02-11-2004 20:53									#301
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quote: Originally posted by GePap In time, a month ahead of schedule, as opposed to being able to fill it out that day.

There are a whole slew of reasons as to why we have deadlines for registration, almost all of them deisgned to prevent fraud.

quote: By the way, did that woman not have the right to a provisional ballot, intituted in 2002, that would allow her to vote, but that would hold that vote up to scrutiny to see if it was actually valid? or an affidavit ballot?

I have no idea, I was in the doorway when she walked past.

	02-11-2004 20:53									#302
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quote: Originally posted by GePap You forgot: In time, a month ahead of schedule, as opposed to being able to fill it out that day. By the way, did that woman not have the right to a provisional ballot, intituted in 2002, that would allow her to vote, but that would hold that vote up to scrutiny to see if it was actually valid? or an affidavit ballot?

One of the OSU legal people on Election Law asked their polling person about how many provisional ballots had been needed so far.

The response was "what are you talking about?"

-Drachasor

	02-11-2004 20:55									#303
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quote: Originally posted by Harry Tuttle There are a whole slew of reasons as to why we have deadlines for registration, almost all of them deisgned to prevent fraud.

Which really should take no more than a week to figure out if they are alive and live where they live- again, we give people guns in less time than a month.

No, we just like making voting difficult.

	02-11-2004 21:01									#304
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quote: By the way, did that woman not have the right to a provisional ballot, intituted in 2002, that would allow her to vote, but that would hold that vote up to scrutiny to see if it was actually valid? or an affidavit ballot?

Probably, but the woman most likely stormed out and didn't accept getting a provisional ballot. That seems like what most of the callers who call up at my job would do.

	02-11-2004 21:01									#305
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I hope that after this election we implement a national voter registration system.

When you vote (showing your card or other I.D.) your name will be marked on a national database as having voted. Dead names and the like will be easier to clear off and residence issues will be less worrisome and easier to fix. One national database can do that.

We should really spend a few billion dollars or more to update all of our voting systems to a unified, electronic system that leaves a paper trail and additionally gives voters a receipt. A nice computerized system would be very easy to use (though tests should be done before such a thing is widely implemented to ensure ease of use).

-Drachasor

	02-11-2004 21:11									#306
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I dunno, it might be a decade before electronic machines are really accepted. Though an actual electronic database tying in residency would be good. But of course there's big brother again...

	02-11-2004 21:20									#307
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OH my God, Big Brother making it easier for people to depose those making up Big Brother- How Tyranical!

	02-11-2004 21:22									#308
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Hey, I support the idea. It's just there's going to be that obstacle.

	02-11-2004 21:26									#309
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I most other countries, when you become 18 you get n ID card given by the elections commission as your one ID.

	02-11-2004 21:34									#310
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This country has always rejected a national ID card and that's something which have been argued against by civil liberties groups (like the ACLU) for a long time.

	02-11-2004 21:40									#311
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And that is a stupid position.

	02-11-2004 21:41									#312
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You can't magically waive it away by saying it is a 'stupid position'.

Harry Tuttle is 100% right. If you want to live in a fantasy world, be my guest .

	02-11-2004 21:45									#313
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui This country has always rejected a national ID card and that's something which have been argued against by civil liberties groups (like the ACLU) for a long time.

What are the arguments against a national ID card?

	02-11-2004 21:46									#314
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Americans hate being catagorized and having the government know where they are, etc, etc. It's an anti-government belief.

	02-11-2004 21:49									#315
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Americans hate being catagorized and having the government know where they are, etc, etc. It's an anti-government belief.

Err, I son't unserstand where the problem is, provided all that info can only be found on the ID (and not in government archives). The government should only be here to provide an authoritative document that cannot be forged.

	02-11-2004 21:52									#316
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There's a flash on Zogby's site about watching Colorado, Florida, Virginia, and Pennsylvania. "There may be some big surprises!"

He must be looking at exit polls. Fun stuff!

	02-11-2004 21:53									#317
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I read a nice article about the US E-Voting machines in todays newspaper

Here is a summary.
1. The companies providing them do not give insight into their code
2. There were elections in texan canal county where 3 republican candidates won by exactly 18.181 votes each. There was no investigation. Coincidence?
3. One of the companies (SE&E) was once run by a former republican senator (Chuck Hagel) who has unexpectly won in the senate election in Nebraska (especially black people have voted for him, who normally would go democrat). The votes were counted by machines from SE&E. Coincidence 2?
4. In Georgia republicans had unexpected high increases in six elections. An investigation showed that Diebold (one of the E-Voting Machine Company) had done a Software update right before the election and nobody knew what this code was about.
5. An IT expert from Johns Hopkins University analyzed 49.000 lines of code which Diebold uses to control its machines and came to the conclusion that this was the work of amateurs and that encryption technology was misused. He only got hold of the code because an anonymous employee of Diebold had put it on the internet.


I don't know what you think, but private companies who do the counting of votes is not really my impression of a fair election. The code has to be open to all political parties involved for reviewing. There should be no unexpected software updates w/o another review period.

	02-11-2004 21:54									#318
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui Americans hate being catagorized and having the government know where they are, etc, etc. It's an anti-government belief.

How a national ID card could be bad when passports with biologic datas are good and storage of all your air travels over 50 years is good?

	02-11-2004 21:55									#319
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Only a small portion of people have passports in the US.

	02-11-2004 21:57									#320
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Good question

	02-11-2004 21:58									#321
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I think this election combined with the last one might be enough for voters to decide they want a national system, however. That is my hope.

-Drachasor

	02-11-2004 22:00									#322
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quote: Originally posted by DanS Only a small portion of people have passports in the US.

Therefore, air travellers are less equal than others, and foreigners are not equal at all !

	02-11-2004 22:08									#323
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People have to show IS all the time now- anyone who thinks the government already does not know everything about them based on your social security number is a dolt.

	02-11-2004 22:09									#324
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We don't have a private ballot here. They write down the number of the ballot next to our name where we sign. I am very sure I don't like this.

	02-11-2004 22:12									#325
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What a boring thread...

	02-11-2004 22:15									#326
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara We don't have a private ballot here. They write down the number of the ballot next to our name where we sign. I am very sure I don't like this.

Extremely shocking.

Explains why no more than 50% of the voters generally do participate in the elections.

	02-11-2004 22:17									#327
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quote: Explains why no more than 50% of the voters generally do participate in the elections.

	02-11-2004 22:18									#328
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I concur with DanS.

-Drachasor

	02-11-2004 22:18									#329
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quote: Originally posted by GePap I most other countries, when you become 18 you get n ID card given by the elections commission as your one ID.

We get one at birth. ( I think we get one at the age of six)

In a few months the new - completely computerised - one will come along. IIRC not bigger than a credit card.

	02-11-2004 22:21									#330
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quote: Originally posted by DAVOUT Explains why no more than 50% of the voters generally do participate in the elections.

Puting your name on a ballot is essential. You actually write your name on a tab of the ballot that is removed, by you, once the ballot is cast. At least, that is how it's done here in Chattanooga.