the cuff. He was warned pretty sharply when we gave him this job as an attempt to redeem himself... and well, he went off the cuff again. The current MOFR is probably going to can him over this incident. The guy's eager but has no biz in diplomacy.
I think your suggestion on how to deal with it is an excellent one. If something better comes up, you can send that and we'll be open to it. This might actually end up being a good way to cover how we got Philosophy, ironically, rather like one of TheDohr's other glib remarks, the one that may see CDG building the bloody lighthouse, the fools. Heh.
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24-05-2004 20:55
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