17-10-2004 07:02									#61
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the fact, as the Candian example illustrates, is people in rural areas, don't want to be dictated how to live by city-folk. They like living like racist rednecks who hate homos.

My solution? revolution and form a seperate country

	17-10-2004 07:06									#62
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Yes, let's kick, Kansas, Montana, the Dakotas, etc. out of the country. That way we won't have to pay for their farm subsidies.

	17-10-2004 07:12									#63
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident Antartica is not a country

Who cares, it's "big" which apparently is something that's very important!

	17-10-2004 09:47									#64
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker Good! They're already overenfranchised!

	17-10-2004 09:48									#65
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Kansas, Dakotas, et al have far different concerns than we do on the east coast. why should we dictate their laws just because we outnumber them? they live completely differently than we do.

	17-10-2004 09:49									#66
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara So what? Why should people in rural areas have disproportionate say over the president? Cuz they're more spread out!?! Maybe we should apportion taxes disproportionately based on the EC. After all, greater representation should mean greater taxation.

Right . . . . . . .


because we all know that the urban electorate will have the best interests of the rural electorate at heart, if we could abolish the current system.

	17-10-2004 09:50									#67
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer Kansas, Dakotas, et al have far different concerns than we do on the east coast. why should we dictate their laws just because we outnumber them? they live completely differently than we do.

	17-10-2004 09:50									#68
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Uhhh, that's what state governments are for. All we're talking about is the Presidential election here, not an amendment from the evil NYC capitalists to burn and raze the countryside.

	17-10-2004 09:54									#69
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it's one of those balancing acts of a constitutional republic... yes you should have a democracy where the majority makes the decisions but there needs to be checks to ensure the rights of the minority. when you have a situation like america where you have a few million spread out over the west living a life-style completely foreign to the dozens of millions in the cities, their rights will be trampled upon if we have standard democratic representation. that just wouldn't be fair.

it's like in Pennsylvania, for example. Philly, Pittsburgh, Allentown, and one or two others (Scranton... i dont know... Erie) probably hold half the population of the state... like people say, there's Philly/Pittsburgh and then there's Pennsylvania. it would be wrong if us urbanites, off of our numbers, got statewide laws passed that harmed the agricultural industry out there.

	17-10-2004 09:56									#70
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The EC is the best deal going. It really does seem to work pretty well in both representing the majority of the people while protecting the interest of the several states. IIRC, only twice has it voted against the overall popular vote.

	17-10-2004 09:59									#71
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PLATO:

four times... 1824, 1876, 1888, and 2000...

3 of the four times, republicans were elected and the other time, it was a Whig

Republicans stealing elections

got 2 centuries of history

	17-10-2004 10:12									#72
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer PLATO: four times... 1824, 1876, 1888, and 2000... 3 of the four times, republicans were elected and the other time, it was a Whig Republicans stealing elections got 2 centuries of history

Actually 1824 was a Massachusetts Yankee stealing the election from a popular Tennessee boy...good 'ole Andy Jackson. In addition, in 1824 the EC did not elect the President...Congress did.

The 1876 vote totals were never really settled as allegations of democratic fraud and disenfranchisement of republican voters were never settled. An Electoral Commission was establised to decide the issue of disputed electoral votes where different results were certified.

1888 and 2000 are the only clear cases where the Electoral College itself overode the popular vote.

	17-10-2004 10:13									#73
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer it's one of those balancing acts of a constitutional republic... yes you should have a democracy where the majority makes the decisions but there needs to be checks to ensure the rights of the minority. when you have a situation like america where you have a few million spread out over the west living a life-style completely foreign to the dozens of millions in the cities, their rights will be trampled upon if we have standard democratic representation. that just wouldn't be fair. it's like in Pennsylvania, for example. Philly, Pittsburgh, Allentown, and one or two others (Scranton... i dont know... Erie) probably hold half the population of the state... like people say, there's Philly/Pittsburgh and then there's Pennsylvania. it would be wrong if us urbanites, off of our numbers, got statewide laws passed that harmed the agricultural industry out there.

We're talking about equal representation in the presidential election.

The electing of the president has nothing to do with taking care of "minority rights." All it does is give the Republicans free electoral votes since all of the states that have population less than their votes in the West are conservative.

	17-10-2004 10:14									#74
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the point is, Republicans have won every disputed election

	17-10-2004 10:16									#75
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quote: Originally posted by Trip The electing of the president has nothing to do with taking care of "minority rights."

While this is correct, it does have a lot to do with States Rights.

	17-10-2004 10:17									#76
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer the point is, Republicans have won every disputed election

Yes...they have a secret magical talisman they bring out at every disputed election.

	17-10-2004 10:21									#77
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quote: Originally posted by PLATO While this is correct, it does have a lot to do with States Rights.

And once again, the question arises - why should the distinction between states matter?

We already have the Senate. There's no reason to fudge the election for President when there's already a vehicle for all states to have equal representation.

	17-10-2004 10:22									#78
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo Yes, let's kick, Kansas, Montana, the Dakotas, etc. out of the country. That way we won't have to pay for their farm subsidies.

You ought not to discuss the idea of kicking States out of the Country considering where you are from.

	17-10-2004 10:25									#79
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quote: Originally posted by Trip And once again, the question arises - why should the distinction between states matter? We already have the Senate. There's no reason to fudge the election for President when there's already a vehicle for all states to have equal representation.

And why should the issues of the States only be vested in one branch of government? The name of this country remains The United States . The power of the State's has been diluted enough.

	17-10-2004 10:35									#80
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quote: Yes...they have a secret magical talisman they bring out at every disputed election.

what did you think the mason pyramid thing was about?

we'll be in good shape if this election gets disputed too.

	17-10-2004 10:36									#81
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Boo hoo. Maybe it's time for another civil war so Rhode Island and Idaho can be "free" of oppression, since they'd obviously so bad off if they didn't get free votes.

	17-10-2004 10:38									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Albert Speer what did you think the mason pyramid thing was about?

Being a Mason, I actually do know what the "pyramid thing" is all about.

However, that was still a good one!

	17-10-2004 10:39									#83
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quote: Originally posted by Trip Boo hoo. Maybe it's time for another civil war so Rhode Island and Idaho can be "free" of oppression, since they'd obviously so bad off if they didn't get free votes.

I actually would support Southern Seccession...then the rest of you can do whatever you want!

	17-10-2004 10:40									#84
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We run the place now. Why would we leave?

	17-10-2004 10:41									#85
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc We run the place now. Why would we leave?

Shh! They don't know that!

	17-10-2004 10:41									#86
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oh and for those who aren't as smart as me and Plato, i know this will go over yall heads... the mason pyramid thing appears on the dollar... thats the talisman they pull out... get it?

	17-10-2004 10:47									#87
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The actual name for the "pyramid thing" is the "All seeing Eye". It is quite funny that it would be the reference used when referring to the dollar as a means of corruption as it stands as the very symbol of why it shouldn't be.

On second thought Albert, you get two points for that one...not just one!

	17-10-2004 10:48									#88
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What do you think of the new Cage movie coming out National Treasure and all the Mason references?

	17-10-2004 10:51									#89
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc What do you think of the new Cage movie coming out National Treasure and all the Mason references?

Hmmm...didn't know about it. Is there any particular pretext it is taking?

	17-10-2004 10:51									#90
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see thats why they pay me the big bucks... got an IQ in the 140's and it shows

(sound of people sucking their teeth)