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Sprayber is offline Sprayber

Emperor
Dixie
Oct 2000
time: 23:24
  Old Post 11-09-2004 18:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Vince278

*Boldface above is mine.

Shocking reports just out of Russia. Regular army fleeing the scene? No coordinated leadership? Spetsnaz borrowing ammo from the locals? Largest single loss of Spetsnaz troops? It boggles the mind. I don't know what to say.


Saw this yesterday. I thought about posting it but I didn't want to be called a terrorist supporter.

Vince278 is offline Vince278
King

Dec 2002
time: 05:24
  Old Post 12-09-2004 08:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Sprayber
Saw this yesterday. I thought about posting it but I didn't want to be called a terrorist supporter.


I thought of that as well but I believe by bringing it out the Russians can learn from this and improve how they do things as we have done.

Ted Striker is offline Ted Striker
Emperor
United States of America
Jan 1970
time: 21:24
  Old Post 12-09-2004 13:07 Visit Ted Striker's homepage!
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Apparently the school attack has caused a rift between the "rebel" leaders in Chechnya

Vince278 is offline Vince278
King

Dec 2002
time: 05:24
  Old Post 12-09-2004 14:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Vince278
I thought of that as well but I believe by bringing it out the Russians can learn from this and improve how they do things as we have done.


There are reports now that the Russians are considering a color coded system, a Homeland Security department, and other post-9/11 reforms. I don't mind them benefiting from our experience as long as they learn from our mistakes and don't repeat them.

Dr Strangelove is offline Dr Strangelove
King
USA
Jan 1970
time: 00:24
  Old Post 12-09-2004 17:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Ted Striker
Apparently the school attack has caused a rift between the "rebel" leaders in Chechnya


Why do you say that?

Ted Striker is offline Ted Striker
Emperor
United States of America
Jan 1970
time: 21:24
  Old Post 13-09-2004 01:15 Visit Ted Striker's homepage!
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Just read some news reports. Not saying they are accurate. Sorry don't have a link.

Serb is offline Serb
Prince
Siberia, Communist party of Apolyton
Nov 2001
time: 11:24
  Old Post 13-09-2004 06:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Vince278




Perhaps it was just a gossip (about one of the terrorists who finished this school). I found this on one of the web sites, so I can't be really sure about this.

Serb is offline Serb
Prince
Siberia, Communist party of Apolyton
Nov 2001
time: 11:24
  Old Post 13-09-2004 07:02
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quote:
Originally posted by Vince278

*Boldface above is mine.

Shocking reports just out of Russia. Regular army fleeing the scene? No coordinated leadership? Spetsnaz borrowing ammo from the locals? Largest single loss of Spetsnaz troops? It boggles the mind. I don't know what to say.


The largest single loss of Spetsnaz troops- is correct, they never lost so many officers in a single operation, even when they stormed the palace of Amin in Afghanistan in 1979, iirc. In fact I beileve that 12 KIA in this operation is comparable to number of all their previous losses during entire their history (untill 1991, Alfa lost only 2 or 3 of their officers KIA, iirc). That because they often simply couldn't return fire, since terrorists were hididng anmong the kids and many paid with their own lives to save the children.
About the rest, you have to take into account that people who says this lost their loved ones and are very angry about that. They complain that there was no storm and as result so many died. In 2002, people who lost their loved ones in theater complained that there was storm and as result so many died. The part about Spetsnaz borrowing ammo from the locals is pure BS. From what I saw, Spetsnaz use very special weapons (actually, I was unable to indetify their rifles, but certanly they are not just simple AK), where the hell locals could find ammo for such rifles, they are even not allowed to have AK's bullets.
Regular army fleeing the scene? Don't know, I didn't see this, but I wasn't there, what I saw is that soldiers were carry the children away, but I indeed know that spetsnaz arrived 30 minutes after explosions, becuase they were in different part of the city practicing the storm in a building of similar type. Despite that leadership were saying that there will be no storm, spetsnaz have different tasks. Negotiators should negotiate, spetsnaz should prepare the rescue operation, so they found the similar building and start to prepare the rescue operation, just how they always do. It's another proof that it wasn't a planned storm and explosions were absolutely unexpected.
No leadership? I don't know. From what I know the head of FSB of North Ossetia was in charge of operation.

Vince278 is offline Vince278
King

Dec 2002
time: 05:24
  Old Post 13-09-2004 16:46
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The bravery of the Spetsnaz in this case still cannot be denied.

Dr Strangelove is offline Dr Strangelove
King
USA
Jan 1970
time: 00:24
  Old Post 13-09-2004 17:04
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Has there been a final count of the fatalities yet?

Serb is offline Serb
Prince
Siberia, Communist party of Apolyton
Nov 2001
time: 11:24
  Old Post 13-09-2004 17:51
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For Sept. 13 it's 338 people, among them 174 children. This number includes over 90 unidetified bodies (the identification requires more time for DNA analysis). Over 500 were injured, over 400 still in hospitals. 100-200 considering missed.
Doc, the boy from video tape survived, I've made a post about this in Chechen dilema thread.

 
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