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Sava is offline Sava
King
GO GO GO!
Mar 2001
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 18:38
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John Kerry was the wrong choice... he sucks! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Sorry John Kerry fans. I want Bush gone. I thought the process of nomination the Democratic went through was a good way to find the absolute best candidate to take on Bush. At first, looking at Kerry's past, that he was a good choice. But it's apparant to me now that he will probably lose... even IF things keep getting worse.

Kerry's a bore just like Gore. He's a stiff who lacks charisma. The Bush smear machine is making mincemeat of him.

The Democrats should have chosen someone with charisma, or at the very least, a backbone to stand up against the baseless attacks. Bush has like $200 million he's going to spend. As Bill Maher said on Hardball recently, "a good enough television ad campaign could get people to eat paint."

And that's what is going to happen. Bush is going to pump out tons of propaganda ads attacking Kerry and the public will listen to them and vote Bush.

Kerry sucks. I'm still voting for the Democratic nominee because I want Bush gone, but I doubt it will make much difference. The polls on Bush, once dropping, are now rising in recent weeks despite a flurry of bad press for Bush... Iraq getting worse, Bob Woodward's revelations, sluggish economy... and Bush's numbers still rise.

-Jrabbit is offline -Jrabbit
Emperor
of the Electronic Egyptians
Feb 2002
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 18:45
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So what?

--The Bush machine would have it's boatload of cash to use against any nominee. The Dems have been pretty pathetic in fundraising. It would be sad if that was the key factor in the election, but not really surprising.
--The "smear campaign" would be used against any Dem nominee. Just as Kerry is trying to find factoids to use against Bush.
--Polls go up, polls go down. At this point in time 12 years ago, GHW Bush looked like a mortal lock to win.

Bottom line:

It's early. Don't panic.

SlowwHand is offline SlowwHand
King
of The Cooler
Sep 1999
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 18:52 Visit SlowwHand's homepage!
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Too bad you can't run, Sava.
You're such an intellectual stud-muffin.

rah is offline rah
Apolyton Prince of Moderators, Master of Reason
Lord of the Ferrets
Jan 1970
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 18:56
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Yeah, it's kind of funny. My wife Hates Bush, but she refuses to vote for Kerry. Too bad for the dems.

Edan is offline Edan
Chieftain

Dec 2002
time: 00:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:04
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Re: John Kerry was the wrong choice... he sucks! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote:
Originally posted by Sava
Bush has like $200 million he's going to spend. As Bill Maher said on Hardball recently, "a good enough television ad campaign could get people to eat paint."


While the commercials have been getting results, it's early days yets and (as of a couple of weeks ago):

quote:
The president raised a record $180 million, and half of that was budgeted for campaign operations, the other half for pre-convention advertising. But of the advertising budget, $90 million, the Bush campaign has already spent at least $40 million.

By comparison, John Kerry has spent about $10 million.



http://msnbc.msn.com/id/4751584/

Sava is offline Sava
King
GO GO GO!
Mar 2001
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:06
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quote:
Originally posted by rah
Yeah, it's kind of funny. My wife Hates Bush, but she refuses to vote for Kerry. Too bad for the dems.
Why's that? Imran, who is right of center, says he likes Kerry. What about Kerry does your wife not like?

J-Rabbit, you're probably right. But I'm a worrier.

Sloww: Someone like me would never win. I'm not going to lie, and I'm not going to tell people what they want to hear. To win a presidential election, you need to pander and you need the stupid vote (which is upwards of 75% of voters). Plus, one of my platforms would be ending the drug war. It's hard to win an election in America if your basically pro-drug, but anti-church... like me.

And I wouldn't blow sunshine up people's ass. Sorry. Cynics like me wouldn't win an election. Although, it would be entertaining to watch me go up against somebody like Bush. If he ran an ad saying, "Well, Sava is weak on defense." I'd rebut it with, "**** you douchebag, I'll nuke your ****ing ass and any ******* that ****s with America."

Alexander's Horse is offline Alexander's Horse
Deity
Panmunjon, hands up!
Jan 1970
time: 15:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:08 Visit Alexander's Horse's homepage!
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Suffering from ads?

quote:
Originally posted by rah
My wife Hates Bush, but she refuses to vote for Kerry.


Mrs Horse would understand that kind of logic

The diplomat is offline The diplomat
King
Terre Haute, IN USA
Sep 1999
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:11
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Increase the size of your Attachments

I told you so! The Dems should have followed my advice and gone with Edwards.

Sava is offline Sava
King
GO GO GO!
Mar 2001
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:17
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quote:
Originally posted by The diplomat
I told you so! The Dems should have followed my advice and gone with Edwards.


one of the rare times I will diplomat

rah is offline rah
Apolyton Prince of Moderators, Master of Reason
Lord of the Ferrets
Jan 1970
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Alexander's Horse


Mrs Horse would understand that kind of logic


yep, that about sums it up. My wife would have voted for almost anybody that wasn't Bush. ALMOST.

Ogie Oglethorpe is offline Ogie Oglethorpe
King
Marietta, GA
Dec 1999
time: 05:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:21
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I've heard the above tales of doom and gloom. Interesting the take is the same old same old. The Dem's didn't go far left enough.

When will either party actually nominate/run a centrist candidate?

Alexander's Horse is offline Alexander's Horse
Deity
Panmunjon, hands up!
Jan 1970
time: 15:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:22 Visit Alexander's Horse's homepage!
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In our system we have preferential voting so you don't have to like the candidate so much - you could put Kerry second last and he would still get your vote as long as you put Bush last.

That also makes party more important than personality, people vote for parties mainly though the leader does influence that choice more and more as our system becomes more "presidential" and media driven.

-Jrabbit is offline -Jrabbit
Emperor
of the Electronic Egyptians
Feb 2002
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:39
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Tired of ads?

Man. And I thought the US and our "electoral college" was a screwed up system...

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:41 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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Re: John Kerry was the wrong choice... he sucks! Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote:
Originally posted by Sava

Kerry's a bore just like Gore. He's a stiff who lacks charisma. The Bush smear machine is making mincemeat of him.


It's amazing how quickly some people lose memory of recent, historical events.

Have you forgotten how nearly successful and widely popular Gore's campaign was in 2000? A loser or a bore does not approach anywhere near that kind of success IMO.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:43
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Re: Re: John Kerry was the wrong choice... he sucks! Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote:
Originally posted by MrFun
Have you forgotten how nearly successful and widely popular Gore's campaign was in 2000?
Close only counts in horse shoes, grenades, & Tactical nuclear weapons.

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:45 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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Enter the AD-FREE zone

what??

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:46
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Enter the AD-FREE zone

Nearly successful is another way of saying I lost.

JohnT is offline JohnT

Emperor
Capitalist
Mar 1999
time: 00:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:47
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Re: Re: John Kerry was the wrong choice... he sucks! Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote:
Originally posted by MrFun


It's amazing how quickly some people lose memory of recent, historical events.

Have you forgotten how nearly successful and widely popular Gore's campaign was in 2000? A loser or a bore does not approach anywhere near that kind of success IMO.


Except, of course, for that boring loser, Al Gore.

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:47 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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I'm not arguing that Gore did not lose -- I'm arguing that if Gore really was a "loser" or a "bore" he would not have gained nearly as many votes.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:49
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quote:
Originally posted by MrFun
I'm not arguing that Gore did not lose -- I'm arguing that if Gore really was a "loser" or a "bore" he would not have gained nearly as many votes.
Except that he is a loser (Who's in the White House?) and he is boring.

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 19:50 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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Riiiiiiiiight -- nearly 50% of the voters found Gore appealing because he's a "loser" and he's "boring."

Bosh is offline Bosh
Emperor
Taehan Mingook
Jan 1970
time: 00:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:08
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Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

The URL says it all:

http://www.johnkerryisadouchebagbut...rhimanyway.com/

Great little website and I couldn't agree more with the basic sentiment.

Dauphin is offline Dauphin
Emperor
Caught in a tuna net
Jan 1970
time: 05:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:16
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quote:
Originally posted by -Jrabbit
Man. And I thought the US and our "electoral college" was a screwed up system...


Preferred vote isn't screwed up. You vote for who you want, if they don't get enough votes then your vote is transferred to your next choice. It eliminates the problem of detraction voting where a minor candidate takes away votes from a serious contender and vice versa.

Arrian is offline Arrian
Emperor
Kneel before Grog!
Jul 2001
time: 00:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:17
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I like that, actually.

-Arrian

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:41
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quote:
The Dems should have followed my advice and gone with Edwards.


Why so Bush could have 60% in the polls right now?

quote:
I'm arguing that if Gore really was a "loser" or a "bore" he would not have gained nearly as many votes.


He was the VP of a 2 term popular president. The fact that he actually lost shows how bad he was.

Dauphin is offline Dauphin
Emperor
Caught in a tuna net
Jan 1970
time: 05:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:42
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Got spare money?

And look who he lost to.

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:47 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui

He was the VP of a 2 term popular president. The fact that he actually lost shows how bad he was.


So you're saying that 50% of American voters are stupid for voting for a "bore" and a "loser?"

That's a LOT of stupid people.

Tiamat is offline Tiamat
Apolyton Legend
.....and George's daughter
Mar 2000
time: 05:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:53
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You know as much as people craped on Dean at least he wasn't afraid to be human. At least he had a personality and wasn't boring.

GePap is offline GePap
King
of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:53
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Lets remember boring old Gore, who was behind Bush for most of 2000 and in fact went ahead only in August after the Dem convention, and only for a short time.

And YET, he won the popular vote and barely, barely lost the whole thing. So saying a guy is boring like Gore when we remember really how Gore did and realize Bush now has, for good or ill, his own record to run with, counting Kerry out now is silly.

Edwards was an empty suit-great smile, tenacious- and a lightweight. I am sorry, but anyone who bases their pick for president on personality as opposed to susbtance will generally g for a "plain spoken" man like Bush anyway-that is what got him into the WH in the first place.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:35
  Old Post 29-04-2004 20:53
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quote:
So you're saying that 50% of American voters are stupid for voting for a "bore" and a "loser?"




You are such an idiot, you know that?

quote:
You know as much as people craped on Dean at least he wasn't afraid to be human. At least he had a personality and wasn't boring.


But he was a wackjob.

 
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