12-07-2004 05:49									#1
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Truly a great country.

quote: Mother, baby attacked on Paris train after mistaken for Jews By AFP VERSAILLES, France - A young woman and her baby were attacked in a suburban train near Paris on Saturday by unidentified men who drew swastikas on her stomach with a pen in what police said was an anti-Semitic assault. The six attackers who were armed with knives clipped the 23-year-old woman's hair, and cut her t-shirt and pants before drawing three swastikas on her body. The men of North African origin also overturned the pram with her baby of 13 months. In the attack they robbed her backpack which contained her identity papers, a bank card and 200 euros ($250). Police said the attackers erroneously assumed the woman was Jewish because she was living in Paris' posh 16th district. "Only Jews live in the 16th district," one of the men was quoted as having said. French President Jacques Chirac expressed his horror and condemned what he called "a shameful attack." The perpetrators must be found, held accountable and condemned with the full severity of the law, a statement issued by his office said. French Interior Minister Dominique de Villepin asked police to find the attackers within the shortest possible time, his ministry said in a statement. The attack was "all the more serious because it was marked by racism and anti-Semitism," he said.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/449966.html

	12-07-2004 05:56									#2
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As if this has anything to do with France? Racist

	12-07-2004 05:58									#3
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Don't we already have a thread for this?

Whoops, it was at the other forum, I hate it when one forum lags way behind another one like this.

	12-07-2004 05:59									#4
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Supercitizen deploy to France immediatley and take care of this

	12-07-2004 06:03									#5
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Right, looks like there are some wannabe nazi symphatizers. Well, according to my manual and the section of enemies, they do fit the description. I wonder if they're Algerian. I mean, the French pretty much dominated them and did nasty things to them, I now they pay it back by harrasing Jews? Doesn't make any sense... unless you're terrorist symphatizer. Which is my enemies too. It's double enemy basically.

	12-07-2004 13:39									#6
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Am I the only one who thinks it amusing to see an American condemning France because of the street violence in there?

	12-07-2004 13:43									#7
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This isn't street violence. A woman and her 13-month old child were attacked on a train, in the suburbs, just because someone thought they were Jews. That never happens in America (or pretty much every other Western country, for that matter).

And I didn't condemn France. I quite clearly gave them a thumbs-up and called it a "great country".

	12-07-2004 13:49									#8
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I don't see how this is much different from incidents that's happened in many other European countries. At least, they didn't kill her.

	12-07-2004 13:49									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten This isn't street violence. A woman and her 13-month old child were attacked on a train, in the suburbs, just because someone thought they were blacks. That never happens in America

Oh wait. Yes it does.

	12-07-2004 13:51									#10
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quote: I don't see how this is much different from incidents that's happened in many other European countries.

Are you serious? Women and children get attacked and branded with swastikas in other European countries?

quote: Oh wait. Yes it does.

I'm sure you'll have no trouble finding us an example, then.

edit: Ah, I just noticed that you misquoted me. Poor form, but the point still stands.

	12-07-2004 13:57									#11
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Last night the BBC World Service was reporting that there had been more anti-semitic attacks in France during the last six months then in all of last year.

I know that most of the attacker who are brutalizing Jews are not French instead they are Arabs who have come to France and who live in Arab speaking ghettos. These people do not want to learn French and to become Frenchmen instead they want France to become like North Africa. If you move to a new country then you have an obligation to learn that country's language and to try to fit in; that doesn't mean losing all of your original culture but it does mean the burden is on you.

BTW have any of you guys seen the way Jews and Westerners are portrayed in the Arab media? There are constent pictures of evil Jews with fangs and bloody claws for hands with westerners telling them to kill Arab children. We're talking about Nazi style propaganda. In any Western country these guys would be arrested for hate crimes and/or slander yet this type of behavior is A.O.K. in the Arab world.

	12-07-2004 13:59									#12
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I know not of similar crimes in USA, but they have their bunch of looney crooks.

My guess is, that the thing Drake was pointing out, was that crazy stuff does not happen only in USA. The loopeyness is a global phenomenon.

	12-07-2004 14:01									#13
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16th is not posh.

	12-07-2004 14:01									#14
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There's nothing loony about this. These men knew exactly what they were doing, ie. terrorizing a woman and her child simply because they were thought to be Jews. These guys are evil, not crazy.

	12-07-2004 14:04									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten That never happens in America (or pretty much every other Western country, for that matter).

Why, America is a paradise for everyone! There is no discrimination! No hate crimes!
If you see anyone attempting to commit thoughtcrimes by refuting this, please report them to your nearest Ameryan Patriotic Department

	12-07-2004 14:05									#16
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They didn't know what they were doing, since that woman was not a jew.
Okay, got your point. BTW, it is possible, that those guys may be declared 'looneys' (or what terms do you use) in the 'mental tests' done before the trial. If those mental tests are going to be done. (or what do you call those 'mental state of mind during the crime'-tests?)

	12-07-2004 14:07									#17
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How would you feel if they had done this to one of your wives, Tass? I doubt you'd be so flippant, in that case.

	12-07-2004 14:10									#18
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This doesn't have anything to do with French people, but with muslim extremists. They seem to breed extremely well in the suburban neighborhoods of French cities though. I wonder what could be a proper strategy against this ever increasing militant muslim anti-semitic terror in France.
Although I think the headscarf-ban is a dangerous error, you might think of it as a helpless effort to do anything against the trend to fanaticism in Franch muslim communities.
Don't get me wrong, it's an erroneous strategy IMHO to force people to laicité in public, i.e. on the surface, (It's just as erroneous as Israel's "defensive measures" or Bush's unilateral war course) while the problem lies somewhere else, deeper.

	12-07-2004 14:12									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten How would you feel if they had done this to one of your wives, Tass? I doubt you'd be so flippant, in that case.

True, but if it happend to my wife (singular) I wouldnt be saying "Oh, Russia is PLAGUED with Anti-semetism! ITs in a civil war!11 Run to the US, which has NO ANTISEEMTISM atall!111!". Idtry to to look at it objectively*

	12-07-2004 14:13									#20
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Gotcha...

	12-07-2004 14:15									#21
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Drake you should chill.

	12-07-2004 14:16									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten quote: I don't see how this is much different from incidents that's happened in many other European countries. Are you serious? Women and children get attacked and branded with swastikas in other European countries?

Well, I can't offhand think of an example of exactly that, but we've, for instance, had people murdered on the streets for no apparent reason than their skin colour.

	12-07-2004 14:19									#23
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Yes and again what does this have to do with France. As far as I see it, French played the part of victim only. You got Chirac condeming it, what do you want?

	12-07-2004 14:20									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Drake Tungsten Gotcha...

What? No witty retort?

	12-07-2004 14:21									#25
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Some real action on the issue? That new guy they appointed to deal with this wave of anti-Semitism is a good start, but they still seem to be downplaying the problem.

	12-07-2004 14:22									#26
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Downplaying the problem?

	12-07-2004 14:23									#27
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quote: What? No witty retort?

Why? I already reeled you in. Plus, I'm really not that witty...

quote: Downplaying the problem?

Chirac always trys to deflect criticism like many people on this thread have, by claiming that anti-Semitism in France is no more widespread and dangerous than hate crimes in other nations. That's BS and downplays the problem.

	12-07-2004 14:26									#28
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LC: *COUGH* Hitler *COUGH* Melsovic *COUGH*

	12-07-2004 14:28									#29
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cough cough KKK cough

	12-07-2004 14:30									#30
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Drake, what do you expect though.. he's the main commander. You don't want to express any kind of panic, besides, I haven't seen statistics, I know there have been attacks, mostly carried about by the same minority itself, however.. it's trickier than that I'd say, you got the president condemning like every action, that's pretty deep already. Say I get an ass kicking from other minority, it wouldn't even reach the local papers. Let alone president saying anything. And this is France, with a huge population. Also huge minority base.

So, I'd say it's better to downplay it to the public than overblow it. Who knows what he's up to, of course he says to the men working to him 'we need to make this stop'. And then saying 'it's not too bad' to the public, that's the way you do it. And I'm sure you understand... You do realize, that attacks happen, hate crimes happen everywhere in the world, against all minorities and majorities as well, just because the're what ever ethnicity or religion they are, right?